Tried an ISAAC
#166
Geo and John,
I agree with you guys 100%. It is that whole system thing. I agree with the comfort of the new full containment seats. I am currently researching seats. I have a hard time paying big bucks for metal Ultra shield but like John says it appears to have all the right stuff. I like the Recaro spg pro hans but it is still fiberglass and only has 5 holes so the 6 point sub has to either go in the center hole or parachute via the lap belt holes. I think the consensous was that the 2 extra rear anti sub holes are the best way to go for best pelvis control. Are there any others or the Ultra shield the only way? That Ultra shield weights a ton too. My carbon OMP shell is like 8 lbs! but just a seat no wings no great shoulder support and only 5 holes. I think with the cage I have 300-400lbs of safety gear.
I agree with you guys 100%. It is that whole system thing. I agree with the comfort of the new full containment seats. I am currently researching seats. I have a hard time paying big bucks for metal Ultra shield but like John says it appears to have all the right stuff. I like the Recaro spg pro hans but it is still fiberglass and only has 5 holes so the 6 point sub has to either go in the center hole or parachute via the lap belt holes. I think the consensous was that the 2 extra rear anti sub holes are the best way to go for best pelvis control. Are there any others or the Ultra shield the only way? That Ultra shield weights a ton too. My carbon OMP shell is like 8 lbs! but just a seat no wings no great shoulder support and only 5 holes. I think with the cage I have 300-400lbs of safety gear.
#167
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Originally Posted by Geo
Gregg, that was exactly my point about the belts slipping off. All we know is it happened, but we don't know any details and it was 3 years ago. I'm sure there is more to the story and we don't even know what has or may have been done to alieviate the problem.
Belts coming off on tests sleds has been well documented. Racers are more concerned about belts coming off on racers, such as Barrichello, Sato and Wilson. Barrichello claims it caused him to crash, and Wilson was bounced around the cockpit so much he jammed a nerve and had to be air lifted to the hospital—without crashing. Hang around the pits with the formula guys and they will tell you the the belts can slide off. Does it happen all the time? No. Does it happen? Yes.
John, your assessment of how the tethers on the HANS pre-load during a crash appears to be spot-on. I was a little skeptical, but earlier this week The Discovery Channel reran the racing safety program and I watched the video of the crash test with the HANS very closely. It went down exactly as you said.
#168
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Originally Posted by fatbillybob
Geo and John,
I agree with you guys 100%. It is that whole system thing.
I agree with you guys 100%. It is that whole system thing.
#169
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that surviving a crash is a good thing, but not a tenth as good as not having it in the first place.
To bad I did a minor test mine at one time and hope to never do that again.
#170
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Originally Posted by RedlineMan
Perception. It is a POWERFUL thing. Golden if it's with you, dreaded if against.
You sound a bit like Yoda in your reply
I agree, the psychological implication may outweigh the physical benefits.
One other item which still bothers me a bit:
It would appear (to me anyways) that the (re)introduction of the 'wings' has brought back the issue of 2" vs 3" shoulder belts and the HANS to the forefront again.
It looks as though the 'wings' would tend to force the inside edges of 3" shoulder belts closer to (and hopefully not in contact with) the sides of your neck. Obviously, much less of an issue with the 3-2" HANS specific shoulder harnesses.
As I noted in a previous post, Ryan Newman apparently had a different shouler harness design from Schroth; it was 3" down to maybe 2.5" (definitely not 2" like the commercially available HANS specific Schroth harnesses). Perhaps this was a response to the 'wings'?
#171
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Originally Posted by fatbillybob
Thanks for the link to the 2" lapbelt thread. Just when you start to think you know what is going on there is a new issue of 2" vs 3" lap belts and pelvis control..
I went with the 2" lap belts, independent of whether or not PCA has (finally) approved this, as has most all other sanctioning bodies.
I ended up with the same seat (XL version for fat asses like myself) and harness arrangement as the factory puts in Cup cars.....figured it can't be that wrong if Weissach does it.
#172
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Originally Posted by RedlineMan
I can think of another one. Perception. It is a POWERFUL thing. Golden if it's with you, dreaded if against....