Sean F

One suggestion for setup changes, go big not small. For example, do one session with front tire pressure significantly higher than normal and see what happens. Play with that and then go full stiff on the front bar and work your way back. Then move on to the rear bar, but use large initial increments and move back.

Are you running Hoosiers?

sjanes

Yeah, I've been making both big and small changes, and have had some success, but since this is the only car I've driven at speed, I know what feels better/worse, but not necessarily what is right/wrong (if that makes sense).

I use Kumho Victoracers or MPSC, depending on my mood when I buy tires. I'm going to try the Nitto in 08.

38D

Can you post some video of Mosport? I have lot of footage and can show side by side comparison.

Bull

Speaking of Calaboogie, what/where are the good places to stay when attending events?

RedlineMan

A note to those who have not driven there;

Think Mid Ohio. That is the closest I can come up with in terms of style (in some respects. In others, not even close). If you have driven Mid O, you will know that there are many places where it is very easy to lose time, and very few where you can make it up. You have to save your testosterone for 1, 6, & 13, and learn to temper your enthusiasm everywhere else.

Calabogie is very much more so. It is a track of immense subtlety. It rewards patience and finesse more than bravado.

- I'd say you need to set the car up with a bit more static oversteer for Calabogie. Those long drifting corner complexes allow a very hot entry, with a dirt-track style drift to scrub speed. If you can go in there hot with the tail just slightly stepping out, you can really haul the mail going in, time your rotation with steering input, and hammer the gas at just the right moment for exit. I've never encountered a turn that teaches you this better than Temptation.

- Can you drop the 2 gears going into Mulligan's? Or perhaps going in as suggested above will put you at a higher RPM for accel?

- I'd let the car track full left between 12b and Throat. That is where it naturally wants to go. Since Throat is a slow turn, it is not at all hard to negotiate it from the left side of the track. I'd bet most people could gain a tenth right there. It looks like you did this more so on the 2nd lap.

RedlineMan

sjanes

Unfortunatly no. I've only run Mosport once since 2003 and the bumps finished off my old Sony camera.

sjanes

I had my setup like that for a while and I was taking ducks head and the quarry turns with the tail hanging out a bit (having to make many small corrections). I moved the setup to more understeer to try and force myself to trail brake more and because I was going through tires very quickly.

This is a few laps from earlier in the summer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Nwk9kpu148) when the setup had a little more oversteer (note: the viper wasn't supposed to give me a signal)

There isn't much time to get a 4-2 shift in there (it's hard enough to do the 4-3 as you can see by me shaking my head on the first lap). I could try though. I've been trying to get a bit of rotation into Mulligans using trail braking.

I've tried that and doesn't allow me to get back to full throttle around throat. I've probably tried 20 different lines though there and the data says going 3/4 of the way across is the fastest that I've tried. The other problem is that a lot of cars take the line that the Viper in the above video uses, so the track gets pretty dirty as you go further left.

38D

Shift mid-tiurn...its no big deal really.



You are describing slip angle. You have to be on the throttle hard in order to generate it, and its the different between fast & slow. I suspect that if you would generate more slip angle, the understeer feeling would go away.

Even better than taking rides, hire a pro/instructor for a day or 1/2 day. Get them to drive your car and compare the data. You'll learn far more than spending another $1k on go fast bits.



Try skip shifting...just go 4th direct to 2nd.

sjanes

Actually, it is a big deal in a Targa. If I'm not straight (or close to it), I can't get the car into 3rd. It's always been that way. I assume it's chassis flex or the 20 year old transmission mounts (I've been thinking about solid mounts for the gearbox). It's the reason I never use second gear anywhere (except 5b at Mosport).

yes, but the problem is that I'm flat out from the apex. It may be a product of using too little rpm out of the corners. Maybe I'll revisit trying to use 2nd again.

I agree. I think some dedicated coaching would go along way. I've asked other instructors that I trust to drive my car to get sample data, but they are not comfortable pushing someone else's car that hard (which I understand since I decline to drive student's cars).

I'm typically not a skip-shifter (it's mostly a timing thing), but maybe I'll start trying to use 2nd again. Maybe I just need to sell my bolt in cage and put in a welded one to stiffen the chassis more.

sjanes

Others would have to chime in here since I go home at night. Unlike Tremblant, there is not a lot of local hotel space, so if you decide to come up, book early.

RedlineMan

OK;

Good points you made. Setting up the car to understeer is necessary for trail braking. The rub is getting yourself to commit to that much more entry speed!

- So, what's with the lift in Kink? You know you can do it flat. Little LFB tap, or a flick of the wheel, if the front floats on you.

- You could probably TB Jacques pretty heavily. Most of the track doesn't reward heavy, aggressive braking, I don't think. That might be the only place where threshold braking would be applicable. However you do it, you certainly don't want to get fouled up for Gilles!

- I take a differnt line into Temptation. You seem to stay very tight past the entry apex curb. I clip that same curb in the same spot, but then head directly all the way out to the turn in cone. I do my heavy braking/shifting after that entry apex, and then begin to dial in steering as I near the track edge. Great natural rotation ensues, and if I time it just right all that is left is to mash the gas and exit the turn. It also helps when Botho is not spun and facing you at the exit curb!!!

- You're right about all the junk entering throat. To many people ripping up tires trying to stay right!!

You certainly had the measure of that Viper, in all ways but grunt... and smoke!

RedlineMan

Hey;

Most lodging is a half hour away in Renfrew, and beyond. The best place to stay is in your RV.

sjanes

I know I know. Every time I go through there I know it was too slow. With just a little lift and then flat again, the car is rock solid with zero sliding. I think it just the armco on the outside and big *** wall on the inside that makes me lift. Its like the "comfort lift" for T3 at Tremblant.

Yeah, I've been working on that, but always seem to come off the brakes too early so I don't scrub off too much speed. I think that's the main problem that I've run into while trying to beef up my trail braking, is that I brake too soon, so I burn off too much speed before I turn in. Maybe I need to start picking up some braking points and slowly move them closer to the corner.

Don't go out that far. Like thoat, I've run and datalogged a lot of lines through there and only going 1/2 way out is faster. I've seen a lot of cars facing me on the exit of that corner

The guy in the Viper is a friend (he has 3 ACRs, and they all smoke like that), and he's been working on increasing his pace, so I went out behind him to video his run. He made big gains this summer.

sjanes

One thing I did notice this year was that when I was running MPSC during the summer, the more I slide the car (with a loose setup), the faster it was (both laptimes and tirewear) with a best of 2:24.4. With the Victoracers, my best laps (a 2:24.6 set earlier in the day of the first video) were done with a mild understeer setup and very little sliding. So is sliding faster or not? I've seen John drive. He's fast and he slides a fair bit, and others here that are fast have also mentioned they slide the car a lot. Is it just a factor that MPSC like to slide and Victoracers don't (tire temps are 170's in the front and 180's in the rear in both cases). How much do you slide?

Can ya tell the winter is starting to get to me? I've even started modifying my 4 year old's PowerWheels pickup.