gerry100

Not only newly addicted but fell in with the wrong crowd...
Just got back from my second Watkins Glen DE this summer, both with BMW clubs ( great people that run a very enjoyable event).
I'm just finding my way around and starting to taste the " good fast line" but have noticed a few things..
Running with a lot of M3's ('90 to new) in the novice run group and found that my '86 911(3.2 stock,street tires)could corner with them easily before fading in the straights. I know that there is a lot of variance in this class and that my exit speeds could/should improve as my skills increase.
I've also found that when running in packs of Beemers there is a tendency to follow and mimic their timing.turn ins and overall line. I know you have to "drive your own line", but I'm interested in comments on how this differs.
Got a ride with an Instructor in his Carrera and noted his turn in and apex were a little earlier than the M3 in front of us. Another instructor told me that you can do "amazing things" with 911
when you know how.

Inputs appreciated.

Vinny '98 3.8 C2S

The best way, by far, to drive your Porsche better and faster is continuing your present course. Get as much seat time as possible. I would suggest going to PCA DE events if you can. You'll have a much better choice of instructors with 911 experience.

The book "Going Faster" written by Carl Lopez is worth reading. It's from the Skip Barber School and gives good overviews of the proper line and some driving tips.

In addition to track days, there are a number of things you can work on while street driving that will help you on the track.
1) Practice heal and toe shifts all the time while driving on the street. Do it until it becomes second nature. If you're new to it, first try it without braking. Just downshift one gear and try to match the revs to your speed exactly. Once you can do that very smoothly without changing speed, try it with braking at stoplights or whenever you need to slow down. IMHO running hard at the track is just about the worst place to learn the basics of heal and toe.
2) As you've heard a million times already, just try being as smooth as possible every time you drive your car.
3) Once you're familiar with racing lines (the book and your instructors will help), think about the race line wherever you drive.

Have fun!

E. J. - 993 Alumni

Hey Gerry,

There's one correct line around a race track. Learn to drive that before learning anything else. Front drive, AWD and RWD all drive the same optimum line. Learn the line and learn to drive it smoothly. No jerking.

Don't try to heel and toe, trail brake or any other stuff you will hear and read about. Learn to drive the line and be smooth.

Once you have a lot of experience (read years of DEs), then you should start thinking about the TINY changes in car attitude that will be dictated by the orientation of your car. That last 1% is where the SLIGHTLY different turn in points and other TINY differences will be important.

And as for following the person in front of you, it's not a BMW thing at all. I have been at a few PCA events in the right seat when my student drove straight off the track for no reason because the car in front did first.

So once again, learn to be smooth and learn the line. There is only one way to do that - go to the track as much as possible.

E. J.

Greg Fishman

I will add to what EJ said. The reason your instructor may have been taking what seemed like an earlier line may have been because the BMW in front was late. It is better for you to be slightly late than slightly early. Watkins Glen is not known for being a forgiving track. A 911 is capable of amazing things but it takes a while to be able to make it work for you instead of against you. On slow turns practice some lift-throttle oversteer and you will see how the car rotates and you can get on the throttle that much sooner. 95-97 M3's are very capable cars and are easier to go faster in for the novice driver. Just stay with it and don't get frustrated because in a half a dozen events those M3's will be eating your dust.
Greg

Sloth

As I tell my students... learn the line and the speed will come naturaly.

Z-man

Gerry:
Welcome to the addiction!
As a newbie DE addict, may I offer my observances as well:
1. Avoid the RED MIST! Don't worry about keeping up with the car in front of you, and don't drive with your emotions! If your emotions are out of control on the track, don't expect to keep your car in control!
2. When following cars, you should still be looking up the track to pick out your turn in, apex, and track out points. Look THROUGH the car for these points, and avoid the "rear bumper stare."
3. "Straights are for fast cars, corners are for fast drivers." HP wins on the straights, but driver skill wins on the corners. Don't worry about how cars leave you in their dust on the straights: once you've mastered the corners, you'll be getting the "pass me" signal a lot.
4. As SLOTH said: DON'T worry about going FAST. Speed is the result of learning how to drive well. Focus on learning (smoothness, consistency, accuracy...etc) and not on how fast you are.
5. Be slow and smooth with all your inputs: steering, throttle. With braking: set the car first before really pressing down hard. (But then make sure you get on the brakes enough). Setting the suspension smoothly is key to getting through a corner well.

