RJFabCab

I have searched the archives and still have a few questions for the Tequipment cab roll bar:

1. If I were to leave the rear seats in, do the backs have to be left up or down? I'll probably take them out.

2. Can I still use the windscreen with the roll bar installed?

3. I need recommendations on a DOT legal harness setup.

4. Does the Tequipment bar install require drilling of the car?

I'm also looking into Das Sport cab bars and GT-3 seats...

TIA! Sorry for the X-post... but I can't delet this message.

DJF1

I had the DAS bar in my cabrio and did not have any problems with the windscreen and the top going up or down. I did not remove the seats either, they just became unusable...
For sure I would recommend going to GT3 seats and the roll bar. This way your head when not driving with the helmet on should be protected somewhat. Also you will get a much better seating position and the harness will fit perfectly. You can use the BK eye bolts to keep the stock belt for street use and the harness when on track. This way you do not have any problem with DOT upon inspection as the stock belts remain fully operational... I used the Schroth 6 point harness and I'm very pleased with them.
I had to drill the rear floor infront of the seats on both sides to mount the DAS and the rear bolt where the rear seat belts mount using a stronger and a bit longer bolt.
The Tequipment bar should have the same mounting points but I cannot vouch for that as I have not used it.

RJFabCab

For allowing me to draw upon your experience!

So, to keep your 993 cab DOT street legal, you have the stock belts in place? I'm still learning about all the components involved in a harness setup. You run stock belts on GT-3 seats on the street? I suppose you uninstall the harness at this time, correct? Are there DOT issues with running roll bars on the street?

I'm going through a big decision process now. I wish to improve safety and reduce my sliding all over the seat. I figured a good way to do this (besides the seatbelt trick) was to go with sport seats. So, to get the full benefit of the seats, I figured I'd need a harness. If I throw in a harness, then I might as well put in a bar for extra protection!

Slippery Slope Alert!

Anyhow, the more I steer to track mobile, the less streetable it becomes. Potential for no windscreen for high speed top down cruising, head injury issues with roll bars for street use, no memory or electric seat adjustability, no functional rear seat (future kiddos), etc...

Everything points to "get a track car." One quandry, though. Nowhere to park it! Then, I have to get a trailer, and a tow vehicle, and... here we go again!

Give a hoot to the whales for me.

Beluga Whale Cam

DJF1

LOL... You are right RJ... You are heading towards a track car... Heck that is exactly the path I went myself!!! ....I first had the cabrio, put in a roll bar , suspension, harness etc and realized this this is too uncomfortable for the street plus the roll bar issue with potentially my head cracking like a melon on it, if I was side swapped by a soccer mom and her behemoth. So I did what I should have done in the first place... Got me a high milaege car and turned my attention to it converting back the cabrio to garage queen.
I actually had exactly the same problems as you do. First I did not know how to transport the track tires to the track and then where to store the car!!! The tire problem was solved by paying Ted Lazarides a small fee to leave my tires on the track in his storage place... So I drive now to the track on streets/wets and change on the track. As for storage my mechanic who upkeeps my car anyway is glad to keep it in his shop... So problem number 2 solved as well...
Yes its a slippery slope, but make your decision and get a track car and leave that beautifull cab of your alone! I told you on track how beautifull the color is , it would be a shame to sand blast it Get the track only car and leave it street legal to drive it from and to the track... I know eventually I see as well a trailer on the Horizon but I can tell you that for a year now that I have this setup it is worth it 100% and besides feeling safer on track with all the proper safety equipment on, the progress you make as a driver is greater as you do not worry about the queen and the setup you use is not anymore a compromise between street and track...
If you need any help please let me know.

As for your original questions I did answer on the 996 forum without seeing first your reply here... In short yes it is possible to have everything in the car and still run 3 point belts for everyday use... But I think you have seen the light so soon I will be checking your "new" track car out!

RedlineMan

Danny's got you covered, RJ;

That Cab aint no track car. If you make a conscious decision that you are going to drive within your limits, progress slowly and carefully, and will not delve into territory where you must have more safety equipment, you can indeed continue to drive the Cab and enjoy yourself. If you simply must have more equipment to feel comfortable or honor a deal with the wife, then stop now and find a track car.

I have a friend who tracks a 993 Cab, Tip even, and he takes no prisoners whatsoever. He flat FLIES. If he were not such an accomplished student of car control, I'd be worried. Still, when you considers that everyone stands to lose it sometime, it makes one think.

