Showtime went too far?
08-11-2014, 10:47 PM
#61
Burning Brakes
Doubling down:
savyboy - how's that idiot thing working out ? You good with it ? Gonna make a career of it ? You've had a hell of a start...maybe you can go "pro" !!!
PHT
(seeing if der Professor can get kicked off of rl)
savyboy - how's that idiot thing working out ? You good with it ? Gonna make a career of it ? You've had a hell of a start...maybe you can go "pro" !!!
PHT
(seeing if der Professor can get kicked off of rl)
08-12-2014, 08:29 AM
#64
Now boys, Senoir Savy has backed off, probably realizing his comments were unjust, or he has decided not to engage. No need to stir the pot. I would like to see a graph of dumb comments vs. alcohol intake....I know I have fallen victim to that!
08-12-2014, 12:18 PM
#65
Rennlist Member
+928 as to how these cars are steered: a combination of the steering wheel, throttle, plus downforce created by those giant sail panels. Assuming arguendo T-Stew indeed hit the throttle there, it's logical to assume he did so in an effort to avoid Ward; to steer the car out of the way. Tony is one of the most talented drivers in all of motorsports. His driving instincts are far superior to pretty much everyone else's. So if he thought hitting the throttle to turn the car would help avoid danger, I'm going to assume that's what happened.
As the #45 car crew member said, his driver swerved at the last minute, and Tony had even less time to react, following closely behind. Think of it like what happens when you're driving a little too close to the guy in front of you on the highway, and he swerves to avoid something in the road you can't see, leaving you not enough time to avoid it. 'Tis your penalty for following too closely that you now need a new front spoiler, or perhaps an oil pan. But Tony was on a race track under caution (and their "caution" mode looked to be way too high speed) where following closely is how the game is played. He simply did not have time to avoid Ward, especially given the conditions and sightline restrictions these cars have. Plus Ward was wearing all black.
Unless there was a lot of beating and banging leading up to this incident, Tony would be fired up racing, but not hopping-mad about what happened. He might even have felt bad if he made a mistake. But he didn't. He had the inside line and Ward pushed his own outside line too far, effectively taking away Tony's ability to continue his drift up the track. He may not even have known he'd hit Ward. So to assume that he formed the intent to kill Ward in the split-second upon seeing Ward was out of his car and charging at him like a bull is simply foolish. Ward did an incredibly stupid thing, and paid the ultimate price for it. This is not Tony's fault.
In case you can't tell, I am also an unfrozen caveman lawyer. I agree with my fellow cavemen that criminal charges are highly unlikely, unless far better video (i.e. inside T-Stew's car, with audio and telemetry) is available; if that existed, Tony would currently not be free to roam. The civil wrongful death suit is more likely, as previously mentioned, but also as previously mentioned, the contributory negligence and assumption of risk will obliterate any chance of recovery. That, of course, will not stop another caveman from taking this suit, should the family wish to pursue it, because some cavemen are indeed as dumb as you think they are. I have no idea how some of them passed the bar! It would be at best a nuisance suit to be settled for the cost of litigation.
And as far as the video supposedly showing T-Stew revving the throttle, 1) We're looking at cellphone video, on a dark, oiled, dirt track, from the other side of the track no less; not exactly HD quality, or even LD; 2) there's a bunch of other cars on the track, so how does anyone know it was Tony's throttle that revs? Especially given the issues posed by item #1.
So unless better video comes out, or Tony confesses, there will not be criminal charges.
Ultimately I feel really bad for Tony. Sure he's a hothead in the throws of competition, but he's one of the best racers of all time, and actually a genuinely nice guy. The community of professional racers is small, and it's simply impossible for me to believe that Tony intentionally killed Ward given the nature of their fraternity.
As the #45 car crew member said, his driver swerved at the last minute, and Tony had even less time to react, following closely behind. Think of it like what happens when you're driving a little too close to the guy in front of you on the highway, and he swerves to avoid something in the road you can't see, leaving you not enough time to avoid it. 'Tis your penalty for following too closely that you now need a new front spoiler, or perhaps an oil pan. But Tony was on a race track under caution (and their "caution" mode looked to be way too high speed) where following closely is how the game is played. He simply did not have time to avoid Ward, especially given the conditions and sightline restrictions these cars have. Plus Ward was wearing all black.
Unless there was a lot of beating and banging leading up to this incident, Tony would be fired up racing, but not hopping-mad about what happened. He might even have felt bad if he made a mistake. But he didn't. He had the inside line and Ward pushed his own outside line too far, effectively taking away Tony's ability to continue his drift up the track. He may not even have known he'd hit Ward. So to assume that he formed the intent to kill Ward in the split-second upon seeing Ward was out of his car and charging at him like a bull is simply foolish. Ward did an incredibly stupid thing, and paid the ultimate price for it. This is not Tony's fault.
