GTR vs Griggs racing Mustang at Thunderhill
08-26-2009, 08:49 PM
#16
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There is no cone barrier. You are supposed to know what you are doing and remember that after you follow a pace car in whichever is the correct path, to follow the same path in the race without a pace car to tell you where to go.
It's not a big deal and it's the way we do it at every event.
I'm not speculating at all regarding who could or couldn't keep up, simply pointing out that the times vary and that Sunday was generally faster than Saturday, in part because it was a lot cooler on Sunday (upper 80's) that Saturday (upper 90's) or Friday (low 100's). Low to mid-1:50's indicates a well driven cup to me. I don't ever recall seeing a 996 or 997 cup do less than 1:51.
It's not a big deal and it's the way we do it at every event.
I'm not speculating at all regarding who could or couldn't keep up, simply pointing out that the times vary and that Sunday was generally faster than Saturday, in part because it was a lot cooler on Sunday (upper 80's) that Saturday (upper 90's) or Friday (low 100's). Low to mid-1:50's indicates a well driven cup to me. I don't ever recall seeing a 996 or 997 cup do less than 1:51.
08-26-2009, 08:51 PM
#17
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So, John ran in that race with the mustang a 1:55 and then came back in the PRC group D and ran a 1:54 with the longer track config.? big improvement. any ideas why?
we havent seen the fastest porsche run under 1:50s, except when Stefanowitz showed up with his 700hp turbo RSR copy and maybe one other of that flavor of car.
I think the lower 1:50s is the fastest Ive seen with the cup cars out there.
we havent seen the fastest porsche run under 1:50s, except when Stefanowitz showed up with his 700hp turbo RSR copy and maybe one other of that flavor of car.
I think the lower 1:50s is the fastest Ive seen with the cup cars out there.Have to be careful comparing times between groups even when you take into account the bypass versus the cyclone. Different Porsche factory cars have different capabilities, and then there are the pilots...
I think you can expect to see the fastest active PRC cars between 1:47 and 1:51 with the cyclone on a good weekend if everyone shows up, and with good tires. And if it isn't too hot. I'd guess that air cooled cars might loose a little more bhp with heat than water cooled, but that is just a guess.
In any case, anything around 1:50 in a more or less full-sized, street car-based race car is plenty fast enough to be thrilling.
I think you can expect to see the fastest active PRC cars between 1:47 and 1:51 with the cyclone on a good weekend if everyone shows up, and with good tires. And if it isn't too hot. I'd guess that air cooled cars might loose a little more bhp with heat than water cooled, but that is just a guess.
In any case, anything around 1:50 in a more or less full-sized, street car-based race car is plenty fast enough to be thrilling.
08-26-2009, 08:56 PM
#18
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Thats why I was surprised. a 1:52 with the hill is like a 1:50, and that is not far off the mustang's and GTRs time of 1:49 as their best on the hotter day. sure, temp is a big deal. I think we were off a little bit at our race last month with temps near 100F, but the mustang still ran 1:51.xx along with the NSX turbo.
So, if PRC ran the long track with hill and John did a 1:52 on a cooler day, that would be like a 1:50. pretty darn fast for an older 996 cup car in my opinion.
What did you and the "turtle" run?? Looks like 1:58.5 in the heat and then 1:57.9 in the cooler day. Hmmm, i might be able to run with you now If I can find a second or so in my old "shark".
Slicks, right??
mk
So, if PRC ran the long track with hill and John did a 1:52 on a cooler day, that would be like a 1:50. pretty darn fast for an older 996 cup car in my opinion.
What did you and the "turtle" run?? Looks like 1:58.5 in the heat and then 1:57.9 in the cooler day. Hmmm, i might be able to run with you now If I can find a second or so in my old "shark".
Slicks, right??mk
There is no cone barrier. You are supposed to know what you are doing and remember that after you follow a pace car in whichever is the correct path, to follow the same path in the race without a pace car to tell you where to go.
It's not a big deal and it's the way we do it at every event.
I'm not speculating at all regarding who could or couldn't keep up, simply pointing out that the times vary and that Sunday was generally faster than Saturday, in part because it was a lot cooler on Sunday (upper 80's) that Saturday (upper 90's) or Friday (low 100's). Low to mid-1:50's indicates a well driven cup to me. I don't ever recall seeing a 996 or 997 cup do less than 1:51.
It's not a big deal and it's the way we do it at every event.
I'm not speculating at all regarding who could or couldn't keep up, simply pointing out that the times vary and that Sunday was generally faster than Saturday, in part because it was a lot cooler on Sunday (upper 80's) that Saturday (upper 90's) or Friday (low 100's). Low to mid-1:50's indicates a well driven cup to me. I don't ever recall seeing a 996 or 997 cup do less than 1:51.
08-26-2009, 09:20 PM
#19
Three Wheelin'
Pilot matters. There was a Porsche Cup car out there that was well over 2:00. Put Johannes in the same car and well under 2:00. Pilot matters.
