Carrera51

Totally agree with those who suggested that every PCA Race have an Advanced DE group as part of the event. Would also be nice if there could be time for a classroom session Q&A on making the transition from DE to Club Racing. I would like to see PCA Club Racing management work with all the racers on brainstorming to figure out a way to reverse the seemingly declining attendance at races. As others have said, it's not a good sign when Sebring attendance has been on the decline and we can sell out a VIR race in the spring. And lastly, all of us PCA racers need to do a better job of playing the roll of marketing guys and talk up the program. We all need to be more like Jas0nn and do what we can to bring new racers into the program.

ProCoach

On the money. As usual…

The sport, both the competitive sector and the recreational/educational sector, IS growing, I can assure you.

The “aging out” argument has been a perennial concern for the last couple decades. First in vintage, now in SCCA, PCA Club Racing and some others, yet here we are with more licensed racers across the board, more organizations and more events across the country and around the world. Many more DE participants than ever.

We had eight NA and ND Miata drivers under 35 at this past weekend’s VDCA event at VIR, another 170 car race entry, plus the additional 100 BMW Club Racing brought to share the track time.

I remember when SCCA was “secret car club of America,” not just “spoiled children crashing automobiles.” It still is. As is PCA Club Racing. Under the radar, despite all the mother club’s support.

First PCA Club Race I ever went to, after thirty years in the industry, was Sebring 2010. Unbelievable! Went over the bridge and there were seventy, factory-built cars (Cup cars, GT3 cars, Fabcar) on the grid. NEVER KNEW PCA CR existed other than basically 911CUP cars, before then. Had only seen a few crossovers from PCA CR in historic races over the years, and of course raced with Alan Friedman since the late Eighties.

PCA CR is definitely an organization that is “stuck.”

Matt Romanowski

IMHO, knowing the people, organizations, and having been part of a few of them in different ways, it's a very segmented and diverse problem. The sport is growing, but that area of growth is constantly moving. Head to a Gridlife event and you will see a lot of race cars, just not Porsches. The same goes for many track day organizations - they get a ton of different drivers, but they are not PCA members even when they have Porsches.

I would also say that the consolidation in the motorsports safety, manufacturing, track days, and other areas has not been good for the overall industry. The numbers people quote are marketing numbers, not real numbers.

What to do with PCA and Club Racing? Well......I would say that it has to start with efforts like Jason and 911CUP are making (it's way cool) and you'll have to figure out how to change the national organization. They have transitioned from being a club to a business over the last 15-20 years and there are downfalls to that.

RobT 394

As a 911CUP driver I truly appreciate JasOn and all he is doing. But the advocates cannot do it all on their own. National needs to step up. They need to involve PMNA and get better support from the brand. And they need to run it as a business, a customer service business. One where the experience matters.

The difference between running a Porsche Racecar and a Mazda is stark at the club level. PMNA has the know how and good people to help. But you have to engage them at the club level.

LuigiVampa

So true, and yet they are barely waking up to the problem.

Bingo - I feel like PCA has forgotten that it is a CLUB and we are MEMBERS and a lot of times decisions are made without any input. While the vast majority of PCA volunteers are here for the right reason, there are a few who are on power trips and don't have the right spirit. This is supposed to be fun!

The only thing that has happened in my ten years of club racing is the expansion of classes.

PCA leadership should go to other series events like IGT, AER, Champ, WRL, etc. and see why people are leaving PCA.

skeeler

^^^^^^^^ This........

lcrain

I am surprised to not see SIM racing mentioned. I have to assume that many car enthusiasts are simply getting their kicks in that environment.

As someone who came up through the ranks in PCA to be an instructor, I have only really considered SPB due to cost and field size. I haven't pulled the trigger because costs are still pretty high to race a remotely full calendar due to travel. I race with NASA, champcar, WRL and Gridlife occasionally.

Gridlife is the most fun I have had sprint racing because the field is reliably large and competitive. I attribute a lot of that to their marketing strategy and single class racing. All the cars are built to one racing class. So if you want to race with gridlife, you build to a single rule set. They also have time trials, hpde, drifting and a music festival like vibe that really attracts the younger generations. Even if they can't afford to be on track they can justify being around the scene they are passionate about. I am probably smack in the middle of the age range for GLTC racers (36) and most of us are not there for the dubstep concert after the racing is over. But it is a great way to get younger people exposed to the format.

