bauerjab

From PCA 2012 Rule Book ( a model of clarity!)

Yellow: Caution. Stationary - hazard ahead, no passing. Waving - Danger, slow down safely, no passing. NOTE: You may not pass after the yellow flag until after the reason for the flag has been passed and you are sure that there are no further incidents between that point and the next flag station which is not displaying a yellow flag.

ProCoach

Geez, I wouldn't want to be a PCA CR steward and try to interpret that one...

No way to know on-course, where and if the "further incidents" exist after the first one. How many times have you all seen a yellow and the cause of it is gone by the time you get there?

I read this as that a yellow flag condition exists from "when you see it" to the next green (or unadorned), manned corner station.

Now, all competition groups (and nearly every track) requires "line-of-sight" coverage for the workers between corner stations, so it follows that the yellow flag condition would exist from being able to sight the yellow flag status station to the incident or green flag station. That is really tough for corners when the traffic density is high because you can't see car numbers that far away, even when you can see the transgression. Hence the Pro and SCCA definition. Easier on the workers AND stewards, but it does make for some exciting racing to the yellow!

Tough call.

good hands

I remember this. I was the last car at the front of the pack and wondered where the hell everyone was behind me. No one to be found for at least the entire front straight when the re start happened.

bauerjab

Well, now you know... It was not pleasant....

jkb157

The double yellow was dispalyed at start-finished and at turn 1. The pass occurred between these two points.I have it on my video. So I did the correct thing by staying behind. This same driver did a few other bone head moves this weekend.

Phokaioglaukos

Yes,, and the SCCA rule is that the overtaking occurs when the nose of your car passes the nose of the overtaken car, so you may well be side-by-side through the yellow zone racing to the green zone, too!

jaje

That frustrates me as well. I've heard of racers passing slow back markers who were lapped and they would not go fast enough to catch up with the pack being led by a pace car. They would pass the slow car claiming they thought it had a mechanical problem and was going slow to go to pit row. Your race is likely ruined anyway if you were racing cars ahead of the slow poke for position.

Steward B.

What also amazes me is the drivers who not only don't see the double yellow but think they've suddenly become Ayrton Senna or their car has developed 100 more HP when they can suddenly blow by the car ahead that they've been chasing (when the driver ahead backs off to 90% because it is a full course yellow). Duh!

Astroman

No doubt there are bone heads at every race. At a huge race like The Clash, there will be many many bone heads.

Bryan could not have been more clear about the issue of bunching up the pack (during a double yellow) at the driver's meetings.

I agree that it's pretty scary that we are going wheel to wheel with people who can't figure this simple concept out. It's not hard for the corner workers to see who is clueless... they should be reprimanded (and educated) after the race.

f1rocks

I had a car a class above me that I was fighting for position, pass three of us at a double yellow in sprint race 2. Two of us pulled up beside him and told him to go back three spots, in hindsight that was probably a bad thing to do. He went back but we would have likely been the ones to be penalized.

Didn't want him or us to get screwed for it.

spare tire

This kind of thing seems to happen to the unaware unsafe driver (beginner, doesn't see flags or cornerworkers) At the next driver's meeting when the "keep up with the pack" speech for Yellow FLAGS; DEMAND that offenders get an Imediate Black Flag. That would be a just penalty for stupidity. The idiot would be at back flag station before the green and you might be able to catch the pack. Racers, corner wokers, and stewards would all support this solution.

Cris Brady

I don't know if it was the large fields or what, but I have never seen as many stackups and panic stops in the double yellows. In the green sprints I know it was pretty messed up. I've always complained about the guys who dawdle along in the double-yellows. But this time the group of us would be flying around at 90% race speed when we'd come around the corner and there would be a line of stopped cars and everybody would slam on their brakes and scatter as to not hit anybody. We'd putt, putt for about 100 feet and then it was back to full speed only to hit the stackup again in about 3 corners.

I think it was in the 2nd sprint race we came thru the laces and everybody was stacked up, brakes flared, cars scattered and I heard bang, bang, bang as a couple of cars got hit.

It was incredibly frustrating - and a bit scary - for me as I wanted to make sure I stayed with my group, but then again I didn't want to be smacking into a line of stopped cars. We were toward the back so I don't know if the pace car was't controlling the pace well, or it was just the result of too many cars in a giant conga line.

jaje

I see the backup and panic stops as well when under full course yellow following in line - then at the start of the race people think they don't need to see the car 2 feet in front of them and have to follow immediately in their pack. It also depends on the leader and how slowly they lead the field.

When I'm the leader during a restart I want a great run from the corner before the S/F line so that I don't have to worry about being passed. The Yellow took away any lead I built up and I want it right back again. A restart is not meant to recreate the conditions of an actual race start - simply to get the race back going again.

The speed up and slow down crap just bunches up the field and causes contact or pile ups.

Steward B.

What was the speed of the pace car during the hurky/jerky laps?
That likely was an issue.
I usually suggest to the pace car driver that they set the cruise control, assuming that the pace car has one, if it is going to be an extended full course.
If you want to experience goofy pace car driving, go to the bigger vintage races that have tight schedules!
As an FYI for PCA racers, the stewards are meeting first weekend in August and Vicki would appreciate receiving any topics for discussion. Her email is in Club Racing News

Cris Brady

I have no clue, I never saw the pace car. On all of my restarts we got the green (ie dropped yellows) on the straight after the off-camber.