winders

Actually? Yes, it is possible to damage the shell or EPS liner when dropping a helmet. Is it likely? No. If I dropped my helmet from 5' or more on to a hard surface like concrete, I would send my helmet in to be inspected. Then again, my head is important to me. Your head may not matter as much to you.....

Scott

winders

Helmets matter......

Scott

jdistefa

Yargk

A not so hypothetical situation: One has a Snell 2000 helmet that they've only used 20 times for DE and one is pretty careful with his or her equipment and honestly knows where it's been exactly for the last 12 years. It's never been stored near chemicals and actually has been picked up and set down pretty gingerly, let alone not dropped. So what's safer? That helmet and a shiny new HANS, or a new 2010 snell helmet. Reasonably similar cost....

kurt M

False logic. ^ I am not saying helmets don't matter I am saying good people are spending too much time on aspects that are small but easy to do and feel good about and not enough on aspects that are not small or as easy.

BTW. I don't want something intended to protect my head in a 60G impact to have the EPS system be able to be damaged when the outer shell takes a 0.5 G impact. I call BS on any impact liner ever being damaged or functionally be degraded after being simply dropped on the ground in a paddock. They are not made out of cellphone screen glass. Do you know of a single case of a DE or CR helmet failure due to a preexisting condition? I don’t but there might be some and if so i would like to know too. I do know of brake and cooling system failures that have caused helmets to be needed.

Why no follow through comment on checking if the helmets even fit? I hopped into the right seat of a student car and looked at what would be best described as a white mushroom in the left seat. My student’s small lady like head, and a good portion of her neck, was swimming around somewhere inside her hubby's large helmet. The helmet had a nice fresh tech sticker on it so it was safe but it sure did not come even close to fitting the occupant. I don't know of any group that checks to see if the helmet fits the intended user. I chatted with my student, went over the log book, previous experence, set the day's goals and the like, went over the car and seating system, saw a nearly new helmet and golves in the pass seat and made a date for the false grid after everything looked and sounded good.. Only on the grid did I note a problem that had slipped through the checks. Here is a place where someone might increase helmet safety via some printed words. Add in a requirement for the helmet to fit.


Unless someone can come up with any reasons to further inspect otherwise visually intact helmets other than the people that make them say something "might" or "may" cause a problem without offering up any data I am done beating the horse.

winders

Personally? I would pick the older helmet with the Hans device every time.

But no organization is going to let your on the track with a SA2000 helmet, Hans Device or not. But come on. You have a Hans Device which means you have a 6-point harness...which means you have a race seat which means you have at least a roll bar. Get a newer helmet for crying out loud.....

Scott

Scott

winders

Kurt,

As an ex-motorcycle racer whose helmet has hit the pavement many times, I am acutely aware of how important helmet fit is. It's also the reason I am concerned about helmet impacts and the damage that can be done to the EPS liner.

Helmet fit is a big deal. I have seen too many people with helmets on that can be spun on their heads. Here is great video:


I am not worried about dropping the helmet from 3 feet. Without your head in the helmet nothing is going to happen except some paint damage. In fact, here is a video that supports that:


I am more worried about what happens when you drop a helmet from higher and the shell deforms and crushes the EPS liner. Drops from 3 feet or so don't seem to do that but I have seen a drop from 5 feet compress the EPS liner at the point of the impact. Is a drop from 5 feet a big deal? Maybe not. I don't suggest replacing that helmet. I suggesting getting it checked out by the manufacturer.

Finally, I have not suggested that the other issues you are worried about should not gain more emphasis. I am against reducing the emphasis on helmets.

Scott

multi21

As the "official helmet checker since 2005" you should stick with what the PCA rules state and not go off on your own crusade. There are several lawyers and insurance companies that review these things for a living and have a lot at stake. You open yourself up to liabilty and just plain harassment if you think you can determine what you think to be a scratched helmet. What qualifications do you have to make a determination that such a helmet is safe or not safe? What is your training or credentials?

No offense, but it's people with their own agendas on what they think is safe for everyone else that are making these events less and less fun to attend. PCA seems to be a safe harbor for such indivduals for whatever reason.

Mike Andrews

I've read most of the posts on this thread and while logic tells me to stay out of it, it's a hot topic for me.

One, because I'm a cheap bastard and don't want to replace a $700 helmet every ten years. Two, because it's the OP wanting to increase requirements when not needed. This happens in all forms of activities when someone feels they are better suited to make a decision for others. Or trying to cover themselves legally.

In the years doing this I've seen a few serious (with injuries) incidents. None of those injuries resulted from head trama. Rather they resulted from neck injuries due to the weight of the head and helmet. Would these have been minimized without the weight of the helmet? Who knows.....

I'd also like to suggest that in a street driven car (without a roll cage) that has air bags (front and side) what value does a helemt provide? Does the added weight increase the safety margin or decrease the safety msrgsin?

In a car set up with a cage, halo seat and hans device one can assume the helmet will never contact anything other than the seat..... does the impact requirements of the helmet come into play?

Do the hans fastners need to be checked after an incident?

In the motorcycle world, it's been determined that helmets have become too rigid and the impact testing has been relaxed.... does that mean the stiffer helmets are no longer safe? Does this aply to SA helemts?

Now, I'm not saying we should, or shouldn't do anything differently. It would however be nice to be able to make informed decisions by ourselves but that will never happen.




OK, I feel better :-)

hinchcliffe

I understand everyone's concerns. No I'm not on a Crusade to make the world better or make DE's less fun. I was asked to look into it and see if tightening our standards would force people to insure they have a good helmet when they come to the track. Any helmet that would have major scuff's, cracks or other such damage would not be acceptable at our event. But I see that adding anything creates more liability, nuff said no additions. No I'm not a rules **** as some of you may think, thanks for jumping to conclusions though.

Other than being the one liable for any problems as I check helmets I have no credentials besides being a track rat that has run since 2002.