mooty

RIGHT ON.
i do want to qualify that if one did their own work, you can do a national winning BSR for 20k, including donar. it wont be pretty, but it will have all that's needed to win. i am just saying that most ppl want turn key cars. and less than 35 aint gonna happen with a BSR, yet.

mooty

i dont have the exact numbers but pads are at least $250 cheaper for front axle
rotors are $400 less per front axle
GT3 hoosier are 1400 mounted
R888 on BSR are 700 mounted or so

btw, you wont get 4 weekends out of R888, unless you are awful slow or super smooth track. 3 weekend is doable.
hoosier on GT3: 2 weekends (12-14) HC tops.

M758

944 spec just went back to RA-1. Man what a difference. I could not get more than 12-14 HC from R888's. That was driving at pointy end of the grid with a car set-up for and driving style adjusted for the R888's. I always gpt 24+ heat cycles from RA-1s. Now that I am back on RA-1 the car is just alot more fun to drive as I don't need to baby the tires. I drive the car hard and it responds.

mooty

cool, another person who feels R888 is POS. i have been saying that since they came out. i had those on M3, BSR, GT3, C2. never liked them.

M758

Hey I tired really hard to make them work. I was also very open minded. I really wanted them to work mostly because I thought the RA-1 was dead. I even figured how to run good lap times on them, but the window to do that was very narrow both interms of driving style and tire life. Heck I nearly won a national championship on them (vs other front runners on RA-1), but what I had to do just equal the RA-1 in 1 race pace was going to be cost prohibitive for a season.

My advice is for spec boxster to go to the RA-1. You will need to shave the RA-1 to 4/32, but it will give you a much longer useful life and thus control operating costs making the class more attractive vs PCA stock classes and other open tire classes.

gums

Joe,
I still can't figure out how you lost that championship; you gapped the field, had it in the bag, and then what? Fell asleep?
;-)

M758

Well here is how.

I took the lead and "gapped" the field however that gap was very small despite how it looked. Really 1-2 car lengths and constantly changing as on the front straight I open a gap due to good run out of the last 3 turns, but always gave a little back in a few other spots. This happens on 3.0 mile lap. Even so I felt I had some breathing room and then a strange thing happend. Going into turn 1 I saw clear track in front for at least a mile. I lost refernce points and started to go a little easy on braking for turn 1 turn 5 which are the more important braking zones not wanting to out brake myself.

That slight lack fo focus was enough to let the 2nd place car catch me. Once he caught me it was a war. He actually hit me and nearly sent me off track. It was slight tap, but got me sideways. Being the fair racer he was he did not pass me, but it did slow both of us down. That allowed the 3rd place car to pass him two turns later.

Now there was fresh meat looking to pass me. Then I got tagged team going into the attitudes. The 2nd place car tried a late brake pass move. I defended that, but it slowed us both down and 3rd place car passed both of us. I slotted back into second and the 2nd place guy went to 4th. Now I had to defend 2nd. I made small error in tooele corner by missing the apex tight to the inside by 6" or so. That cause me to whack a bollard and backed off ever so slightly. This made me sitting duck for the next corner.

I still defended vs 3rd place, but going on to the main straight we both were slowed down a bit and that gave 4th place enough to pass both of us. So despite holding vs 3rd place the 4th place guy passed both of us. Then the last lap I made pass attempt at the 2nd place car and thus lost a little momentum when it failed and that allowed the 4th place car to pass me.


Very tough race. I should have checked out when I did, pull that gap, but my mind got the better of me. Then once back in a war it was momentum fight as many times guys would lose a positing or two if they lost any momentum at all. A failed pass often mean you lost your own postion. Still I was happy with my performance as my only goal was to run up front with the fast guys. Leading never crossed my mind. Of course when it did I was mentally unprepared. So I had to settle for 4th, but was only 2.5 seconds back from the leader. I know given few more laps I might have been able to get spot back or two and the leader may not have won. It was just that short of race.

Very fun.

TIM COSTA

There is currently a Rennlist member who is building a Spec Miata and when I spoke to him a couple weeks ago he informed me that he will be spending north of $35K for his build. The motor alone is over $15k, about twice as much as a brand new M96 2.5 and still more than a perfectly rebuilt one. How can that possibly be "cheaper" then a Spec Boxster?

As far as the rest of this post I wont comment.

Larry,
I dont think everyone here knows the cost of rebuilding a race motor out of a 964 for instance. I know the one time I did it the tab was over $18K.

mooty

identical experience. when R888 is at its absolute best, it's maybe 1/2 second faster than RA1 at its best (Thunderhill full course). but that's maybe 10 laps out the the life of R888 that i get this kind of performance.

oh, and did i tell you that at 34psi and 44psi hot, i can run identical lap times lap after lap.... so what is the right pressure? even toyo changed their OWN recommended pressure as time goes on?!?!

to run RA1, BSR needs to run square 255/40-17 as opposed to 225/255. THAT is another giant bucket of worms......

mooty

those are "massaged" SM.
a "massaged" BSR can easily be $60k.
we are talking 100% legal BSR. it can go from 35-50k, depedning on parts selection, data and such....

bottom line is ANY RACING is $$$
i used to race bicycles. and the tire budget on that wasn't small either! u be very surprised $160-200 on tires for ONE race.

mooty

sounds like a hard fought but fun race.
i learned the hardway like you said, if you failed a pass or if you defended a position, you may very well lose the next turn. and with similary prepped cars, if you fup, you will NEVER catch up until the guy in front fup too.

M758

Yep the only guy to drive anything close to a "perfect" race was the championship winner. He started out in like 7th or 8th after the first turn and made only 1 real pass all race. Every other pass was being in the right place at the right time to capitalize on the other guys slowing each other down. He only ran the 9th fastest lap, but drove smart and had some luck to win it. That is why I consider any of us in the top 5-6 contenders. That in part is the fun of racing rather than just lapping. Lap times are only 1 piece of the puzzle. Even making pass is only another piece. To win a big race like that you need to do alot right, little wrong and get some luck along the way.

syncspeedinc

Here is a "full tilt boogie" SM http://classifieds.specmiata.com/detail.php?id=2676

@$28 K

Larry Herman

It's a lot less when you keep it stock.

race911

Then that guy building the SM is insane. Until you know what makes them tick (and I absolutely, positively suck driving mine), overspending is the last thing you should do. And as noted above with that one for sale, my '05 west coast pro championship car that was the pole sitter/race runner up at the final in Atlanta was way, way, way less than even that car.

And I'm sure you easily spent $18K on a 964 engine. On the other hand, I ran my RSA from '01-'03 for $22K all in, track ready. Still the lap record holder for similar cars at Thunderhill. Maybe Mooty will even vouch for me on how "easy" I am on equipment.............