LouZ

I have a '90 964 which have the small rear calibers (yes, I want to update to the larger rears as soon as I can find a set).

I ran on Pagid Blues at some previous track events, and now need another full set.

I an stuck with Blues for the rears as they are the only ones available, but I can put any of the Pagid's on the front.

I would like opinions on the types for the front, knowing that the rears will be Blues.

(If you have a set of larger rear calibers off of a '91 and up, I'd be interested)

Bob Rouleau

Yes you can mix compounds. On 911's certainly 964 through the 996 it is common to use a harder pad in the rear than in front. For example on a GT3 the Pagid RS 19 or 29 is nice up front and the RS-14 in back. The 14 hasa more bite than the 19 or 29 and helps balance the braking more evently front to back. In your case the Pagid Blue is a sport pad, and not the best for track use on a fast car. Putting a racier pad like the 19 opr 29 in front will simply make the front brakes do more work.

Best,

bgiere

I have run PFC 01 in front and PFC 97 on back...the balance and bias were fine.

tkerrmd

Bob, what about my heavy TT? I have pagid orange all round would you do differently, car is for DE only.

thanks

tom

Tom W

I run yellow's up front and black in the back to move the bias a bit more to the rear. One day I'll actually add a bias adjustment ...

With the relatively small brakes you have in the rear, it would not make sense to move to a more aggressive pad up front. I'm confused why you think you can only get Pagid blues to fit the rear. According to Bill Verburg's excellet summary ( http://www.pelicanparts.com/MotorCity/wmv/brakes.htm ) the pad are the same size as the 4-piston calipers. Is there a mistake in the table?

Bob Rouleau

TKerr - I would use RS 29 fronts and RS-14 backs on your car. The Orange is a pretty decent pad but nowhere as good as the modern ceramics (RS 19,29, 14 etc.). The Orange is also hell on rotors as you have probably noticed.

As Tom W has pointed out, the 29 (yellow) front and 14 (black) rear setup allows the rears to do more work. On my car the brake balance is better and my front rotors last longer. Prior to going to this setup my rears would last forever and the front rotors would not last a season. Fronts still need more frequent replacement but it is better than before with the same pads all around.

Best,

M758

Ideally you run the same compound front and rear.

HOWEVER.... Like Bob pointed out running different compounds will change the overall performance and can be used to tune the brakes. I would not use different compounds front and rear unless you are trying to impact the front/rear bias.

tkerrmd

Thanks Bob, I'm due for new pads so I'm going to try your recommendations!

LouZ

Tom

Bill's chart is correct, however, I don't think that you looked far enough to the right (last column). The 964 C2 for "90 and '91 have the 2 piston calipers. All C4's and '92+ have the identical front and rear calipers.

Appreciate the comments, keep them coming!

Bob Rouleau

M75B - If a car has perfect front to rear brake bias then I agree with your statement. Cars designed for street use tend to bias braking to the front to prevent rear lock up under any circumstances. A track car driven by a competent pilot will want more balanced front to rear braking and tuning with pads is a good way to do it.

Note too that Pagid's web site shows different pads (type) for front to rear bias adjustment on various cars. Mixing pads is a very common thing in the racing world.

Best,

LouZ

I have found that both Pagid Blue and Orange are available in the correct sizes for both front and rear.

What would be the best setup?
(F) Blue (R) Blue
(F) Blue (R) Orange
(F) Orange (R) Orange

Kiko

When I instruct and take my car (a heavy 996 Turbo) to the track I change the front rotors and pads (yellows) and leave the OEM pads onthe rear and guess what its, spot on! The extra rear bias really suits my preferences...

Stuttgart

I think you mean extra front bias

Tim@BHP

I have a very strong opinion on this subject.
Mixing compounds is done in racing but the rear compounds are ALWAYS a lower friction than the fronts. Having a high friction pad like a RS14/15 rear with RS-19 fronts is a HUGE mistake.

Brake pad friction profiles are very dynamic and change with pressure and temperature. In the 964 with the small rear caliper the torque loading vs. surface area for these small pads makes it likely that the rear is going to make a lot of heat. If you are running a aggressive rear compound vs. the front, the IBT (Initial brake temperature) is going to be higher for the rear disc after a couple of laps and the friction level will be even higher making the rear susceptible to locking up and making the rear of the car a handful to hang on to. If you are trying to trail brake when this happens then you really need to hang on as the high polar moment of inertia of the 911 will BITE you!

Feel free to give me a call to discuss your needs but I recommend you use RS 4/4 (Orange) in the front or call me and let me pitch our product line.

LouZ

Thanks Tim, unfortunately, you'r too late this time. I decided on Pagid Orange front and rear and placed an order just yesterday.

An hour later, I got a call that the orange is no longer available for the 2 piston rears (#1580). I didn't want the blues, and they recommended the Porterfield R4's. After a bit of research on my part, I went with them front and rear.

As a Rennlist sponser, I will keep you in mind for the next set.