mark kibort

Larry,
Maybe you will appreciate the work to get the new engine in between races last May.
a 928 is a tough bird to work on, and we had to build the engine as well. all in 2 weeks, with one person helping on 3 evenings using metwrench and a borrowed cherry picker!
Didnt miss a race and it was broken in and dynoed before that next race!
Out and on an engine stand in 4 hours. Entire job was 35hours, most in the evenings over 2 weeks.

Now, what did your rod bearings look like? I bet they looked good! Porsche makes amazing stuff, dont they!!!????

Here are pics of my pull. look at that engine. thats 20years old, 110 race days over 7 years of racing! Looked brand new. all in the pursuit of 50 more hp!

dand86951

Larry, sorry for the off topic, but which disc cooling kit is that on the 951?

Larry Herman

Sorry Dan, we're not really sure. They came on the car.

Techno Duck

I was going to suggest at the least doing a 2pc crossover also to save you from having to remove the intake to get at the inlet flange in the future.

Larry Herman

One bolt! We had to remove it for ONE bolt. We got the other 3 from below. Arrrgh!

RedlineMan

Hey;

In the customer cars that I work on, I FORCE the owners to make certain mods for servicing. They hate me up front, because the 3pc x-member and 2pc x-over pipe are not cheap. When I have to go back in again, the parts are paid for in labor savings. I build my own pipe and x-member, by the by.

I can have the oil pan off in 2.75 hours...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Larry, if the rod beaings have been in there a long time, RESIZE THE RODS!

rlm328

I am in the process of taking my car apart and I was curious on the 3 piece cross over. My primary question is durability. My car spends about 95% of its time on the track and I am curious about the possibility of the cross member failing. I am sure that it is bullet proof but would like some assurance.

So what is the experience of people using it?

Willard Bridgham 3

Just like a 911, if you're going to do anything serious, take the engine out and work on a stand.

M758

I don't see the need really.


Look what does it save...

Turbo Exhaust... Still needs to come off anyway. That is big pain and especially hard on older rusted bolts.

Steering rack.... Still need to come off to get clearance to work under the car.

Ok what you gain.

Crossmember... instead of 4 bolts holding cross member plus the 4 motor mount bolts you take out 8 bolts on the two new split lines. Savings maybe 20 mintues out and 20 min in out.

Suspension. The A-arms are 3 bolts each. I can pull the a-arm from a the tub an crossmember in 5 minutes.

Ok so the big thing is not needing to support the engine. Big deal.. if you race and do this often you need a hoist anyway. The biggest PIA in doing rod bearings in the car is pulling and installing the pan and dealing the with exhaust in a turbo.

I don't see the need for a split cross member as to me it just makes this part weaker and less stiff. That is not good for race car. All to save and hour every coupe years? Not worth it.

Cory M

It saves you from having to realign the car after you put it back together too, right?

RedlineMan

Questions;

Are the 3pc x-members reliable? Depends. I don't like Lindsey's because they don't have enough bolts / clamping area. They also break. I have had one crack on it's own (imperfect welds, probably), and two break when the cars were wrecked with front suspension impact. I don't count those as failures.

Are they time savers? Joe, read my last post again. Oil pan off in 2.75 hours ON A TURBO (with 2pc exhaust). The x-member saves a fair amount of time by itself.

Do you need to realign? No. Most cars have a good ghost outline of where the caster blocks were sitting. If you spray mark the caster blocks they are easy to set back in place. Caster is not critical.

Do you have to take out the engine to do most tasks like you do with a 911? No. One of the few things that require removal is to replace main bearings, or rebuild the engine.

Techno Duck

John, what do you mean resize the rods? That is one of my fears with these motors, that i am going to replace the bearings on a less than perfect crank and cause more problems than if i just left the old bearings in there. I know..use plasti-gauge to check crush and clearances but that stuff is only so accurate.

Also regarding the 3pc crossmember, if you read around the 951 forum one or two people have experienced failures with them. I do have a 3pc crossmember for my car that was done by a local welder, it is basically a copy of what LR offers. I have installed one on my friends '89 and it worked / fit fine. But i can understand the concern of failure on a fairly important structural piece. I still debate putting it on my car when i do the rod bearings this winter. Dropping that crossmember really isnt all too much work in my opinion.. but it does take the 'edge' of the rod bearing job making me all the more willing to change the bearings every season or two rather than get that 'one extra day outta them'.

I do have some concerns also about the modified 2pc crossovers. I have read some threads where people were having a heck of a time getting them to line up correctly with the v-band flanges. This was on the LR modified ones. Im not sure if that was everyone or just a few isolated cases..and who knows whatelse could have been causing problems. Personally i am going to go with the SpeedForceRacing crossover (sold with headers) which is a completley new unit rather than a modified stock. My headers are leaking pretty bad anyhow and the crossover i am sure is not far behind.

Here are some useful links..

http://www.speedforceracing.com/index.php?productID=674
http://www.lindseyracing.com/LR/Part...OSSMEMBER.html
http://www.lindseyracing.com/LR/Parts/944XOVRPIPE.html

M758

No.. one you pull the steering rack or even move it toe will be off and you will need to redo the front end.

kurt M

Punch mark the rack location and remove the tie rod ends from the struts. Bolts right back in no change.

After watching a 951 motor come apart and go back together in my shop (Thankfully I was not the one working on it) I have concluded that 944 turbo motors are made entirely from tubing. Tubing of all sizes and types.

A.Wayne

Fixed it !!!!!!