I am pretty sure that Mat can easily run under 1:50 in his 3.8 car, and that on a better day Peter Smith can run nearly the same, if not the same lap time in his 3.8 car. Too many variables to compare.... not really productive.
- MM
I am pretty sure that Mat can easily run under 1:50 in his 3.8 car, and that on a better day Peter Smith can run nearly the same, if not the same lap time in his 3.8 car. Too many variables to compare.... not really productive.
- MM
08-26-2009, 09:30 PM
#20
Race Director
okay the GTR is quoted at 3650lbs wet with driver....and is quoted at about 500whp-torque....or a power to weight of about 7.3 (whp to lb).....at runs a 1:49.6 over the bypass....that is CRAZY fast for such a "heavy" car.....damm....but you can see the way it rockets out of the corners with all that power and AWD.....I do think it has a bit more HP than that too....since the Mustang is around around 5.0 or better.....the GTR has to be better than 7.3.....
08-26-2009, 09:47 PM
#22
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Indeed. Most have prob. seen the article in Sept. excellence written by Johannes. He posted a 1:48.6 on slightly used slicks in an 09 cup over cyclone.
08-26-2009, 10:32 PM
#23
okay the GTR is quoted at 3650lbs wet with driver....and is quoted at about 500whp-torque....or a power to weight of about 7.3 (whp to lb).....at runs a 1:49.6 over the bypass....that is CRAZY fast for such a "heavy" car.....damm....but you can see the way it rockets out of the corners with all that power and AWD.....I do think it has a bit more HP than that too....since the Mustang is around around 5.0 or better.....the GTR has to be better than 7.3.....
That's a fat baby.
08-26-2009, 11:53 PM
#26
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08-27-2009, 01:36 AM
#27
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08-27-2009, 01:42 AM
#28
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Sure pilot matters. we are talking about top club drivers here. When Johannes runs and tunes the m3 of david smith, he is a second of the owner who is very quick. (1:46s at sears vs 1:47s with the owner) But, his value really besides just running the snot out of the car, is to be able to drive it , and make changes that immediately result in a 1 second faster car for him and the owner.
Yes, a new cup car on slicks should run 1:49s. at laguna, top supercup pro drivers and top cars are in the 1:28s for best times. Its about 21 second diff (generally ) between laguna and thunderhill
Yes, a new cup car on slicks should run 1:49s. at laguna, top supercup pro drivers and top cars are in the 1:28s for best times. Its about 21 second diff (generally ) between laguna and thunderhill
Pilot matters. There was a Porsche Cup car out there that was well over 2:00. Put Johannes in the same car and well under 2:00. Pilot matters.
I am pretty sure that Mat can easily run under 1:50 in his 3.8 car, and that on a better day Peter Smith can run nearly the same, if not the same lap time in his 3.8 car. Too many variables to compare.... not really productive.
- MM
I am pretty sure that Mat can easily run under 1:50 in his 3.8 car, and that on a better day Peter Smith can run nearly the same, if not the same lap time in his 3.8 car. Too many variables to compare.... not really productive.
- MM
08-27-2009, 01:43 AM
#29
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This is NOT a stock weight GTR. Its completely remanufactured like the NSX.
Less than 3000lbs, like the mustang.
mk
Less than 3000lbs, like the mustang.
mk
okay the GTR is quoted at 3650lbs wet with driver....and is quoted at about 500whp-torque....or a power to weight of about 7.3 (whp to lb).....at runs a 1:49.6 over the bypass....that is CRAZY fast for such a "heavy" car.....damm....but you can see the way it rockets out of the corners with all that power and AWD.....I do think it has a bit more HP than that too....since the Mustang is around around 5.0 or better.....the GTR has to be better than 7.3.....
08-27-2009, 01:48 AM
#30
Race Director
MK
Here is the exact quote from Brian Locks website
"The GOTO:Racing GT-R finally had its first day on track and the performance was nothing short of amazing. At a race weight of about 3650 lbs with fuel and driver, and running a R35 motor with a COBB stage 2 map and open exhaust as its only modification, the car turned a shocking 1:39.5 lap time at Infineon Raceway. "I knew the car was going to be fast," commented Brian Lock, GOTO:Racing's lead driver, "but I never imagined we would break into the 30's our first day out. When my Dad came over the radio and told me that I was running 1:40 flats in my first session not braking-in the motor, I knew this car would be everything we all hoped it woul be." ....
it still has the stock dash with ALL the computers.....that has to be heavy
Here is the exact quote from Brian Locks website
"The GOTO:Racing GT-R finally had its first day on track and the performance was nothing short of amazing. At a race weight of about 3650 lbs with fuel and driver, and running a R35 motor with a COBB stage 2 map and open exhaust as its only modification, the car turned a shocking 1:39.5 lap time at Infineon Raceway. "I knew the car was going to be fast," commented Brian Lock, GOTO:Racing's lead driver, "but I never imagined we would break into the 30's our first day out. When my Dad came over the radio and told me that I was running 1:40 flats in my first session not braking-in the motor, I knew this car would be everything we all hoped it woul be." ....
it still has the stock dash with ALL the computers.....that has to be heavy