38D

No, I was nice . But does appear that was his last PCA race.

38D

No, I was nice . But does appear that was his last PCA race.

SoClose

Are you F***ing kidding me? I lost interest in this thread until I read this post.
This clearly was not blocking, and a bad call (although we have no idea what that driver's prior history is). All organizations have problems- and after 13 years racing in PCA I'll say that we have seen very little of errors like this. The PCA has a lot of drivers that are involved, give their constructive input, and make the club better.
But to write your NASA buddies' comments? Did you have a pen and paper or were you using a using a recorder? Most/all drivers have a fantasy that they are a better driver than they really are. If I had one more lap...if I had his car...if I raced in that series...give me a break. All drivers think ****, some talk **** (especially after a few beers)- but to organize and write these comments in a post? Do you, or your 'buddies', really think that the quality of driver is better where you race?
After 13 years racing with PCA, I believe that the BS in minimized. When we raced SCCA here in Colorado, they used an unlicensed ambulance company to save money. This company couldn't transport off of the private racing grounds, and during our last race with them we had to wait 45 minutes, with the track shut down, until a 'real' ambulance arrived to transport the injured driver. Several years ago we raced over Halloween at Sears Point, with an organization whose name escapes me. We couldn't pass at the start until after turn 3. What kind of racing is that-and in both cases, this was their POLICY. My point is, all racing organizations have some issues- so nut up, put in your suggestions, and make it better. Keep the grandiose/juvenile/bull**** comments to yourself.
And 'gums'- grow a pair.

Mike in Chi

10 more pages...

FredC

Quality blocking...

Astroman

I bet Don "cut and pasted" those quotes from a NASA forum.

gums

You don't need to worry for me, Mr. So Close, with all of 89 posts.

Streak

Don got those from an FB page and they aren't razzing the quality of the drivers but the absurdity of the PCA definition of blocking.

Gary R.

"LMAO. First PCA racers dont register months ahead of time b/c it might be too hot."
"another event where rich guys can go lapping and say they are racing"

Sounds like they feel they are the "real" racers and feel the quality of the racers in PCA aren't up to their standards..

good hands

Most of the guys I race with with NASA are 30 somethings
Most of my PCA competitors are 50 somethings and up

A little more aggressive with NASA and better heat tolerance

Veloce Raptor

A laughing stock? Because a few guys deride PCA on the internet? Who cares??

Look...irrespective of what is & isn't a blcok, and what was & wasn't a good call, this sort of series pissant derision turns my stomach. I like NASA and PCA racing, but they are DIFFERENT.

If a few jackasses in NASA wanna deride a discussion here on RL about "blocking", let them. Or encourage them to SACK UP and join the debate here. But don't think there is something wrong with PCA just because of a few bigmouths.

There is plenty of behavior worthy of derision in NASA, too. But what's the point??? Groups need to work together, not be at each others' throats.

My view is that 99 out of 100 calls made in PCA racing are the right ones. But any time there are humans, there will be human error.

But some folks here are getting all wee-wee'd up about the internet bull**** spewed by a few anonymous NASA "racers".

Why??

Why? Says who?

Who gives a **** what others think?

gums

I have to admit; I do. It's just my nature, maybe it's a dental thing.

Meanwhile, I've raced a lot with NASA and it's generally fine, as long as you're up front. Further back there are a lot of knuckleheads and I know of at least two very good drivers who told me that they won't race with NASA anymore because too much BS goes unreprimanded.

BostonDMD

I have read that NASA people are really out there....... kind of like in space.........

Streak

Here are "blocking" rules from various other clubs.


POC:

9.2.1 In racing, one line change is allowed when appropriate to defend position. Multiple line changes, weaving, reactionary moves, and other forms of deliberate blocking are not allowed and shall result in a Black Flag penalty

BMWCCA

4. Blocking. A racer is allowed one defensive movement of his or her race car on any given segment of the track (straight or turn) to protect his or her overall race position from a pass. Any additional movement or movements is considered blocking and subject to penalty.

PBOC

39.0e In PBOC Racing, one line change is allowed when appropriate to defend position, however, multiple line changes, weaving and other forms of deliberate blocking are not allowed and shall result in black flag or one lap penalty.

NASA:

25.4.4 Blocking
A driver may choose to protect his or her line so long as it is not considered blocking.
Blocking is defined as two (2) consecutive line changes to “protect his/her line,” and in
doing so, impedes the vehicle that is trying to pass with each of the two (2) consecutive
movements. Drivers are encouraged to check with the Race Director for a full
explanation before the start of the race.

SCCA:
C. Drivers must respect the right of other competitors to racing room. Abrupt changes in direction that impede or affect the path of another car attempting to overtake or pass may be interpreted as an effort to deprive a fellow competitor of the right to racing room.

IMSA:

6.17.2 Blocking. Any driver who, in the sole opinion of the Race Director and/or Stewards, alters their racing line based on the actions of pursuing competitors, or uses an abnormal racing line to inhibit or prevent overtaking may be considered to be “blocking” and may be warned or penalized pursuant to Article 8 of the IMSA CODE. In accordance with Article 9.1.2 (1) any action or decision (or any alleged inaction or non-decision) taken by or imposed by the Race Director, Stewards or IMSA officials in this regard is not subject to protest or appeal.


IndyCar: It should be noted that this rule was universally met with disfavor and the enforcement for this year has been modified. Pretty similar to our situation: http://openpaddock.net/2012/02/09/in...-the-same-one/

9.3.Additional Provisions and Guidelines
B.Blocking – A Driver must not alter his/her racing line
based on the actions of pursuing Drivers or use an
abnormal racing line to inhibit or prevent passing.
Blocking will result in a minimum of a black flag “drive
through” penalty.


F1:

20.3 "More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted.
"Any driver moving back towards the racing line, having earlier defended his position off‐line, should leave at least one car width between his own car and the edge of the track on the approach to the corner."


PCA: I did not find this in the current PCA CR rulebook BTW. Who came up with this? Where was the discussion? It claims to not follow the "one move" norm but then describes the rule as allowing one defensive move so what is the flipping rule here? Is the enforcement we saw at LR what the stewards intended? Where can we refer to this rule?


From 11.3 CRN:

To maintain fair competition,
the lead car must be aware that a car
behind could have had a faster exit
speed out of the last corner onto the
straight. Watching the mirrors is part
of the common sense awareness. We
do not follow the “one move rule”
which would give the lead car one
move to block a passing attempt.
Blocking occurs when you make a
move that changes your line and is
solely intended to impede an overtaking
car. You have an option to
use a defensive line but if you choose
that line, you must stay on that
line. Changing that line to prevent
passing is blocking. This normally
occurs entering or exiting the corner,
but blocking is also prohibited on
straights.
For example, driver P1 comes out
of a corner onto a straight and takes
a mid-track line. Because the driver
behind (P2) has set up her car to exit
the last corner with more speed, she
gains track position and closes the
distance to P1 from behind. P2 now
moves right to start a pass, but P1
has not checked the mirrors or has
decided to protect the position with
a move to the right. This is blocking!
To avoid contact P2 has to
drive off track.
Blocking is not fair competition.
It is unsafe, unpredictable,
frustrating, and often causes
racers to make difficult moves to
avoid contact or car damage.

onefastviking

There are bad apples in every group, regardless of car marque, racing organization,driver age, driver gender, etc etc, and in this I include both drivers and stewards.

Here is one of my favorite recent ones, it's from an SCCA event at Hallett, I guess you could call it a block, even after reading the SCCA rules. To me it reminds me of a good ol' fashioned hockey hip check.