I think NASA is in big trouble personally because they have way too many classes. The biggest field by far is SM and most guys who came up in DE don't drive Miatas nor do they want to. They want to drive their corvette or whatever and they may have very few other cars in that class (at least in the Texas region). It's such a bummer to spend a few grand to show up to a race weekend and race against the same 3-5 guys every time.

Champcar and WRL are really attractive to me because I can rent a seat for <$5k in a GP2ish car, get 4+ hours of seat time, do it with my friends and go to tracks I otherwise could not justify going to due to the massive travel time associated with hauling across the country. Fly in, race at an awesome track, rent a cheap hotel room with a buddy and fly out at the end of the weekend. WRL has become very competitive with the GTO field drawing the biggest numbers and those seats are very pricey but still probably competitive vs. driving a gt4 car in PCA and you get more seat time.

At the end of the day, most people have budget constraints and the options to deploy that budget are growing. I am at a point in my racing where I care mostly about hanging out with my friends and racing in a larger field so I always have competition. WRL/Champcar are the best use of my funds currently to check those boxes.

Matt Romanowski

PCA has over 21 paid employees. It is a business and run like one.

RobT 394

Fixed it for you:

stownsen914

Saw a few other comments to this effect as well in the thread. I agree it would be great, and clearly effective as a bridge to racing. I wonder if PCA has their hands somewhat tied on this though, for insurance reasons. I'm pretty sure that for every PCA DE I attend, it's either written or spoken something like "PCA DE is not racing, nor is it practice for racing." I wonder if they HAVE to say that to keep their insurance. And similarly, may be prevented from making a more direct link between the two activities.

dgrobs

LTL can comment on this....

(LTL = Luigi the Lawyer)

ProCoach

BMWCCA doesn't have to say that. Lime Rock Drivers Club, AMP, Monticello, MSR have drivers ed and intramural racing without a self imposed barrier between their DE and racing programs.

There needs to be (and can be) better coordination at the PCA National level between DE and Club Racing, for sure.

Heck, when SCCA saw their club racing numbers decline, they started to copy NASA's HyperDrives (short, instructed 20 minute sessions for stone stock novices) and instituted a Time Trials program and the total numbers went back up to what they were some time ago.

ProCoach

I think you answered the question they need to ask.

I'll only add that I have NEVER seen more contact in a club racing series, over the last fifteen years, as I continue to observe in PCA Club Racing.

Yes, this is my subjective assessment, but since the beginning of my involvement with a significant number of PCA Club racers across the widest variety of classes, the difference is stark.

Shocked, SHOCKED at the disconnect between what those leading some of the Rookie meetings I've attended and what is actually happening out on track. "There is NO contact," "We run a non-contact series," "PCA has the lowest incident rate of any racing organization," it just goes on and on...

Single-car, multi-car, "oh, HIM again," it doesn't matter.

THAT has to get fixed first, IMO.

LuigiVampa

PCA is overly proud of their low insurance rate, but the compromise is that they are much more restrictive. PCA regions are not allowed to hold karting events. We are not allowed to do "taste of the track" anymore. They are obsessed over non-PCA members attending PCA events. I know we are a member organization but how can we attract new members if you have to be a member to see what membership is about?

I really don't have a problem with PCA saying DE isn't racing because you don't want a few yahoo newbie DE drivers to start doing stupid things out on track. That being said, there is absolutely no promotion or even a mention of racing during a DE program. I want to say that the DE programs tend to run from benign to almost anti-racing. We teach the DE line to keep drivers safe - not the race line.

This thread is more focused on racing but PCA also has a DE problem as those numbers are way down as well. DMTD charges more than anyone else and gets filled up. Why?

Lastly, as someone else pointed out, Porsche doesn't do $hit for PCA. Instead of supporting PCA they created the Sprint Challenge, which is a direct competitor. It is crazy that we spend millions on these machines and we are all treated like red-headed step children. Porsche doesn't care.

Veloce Raptor

THIS x 100000000000