F350Lawman

Wow, they made it about 500 yards and spin then a hard hit taking one DP out for good..not a great start, hope it improves. Scott Pruett is running though, after they got his car back late last night. He looked a little sore but pretty good considering.

Suntrust DP leaving the field again, like last race???

Good race, the track was a little dirty and the dust was bad,causing some problems for the drivers, but it was enjoyable.

RedlineMan

Hmmm...

I was not very impressed. I know it's a new circuit, but it looks like they have a LOT of work to do. I just don't think they should have held a pro race until the grass was in. The hump on that one straight needs to be shaved. Barbosa almost blew the Brumos car over. They definitely should have split the GTs from the DPs. It was exciting to watch, but I'd rather it was because of the great driving, not the marginal overall track quality.

Looked more like a NASCAR short track race to me...

renvagn

I just got back from two days at NJMP and having talked with 4 DP drivers who are less than thrilled with the lay out. An interesting questions is will they be back as a DP only race if at all. I spent the weekend observing from all the corners to learn what I could about car placement and broke down the track with one of the Farrari challenge drivers who Mankow had forwarded track notes to.

I am looking forward to driving this track. I realize it is a work in progress, but at the same time I am disapointed of the opportunity missed IMO. Being sandwiched between two major metropolitan areas of NYC and Philly this was a prime location for a truely worldclass facility. Perhaps one tht could have brought back F-1 in a fitting venue.

Thunderbolt this is not. This is not anywhere near the caliber of the true drivers tracks that we all enjoy driving (slowly) and viewing as a spectator. (I did say I am interested in driving this course.) It is not a thoughtful technical design of a Mid Ohio, nor the speed and flow of Mosport, Road Atlanta/ America, WGI or VIR. It is flat, narrow with short straights and little passing areas. Mazda race way it is not.

The pit in and out is nothing short of being FUBAR. To date there has been 11 accidents at the facility. The most recent a fortunate non fatality involving Scott Pruit. Who designed this auto cross layout. I have been told it is the person responsible for Miller (an overly lengthy circut with no passing areas or visual perspectives and not liked by sports car drivers), same and one who ruined LRP (created a perfect funnel of a congestion area for accidents to occur and cars to bonk down), also the one who designed that fiasco called Shenandoah at SPMP ( a failed attempt at the technical design of an east coast Mid Ohio, with the best of the worlds corners reproduced) and the one who designed Montcello in NY. Fortunately they haven't broke ground for Alpine, since he is suposed to be involved here as well. I have been told that this person is an architech by trade not a driver or real track designer. I wounder if he even has been on a golf course to notice the flow that brillance can create. After looking at the Thunderbolt facility, I got the impression that with all the peripheral plans, i.e. hotel, conferance center, condos, karting facility ect. that with these in place the track was secondary and had to fit a design with the remaing land available.

There are sections of this track that defy the common sense and flow of the great tracks. The kink at the entrance of the front straight is one area. Why would you have uneven concrete sloping down from right to left meeting a slopping section of macadam slopping left to right. This is a high speed section (140+) and this concavity significantly unbalances the cars. 4 wheel on the concrete really unsettle the car causing a big wiggle in the rear end and she isn't pretty. The DP cars or any car running 4 wheel on will come within @ 15 feet of the armco at pit in. Far to close to cars entering the pits. Pit out is another mess with cars well down in speed entering the track almost at apex with cars runnig 100+. Maybe computer design isn't the answer and maybe some real road racing pros should be consulted. T-2 is another area that has an awkward approach speed and is a blind up hill right hander which is prone to congestion and breaks the flow of momentum. Wheel spin can and does take place damaging equipment. (sound like Shandoah?) Maybe it can be ground down some to reduce the rise. T 4 into 5 they got it almost right. It is a tap and go, heavily loaded right hander, letting the car drift out left. Here they forgot the exit curbing causing cars to run into the dirt, but if you stay on track there is a good braking zone and a down shift for a 90 degree + cambered left hander. And is passing opportunity, but not for the faint of heart and requires full commitment. T-6 is a very fast sweeper followed by a slower sweeper being T-7. Then it's back to the gimmicky BS of entering the occtipus which, bonks everybody down in this rediculous decreasing radius, slow turn. If it were straightened out at entry you would have a heavily loaded section on approach with a quick straightening of the wheel for a brake zone and could follow with positive cambered greater than 90 degree corner creating another pasing zone, albeit one similar to a T-5. The DP cars were loosing 4 seconds a lap in this area of the track. There is no reason to have essentially a tight 180 degree section of track followed by another tighter 180 degree section of track, unless you are on an auto cross track with limited space. The KONI race was a joke and had more cautions than a CRASH car race at Talladaga with 20 laps to go.