In case you can't tell, I am also an unfrozen caveman lawyer. I agree with my fellow cavemen that criminal charges are highly unlikely, unless far better video (i.e. inside T-Stew's car, with audio and telemetry) is available; if that existed, Tony would currently not be free to roam. The civil wrongful death suit is more likely, as previously mentioned, but also as previously mentioned, the contributory negligence and assumption of risk will obliterate any chance of recovery. That, of course, will not stop another caveman from taking this suit, should the family wish to pursue it, because some cavemen are indeed as dumb as you think they are. I have no idea how some of them passed the bar! It would be at best a nuisance suit to be settled for the cost of litigation.
And as far as the video supposedly showing T-Stew revving the throttle, 1) We're looking at cellphone video, on a dark, oiled, dirt track, from the other side of the track no less; not exactly HD quality, or even LD; 2) there's a bunch of other cars on the track, so how does anyone know it was Tony's throttle that revs? Especially given the issues posed by item #1.
So unless better video comes out, or Tony confesses, there will not be criminal charges.
Ultimately I feel really bad for Tony. Sure he's a hothead in the throws of competition, but he's one of the best racers of all time, and actually a genuinely nice guy. The community of professional racers is small, and it's simply impossible for me to believe that Tony intentionally killed Ward given the nature of their fraternity.
08-12-2014, 12:30 PM
#66
Rennlist Member
I agree 100% with what courtshark has stated. I don't believe for even a second there was an once of intent and I think it's just internet drivel to consider it. I feel for TS that he'll live with this the rest of his life even though it was the actions of someone else who was responsible.
08-12-2014, 03:25 PM
#67
Spot on...
"You don't have to say anything. It's OK to sit there and be quiet."
http://www.racer.com/latest-stories/...helia-s-advice
"You don't have to say anything. It's OK to sit there and be quiet."
http://www.racer.com/latest-stories/...helia-s-advice
08-12-2014, 03:35 PM
#68
Rennlist Member
Valid points made in the article, Andre, but 1) this is a discussion forum and 2) I'd like to think that a good number of us here are making more than baseless assumptions and uninformed opinions, given that we actually drive fast cars fast (and some even practice law). The crap I've seen everywhere but here has been inline with the article's concerns. The discussion here has been far more informative. Ophelia would have dumped me in an instant. Probably 'cuz I could never stop singing that song if we dated...
08-14-2014, 08:50 PM
#69
Rennlist Member
I think this is fake...but if true: A damned shame:
http://empirenews.net/nascar-tony-st...peting-driver/
http://empirenews.net/nascar-tony-st...peting-driver/
08-21-2014, 04:19 PM
#74
Rennlist Member
IMSA just posted a new rule, maybe the same as a new NASCAR rule?
48.5.1. DISABLED CARS. During an Event, if a Car is involved in an incident and/or is stopped on or near the Racing surface and unable to continue to make forward progress, unless extenuating emergency conditions exist with the Car (i.e. fire, smoke in cockpit, etc.), the Driver should take the following steps as a Full Course Yellow is declared:
Communicate the condition of the Driver and Car to Officials where possible;
Shut off electrical power;
Do not loosen, disconnect or remove any Driver personal safety equipment until directed to do so by Officials;
After being directed to exit the Car, Driver should proceed as directed by Officials;
A Driver must not approach any portion of the Racing surface;
A Driver must not approach another moving vehicle.
48.5.2. DRIVER EGRESS. A Driver exiting a Car stopped in a location away from the Racing surface should first communicate the condition of the Driver and Car to Officials where possible, shut off electrical power, and only move directly to a protected location behind a wall, other barrier, or as directed, and must not approach the Racing surface or other moving vehicles.
48.5.1. DISABLED CARS. During an Event, if a Car is involved in an incident and/or is stopped on or near the Racing surface and unable to continue to make forward progress, unless extenuating emergency conditions exist with the Car (i.e. fire, smoke in cockpit, etc.), the Driver should take the following steps as a Full Course Yellow is declared:
Communicate the condition of the Driver and Car to Officials where possible;
Shut off electrical power;
Do not loosen, disconnect or remove any Driver personal safety equipment until directed to do so by Officials;
After being directed to exit the Car, Driver should proceed as directed by Officials;
A Driver must not approach any portion of the Racing surface;
A Driver must not approach another moving vehicle.
48.5.2. DRIVER EGRESS. A Driver exiting a Car stopped in a location away from the Racing surface should first communicate the condition of the Driver and Car to Officials where possible, shut off electrical power, and only move directly to a protected location behind a wall, other barrier, or as directed, and must not approach the Racing surface or other moving vehicles.
08-22-2014, 01:55 PM
#75
+928 as to how these cars are steered: a combination of the steering wheel, throttle, plus downforce created by those giant sail panels. Assuming arguendo T-Stew indeed hit the throttle there, it's logical to assume he did so in an effort to avoid Ward; to steer the car out of the way. Tony is one of the most talented drivers in all of motorsports. His driving instincts are far superior to pretty much everyone else's. So if he thought hitting the throttle to turn the car would help avoid danger, I'm going to assume that's what happened.