If you're going get more involved with DE, may I suggest doing at least the following for your car:
1. Get a fire extinguisher mounted in your car.
2. Install a harness bar and harness setup (for both driver and passenger)
3. Upgrade your brake pads to at least an intermediate track pad.
4. Upgrade your brake fluid with stuff that has a better tolerance for high temps.
5. Get some synthetic tranny oil in your tranny (swepco's great!)
6. On my 944 I replaced my fan switches and thermostat with lower temp ones. (Obviously, there's no coolant in your car, but you can get teh fans turned on sooner)

Hope to see you at some PCA DE's: I'm going to Lime Rock (Sept. 13-14) and Watkins Glen (Oct. 7-8) with PCA / NNJR. If you're going, look me up! (Red 944S2, #142)

Now just think: could you ever imagine just driving your car only on the street?

Sorry for being sooo long in this post.
-Zoltan.

gerry100

Thanks for all the excellent feedback.

Not only affirming things I've heard and started to experience, but also that the people you meet/contact in this "hobby" are some of the best.
Some good tips on off track development also.

Minor aside, any one know of a cheap source or good DIY plans for a go pedal with the heel and toe extension?. My size 9s get tired of twisting sideways.

Zoltan, looks like I'm done for the year although I'm awfully tempted to get down to Lime Rock if I can squeeze it in. (only 60miles from the house).
If not I'll sure we'll hook up in the future.

Z-man

Gerry:
For a 'race' pedal:
If you're in PCA, page through this month's Panorama: there's at least two companies that sell the throttle extention pedal:
Wing-something in Connecticut
Better Bodies in CA.

I bought the Vosstech pedals (3) from Better Bodies for $170.00. the Vosstech pedals do require removal of the rubber covers on the clutch and gas pedals, and drilling of all three pedals, but they are nice.

Oh, and if I can recommend a book or two:
Russ Bentley's Speed Secrets
Bob Bondurant's book on Performance Driving is also a great book.
Vic Elford's Porsche Performance Driving is good too, although it's a little bit of a "Diary of an old race car driver!"

-Z.

A930Rocket

An alternative to buying the pedal extension, is to lower your brake pedal height by removing the carpet and floor board and then adjusting the brake pedal rod. It has Heim joints on both ends with jamb nuts. Just loosen the jam nuts and turn the rod so the pedal lowers to where it's comfortable. Then you hardly turn your ankle if at all.

Best of all, it's free.

Regards,
Jim

Alan Herod

Every car I have tracked since the late 60s was easier to heel-toe then the 911. I observed our chief instructor's ride from about five or six years ago with a 3/4 inch thick piece of plywood bolted to the gas pedal of the OG Racing car. I cut a template from cardboard to what I thought was a good shape and transferred that shape to 3/8 inch plywood which I bolted to the gas pedal. Subsequently trimmed it to a more suitable shape and covered it with no-skid which wore off years ago. Pedal extension is basically a backwards 'L' with a fat part at the top -- Can either heel-toe - or use the roll technique. Could have used aluminum billet and drilled for racy look, but this works fine and really lasts a long time.

gerry100

Alan,

Sounds great. How do you bolt to the gas pedal?

Gerry

Flying Finn

Ed Newman

I'm going to 100% agree in reality but disagree in theory.... the BMW may be a slightly different line (ever so slight) due to different brakes, handling, etc. But this is way beyond anything you, I or most of us on here should care abotu for a while. Definitely come out to some of the PCA DE events. I have not done a BMW DE yet, I am planning to next year, but the PCA one are very well run. I find myself constantly fighting the urge to follow the car in front of me. You almost need to blindfold yourself to what else is goign on and just concentrate on following ur line. Wise suggestion from one of the instructors... no matter what you do with the car you will not go any faster, you will only go slower, so wworry about not making mistakes and driving smoother and you will be faster by not being slower