M758

Yeah, but that cat is already out of the bag.


With respect to "the car needs to make weight anyway"... What driving the weights in PCA? Factory published curb weight. Really to provide good racing all the weigths should be as low as reasonble given removal of A/C Carpets, soundproofing (for example while I know remvoing the sound matting under the carpet is common and legal in stock, it really should not be if you need to keep the carpet. If you can pull teh carpet pull it all) and other non needed items. This means some cars should be listed lower that what they are and you can also tweak the class weight by 50 to 100lbs to balance the classing a bit.


I really think that PCA racing could be made alot nicer by allow some real low buck race mods and setting weights to even up competition. While many PCA stock cars could be driven on the street the number that are "dual use" are very very small. So why not let prepared be the place for stock type cars with these basic race mods (ie no interior or extra weight for stupid stuff like A/C). Stock should be more stock and let GT be the nearly limitless free for all.

M758

Yep, in fact no interior and less weight would make the cars CHEAPER to run. However cost controls are not on the PCA club race radar screen. I guess every one PCA club racing has got lots of money to burn.



Sorry for rant guys... but while I love some aspsect of PCA club racing and I can apperciate where it came from those days are just long gone.

bobt993

One of the most economical ways to stay competitive in NASA is weight reduction. I added Lexan when my windshield was cracked last year. HP/weight ratio makes alot more sense than the new classes in PCA with theoretical power yields per liter. I find this to be a money mulitplier. It is difficult to scrut engines with a ton mods so standardize a dyno. Dyno sheet at the wheels, weigh the car with the driver and the competition is .1 secs apart. To run back and forth between PCA and NASA I can now take weight in/out of the car and mount the AC compressor back on for PCA. They also allow full slicks if your car is a "tweener" and neither ballast or boosting power is reasonable to reclass your car. I like simple.

Sean F

I would love to see a dyno sheet required for PCA.

LPM911

this is a perfect segue to camber plates and their relation to stock class.

Mark in Baltimore

I agree completely.

Gasser

From a stock class perspective in reguards to the 10% weight reduction for a prepared change, I don't like it. For instance you take a F car under the current rules and prepare it for G class to compete against me. That person already has the ring and pinion change so better grunt out of the corners, had bigger brakes etc... and its already hard to compete against these type of cars and now they get to improve the Power to weight ratio as well? That would basically force me to do the same and move out of the stock class and do all the prepared changes... I think keep the power to weight ratios the same, the prepared changes are enough already in my opinion.

M758

To be fair a 10% reduction would need to be a preprared change on its own. Do the 10% and the rest of the prepared changes and you should move up 2 classes.

Mark in Baltimore

But lowering the weight of the stock cars to "a weight as low as reasonable" would preclude the occasional racer who still drives their AC-equipped, roll cage-prepped race car with remote reservoirs and full suspension arm spherical bearings . . . on the street.

Sean F

sign me up

Gasser

Ok, now I like it.

bobt993

This is so true. In a PCA club race start, I lose more car lengths to "equal" cars than I did in my first NASA (GTS) race even weighing 300 lbs over my class allowance.

paradisenb

+1 on the interior and passenger seat removal. Requiring them just doesn't make sense.

Placing a driver cooling device in place of the seat seems to add much more safety. Comfortable driver and easier egress. No brainer.

Everyone has to have race seats and harnesses, so nobody has factory delivered seat (except a few GT3 seats) anyway.

trackjunky

Spec Tire

MarkM

I'm trying to understand the facination with interiors this year. It must be the NASA effect, and none of you can 'make weight' with the carpeting.

Someone earlier mentioned SIMPLE. I can't imagine what some of these changes would do for the scruitineers. The rules are a slippery slope, and sometimes not making a change keeps them simple and enforceable.

If they said you could remove part of the interior but not all of it, imagine what that does to policing. If we follow it to the logical conclusion and say interiors don't matter, then everyone will gut the car and install creative ballast solutions that change (read as improve) the handling behaviors of the car. This is even harder to police, increases costs, and does not inspire the feel of a level playing field.

If you guys want to do this stuff then run in GT, SPx, GTB or create a class, or Run in NASA. Seems like plenty of opportunity to do this if you wan to buy a new car. If you already have one, then it doesn't really matter, as it already races with an interior.

I'm calling BS on some of this stuff. You guys talk like the interior is explosive, not just flamable. How many of you that are complaining have installed adequate fire suppresion in the cabin? I'll bet not many.

If egress is an issue out the passenger side, how many have installed the $35 summit racing seat that is about 1/2 normal size? I'll bet zero. Or even moved the seat all the way back, up against the roll cage to get it out of the way?

It is also not the club's responsibility to make the rules fit everyone else's. I think there is a bit of elitism built into the rules, and for me it is the right amount. I like racing with people who realy like their cars looking nice, versus some of the crap I see in SCCA and NASA. When going wheel to wheel, I prefer to be with someone that values their equipment as much as I value mine, it reduces the incidents.

They have opened up the spec classes a bit, and I think we are at a good balance right now.

Just admit that you are all jealous of my new underweight car, with its fantastic interior, and that you don't want to try to keep up with me.