As the #45 car crew member said, his driver swerved at the last minute, and Tony had even less time to react, following closely behind. Think of it like what happens when you're driving a little too close to the guy in front of you on the highway, and he swerves to avoid something in the road you can't see, leaving you not enough time to avoid it. 'Tis your penalty for following too closely that you now need a new front spoiler, or perhaps an oil pan. But Tony was on a race track under caution (and their "caution" mode looked to be way too high speed) where following closely is how the game is played. He simply did not have time to avoid Ward, especially given the conditions and sightline restrictions these cars have. Plus Ward was wearing all black.
Unless there was a lot of beating and banging leading up to this incident, Tony would be fired up racing, but not hopping-mad about what happened. He might even have felt bad if he made a mistake. But he didn't. He had the inside line and Ward pushed his own outside line too far, effectively taking away Tony's ability to continue his drift up the track. He may not even have known he'd hit Ward. So to assume that he formed the intent to kill Ward in the split-second upon seeing Ward was out of his car and charging at him like a bull is simply foolish. Ward did an incredibly stupid thing, and paid the ultimate price for it. This is not Tony's fault.
In case you can't tell, I am also an unfrozen caveman lawyer. I agree with my fellow cavemen that criminal charges are highly unlikely, unless far better video (i.e. inside T-Stew's car, with audio and telemetry) is available; if that existed, Tony would currently not be free to roam. The civil wrongful death suit is more likely, as previously mentioned, but also as previously mentioned, the contributory negligence and assumption of risk will obliterate any chance of recovery. That, of course, will not stop another caveman from taking this suit, should the family wish to pursue it, because some cavemen are indeed as dumb as you think they are. I have no idea how some of them passed the bar! It would be at best a nuisance suit to be settled for the cost of litigation.
And as far as the video supposedly showing T-Stew revving the throttle, 1) We're looking at cellphone video, on a dark, oiled, dirt track, from the other side of the track no less; not exactly HD quality, or even LD; 2) there's a bunch of other cars on the track, so how does anyone know it was Tony's throttle that revs? Especially given the issues posed by item #1.
So unless better video comes out, or Tony confesses, there will not be criminal charges.
Ultimately I feel really bad for Tony. Sure he's a hothead in the throws of competition, but he's one of the best racers of all time, and actually a genuinely nice guy. The community of professional racers is small, and it's simply impossible for me to believe that Tony intentionally killed Ward given the nature of their fraternity.
As the #45 car crew member said, his driver swerved at the last minute, and Tony had even less time to react, following closely behind. Think of it like what happens when you're driving a little too close to the guy in front of you on the highway, and he swerves to avoid something in the road you can't see, leaving you not enough time to avoid it. 'Tis your penalty for following too closely that you now need a new front spoiler, or perhaps an oil pan. But Tony was on a race track under caution (and their "caution" mode looked to be way too high speed) where following closely is how the game is played. He simply did not have time to avoid Ward, especially given the conditions and sightline restrictions these cars have. Plus Ward was wearing all black.
Unless there was a lot of beating and banging leading up to this incident, Tony would be fired up racing, but not hopping-mad about what happened. He might even have felt bad if he made a mistake. But he didn't. He had the inside line and Ward pushed his own outside line too far, effectively taking away Tony's ability to continue his drift up the track. He may not even have known he'd hit Ward. So to assume that he formed the intent to kill Ward in the split-second upon seeing Ward was out of his car and charging at him like a bull is simply foolish. Ward did an incredibly stupid thing, and paid the ultimate price for it. This is not Tony's fault.
In case you can't tell, I am also an unfrozen caveman lawyer. I agree with my fellow cavemen that criminal charges are highly unlikely, unless far better video (i.e. inside T-Stew's car, with audio and telemetry) is available; if that existed, Tony would currently not be free to roam. The civil wrongful death suit is more likely, as previously mentioned, but also as previously mentioned, the contributory negligence and assumption of risk will obliterate any chance of recovery. That, of course, will not stop another caveman from taking this suit, should the family wish to pursue it, because some cavemen are indeed as dumb as you think they are. I have no idea how some of them passed the bar! It would be at best a nuisance suit to be settled for the cost of litigation.
And as far as the video supposedly showing T-Stew revving the throttle, 1) We're looking at cellphone video, on a dark, oiled, dirt track, from the other side of the track no less; not exactly HD quality, or even LD; 2) there's a bunch of other cars on the track, so how does anyone know it was Tony's throttle that revs? Especially given the issues posed by item #1.
So unless better video comes out, or Tony confesses, there will not be criminal charges.
Ultimately I feel really bad for Tony. Sure he's a hothead in the throws of competition, but he's one of the best racers of all time, and actually a genuinely nice guy. The community of professional racers is small, and it's simply impossible for me to believe that Tony intentionally killed Ward given the nature of their fraternity.
Man you must be a HUGE fan of a TS to make a statement like this He is a very talented racing driver, but finally his ego and his temper got him
Let's wait the results of investigation (IMHO it's clear and obvious), but I wouldn't be surprised if France family (NASCRAP) will get him off the hook...
lipamax
lipamax