I did say I want to drive it, (they need to do some major correction of pit in/out) but am dissapointed in how far the final result has strayed from everything the truely great tracks possess and this being 6.5 hours closer than VIR. Over the coming weeks it will be interesting to hear more top pros opine when off the record. Anyway Kudos to Lee for taking 5 spot in a caution filled race. Drive well.

Minoclan

I just got back myself and couldn't agree more. First of all it is as far for me as Lime Rock, and there is no comparison. Once I got in the entrance it took 45 minutes to get through the gate, despite the fact that I had a VIP pass on the car, and a season ticket. Once I was through the gate it took another 10 minutes to drive to the hospitality facility because I could only go as fast as the people in front of my car were walking. There are no walkways. It was tremendously disorganized. There was dust, no make that silt EVERYWHERE. The track looked narrow and that hump looked dangerous. When there was a spin out it literally took 5 minutes for the dust to settle to see which car it was. What shocked me the most was that the fastest average lap speed was SLOWER than my average speed to get to the track. I can't see how any driver enjoyed driving this track. It looked like an autocross without the cones.

smankow

the average lap time includes the caution laps, which slows things considerably. As for their "hot" laps, I'm sure that you're not turning 1:20 laps.

I do agree that it was quite dusty. They were spraying water to keep it down, but it dried quickly due to the temps.

Now, I definitely agree with the excessive time that it took to clear cars. That was an initial comment that I had after driving both tracks. They didn't place openings to get safety cars and wreckers to a location quickly. I also don't know why they didn't station wreckers at various locations.

I didn't experience any problems with traffic, as we arrived before 8:00 and were able to get in without issue. Going into the weekend, they didn't know how many people would attend.

Overall, I had a great time there this weekend. I'm hopeful that NJMP will improve the areas that arose this weekend.


steve

Bull

Well, it will certainly be interesting to be on this track for the first time Friday! Hopefully it will be a better experience than Shenandoah, which was a one time experience for me with so many other tracks available.

I really enjoyed driving the Lightning Course, so IF Thunderbolt is a loss NJMP will still be attractive for me.

ajcjr

can i ask a question: who the hell was in charge of race control and let the gt cars start while a dp car was sitting in the middle of the track?

Minoclan

I had a lot of lights on Route 206 in Princeton and in Millville also!

The only thing that I can say is to please call me when all of that dirt has grass growing on it.

LVDell

I am glad I had a chance to watch the race b/c being a member of VIR with reciprocity to drive member days at NJMP, I will definitely pass on that. Not worth the drive to run a track that looks it could have been so much more. Obviously it's unfair to try and compare it to VIR but if you have the financial means and start a new facility like this that will attract Rolex, etc, then shouldn't it be on par with the great tracks?

I like the golf example posted earlier in the thread. Truly great tracks are not gimmicky or boring but rather have a fantastic flow and challenge to them. And those are designed by truly great designers. Obviously NJMP didn't hire the equivalent in motorsports.

Bull

I would give the Lightning course a try before you completely write off NJMP. It isn't VIR, but many of us can't wait to go back.

LVDell

Good point Bob. Any video available of Lightning to check out?

I am definitely looking forward to hearing how the Club Race goes at Lighting in 2 weeks.

BrianKeithSmith

Did Alan Wilson have anything to do with the layout?

justin993

I like the lighning course, however there is much room for improvement. Grass would help, and more reference points. I cant wait to go back.

BobbyC

here's a recent one...

http://www.vimeo.com/1402149

Jerseybean

great video, not much shake and the sound was good. What camera was he using? Im still on the hunt for something good.