I don't think I could disagree more with you with respect to an amateur driver setting up his car. You combine loss of weight with HP gains and they're completely separate identities. No question your $11.5k triples or 4-way shocks would be beneficial, but the delta over good 2-ways is not nearly as great as the car's transformation after losing 150lbs from the top down (roof skin, all lexan, interior gut, and doors, etc.). This affects how the car handles, brakes, and yes accelerate. Better shocks would help him fine tune the car, but lightening, setup, and good coaching would take that $11.5 (plus labor) a hell of a lot further down this road.....

 

Agree with JR 100%.

 

Bingo!

Couple of friends have done DA on adjustables and have had quantifiable results... they also are the very best drivers in the club... not a coincidence.

BTW, if anybody has access to lap by lap timing info from F1, it would be easy (if boring) to calculate the impact of weight on performance...

We know the starting weight with full fuel, the burn rate, and the weight of the car with an empty tank... same driver, same tires, same track... only delta is weight.

 

Tire degradation is in there too.

 

True, and true for me as well.

Having sold more than half a million dollars of data acquisition equipment over the last few years to club-level drivers, VERY few of those buyers have taken the time, expense and trouble to install shock potentiometers to objectively measure what EXACTLY is going on.

An even smaller percentage (who have cars equipped with linear sensors for this purpose) bother to review the data or quantify exactly what is happening through the incredible range of adjustment most of these "super shocks" provide.

More importantly, few record or commit to memory a snapshot of histograms recorded when the car IS truly MAGIC, and the driver IS going really fast, so that they know WHERE and HOW to tune "back to that" when at different tracks or under different conditions.

This is not criticism, it's a fact! Most folks aren't interested in that granular a level of study. And that is ok!

I find few drivers at less than the pro level (and only some AT the pro level) that can cogently detail and accurately define improvements (or not) over small ranges of adjustment, especially where they aren't inadvertently compensating in their approach as a result.

That's why it's been very powerful and good to have this objective measure, from which you can calculate not only the action, but the reaction of the chassis and the driver, to these changes. By many different and additional measures beyond simply the behavior of the shock (excuse me, damper). Pitch, roll, roll lag. It's all influenced by the shocks.

Fascinating stuff, but there is a modicum of science involved...

That's why Kurt Roehrig was able to revolutionize the shock industry with his testing equipment. All of a sudden, it wasn't a "black art" anymore!

Neat guy, good science!

 

By this, do you mean "driving through" or "around" the changes and compensating for the differences?

 

Uh, yep! Especially at the pro level.

This is why the data is even more important AT the pro level...

 

You could drop a lot of weight out of a car with $11.5K ...

 

And then you get to the point where it's well over $150/lb and quit....

 

Could be true if you only managed to take 77 lbs out of the car for the $11.5K. I think it wouldn't be hard to do better than 77 lbs ...

 

well, what's your thought on this guys.

i run jrz pro double suspension. I asked my corner/alignment guy to setup the car neutral since i didnt have any reference.

i had some good results at Sebring. So, do i leave the setup like that or try different settings?

from reading your comments, i should play with the settings and check aim and etc,...

i understand that there is always room for improvement, but as a new club racer, where do you start?

my car handled well during the Sebring PCA race and I ended up with the lap record in my class.

im on the edge with changing all the setup and the next time i will be at sebring is next year only.

It will also be my first time at all the US tracks(except monticello)

 

Have you got a note book? You keep track of tire pressures, correct?

Do you have your Sebring settings written down, including canister pressures?

Did the car do anything at all at Sebring that you felt you would like to improve?

Do you have tire temp data?

Are you having fun?

Edit to add: Congratulations!!!

 

Blasphemy I tell you. Using aftermarket Getty's FRP parts I think the roof, hood, and doors were around $3.5k at retail and they will discount. All are easy to install (roof a little tougher) and just need some race paint. Those alone should save around 100 lbs. off OEM parts especially a sunroof car which most P-cars are. Figure $1.5k for install and paint if done professionally.

$750. for a Shields windshield installed with supports, another $250 for the rear from Home Depot installed and that arguably saves another 40 lbs.....

Hell that's only up to maybe $5.5k and you've conservatively removed at least 130 lbs.....

Now playing with the wiring harness can get expensive. I think probably around $3-4k from someone qualified. I've done that to both of my 996's saving approx. 70lbs. in wiring and the leather dash/gauge cluster. I put in all in a bucket and weighed the mess. You'll need a AIM dash or similar so budget another $2k for that....

Now we've almost spent the full $11.5k and lost at least 200 lbs.....

Before and after pics....

 

newbie answers, sry

 

Nice work car looks amazing!

I'm sure you guys have had to deal with BOP like we all have. 200lbs driven on the edge should be right around 5-7 tenths of a second on a 2 minute track...........

Very easy to back up with data. We were dealing with BOP adjustments in the 200lb range at JRZ in World Challenge over the last couple of years before they went to FIA Spec. 2006 GT, 2007 GT, 2011 GTS champs and second place in 2013.

-T.O.