Besides, all you do is buy a box trailer, and you've got the storage too!

Bill_C4S

On the track car issue...that's why there is the GT3. Best of Both Worlds.

Also I struggle to understand for the street, the combination of GT3 seats and roll bar is an issue. Let's not forget that both the GT3 CS and GT3 RS come factory equipped such in Europe.

The German TUV is not exactly known as being a soft touch, so am unconvinced of the logic that the combination is dangerous.

Naturally at this point..my ignorance will be illuminated...pls feel free to do so.

RedlineMan

Hey Guys;

The issue is only one in instances where any tubing is proximate to the driver. This obviously present some possible hazzard to occupants. In addition, there are insurance companies that are catching on and dissallowing coverage for cars with tubing inside.

When I build cages and roll bars, this is something I take into carefull consideration. Getting those tubes as far as feasibly possible from potential occupant impact is one of my primary concerns, even in a race car.


www.redlinerennsport.com

By the way, Bill. No flamers here, just know-it-alls!

Robert Henriksen

John, that is some beautiful work. Sorry you're so far from Texas.

Bill (nice to see you, BTW) - I don't know that the issue is so much the capabilities of the car as the intent w. which you drive it(re: a GT3). I've made the looong (four year?) passage from street car, to street/track car, to full track/race car. I've driven my street/track car plenty hard at DEs, but was never willing to push beyond a certain limit: it was a street car, it was shiny/pretty, I wanted to be able to drive it home on Sunday, drive it around town the following week. While I was willing to budget the funds for brake pads, R tires, etc, I wasn't willing to budget for bodywork.

Having now experienced 6 or 7 races in a racecar (including a WILD 25 hour enduro through darkness, rain, MUD, and total carnage all around me) I can say that having a track/race car which you're willing to treat as a consumable item fundamentally changes your experience. I've got some bodywork to do, but that doesn't stress me at all - it's a normal operating cost for a racecar .

Some guys have the wherewithal and inclination to take a Porsche, **use it up** and dispose of it. If I *had* the former, I might acquire the latter

Randy, As far as putting seats/harnesses/roll bar in your street car, **the better to enjoy your DEs**, I'd say more power to you. You can always pull them back out & convert to stock later on when you've either had enough fun w. the DEs, get tired of the comfort compromise on the street, or feel like you need to move up to a track car. There seems to be a healthy aftermarket for GT3 seats, not much exposure there.

Oh, and like John said - you can park your track car in an enclosed trailer, then park the trailer in Speedstar's fenced-in lot in South Houston for $75/month.

TT Gasman

Time for that 968 trackmeister RJ.

RJFabCab

Robert, good to hear from you! How are you getting your little racer to and from the track? Flatbed? I checked out Speedstar... interesting option.

Streeting with sport seats and a roll-o-my-eggo bar around town isn't such a big deal to me, although it does look a bit silly.

"The next step" really seems to be a BIG one. Losing potential luggage capacity in the rear could be a problem. No windscreen is an issue for long top down cruising. Plus, I told my wife I was thinking about ripping the back seats out and I got one of these:

Hahaha. Actually, it wasn't quite that bad.

I have some big time thinking to do. Man, this is hard work! I think I'm going to have to start a concurrent track mobile search.

Perhaps Bill and Doug can help talk me out of this madness.

Danny, thanks for all the input!

Bill_C4S

RJ - ahh..would not trust me to talk you out of it...been spending way too much time working out whether it makes sense to:

1. Put GT3 seats, rollbar, harnesses in the C4S.....

or

2. order a GT3.

Robert Henriksen

#2.

Then Randy would have to get a GT3, also, so you guys could race! Oh -- at a PCA race, of course, you would never RACE at a DE (cough, cough).

Randy, so far I've been bartering for trailer loans, mooching, and hiring out to a race shop for transport. I'm about ready to either send the plans for a featherweight open trailer to Minnesota, or buy a bunch of square tubing stock & start welding one up myself.

Oh, Randy - if it helps you any, I haven't found that there was luggage I couldn't fit in the 993 with a DAS-sport rollbar. I just use soft duffel/gym bags, though, not traditional suitcases. Between the front truck & the back seat, I can take tools, helmet, luggage, oil/windex/paper towels/etc without a problem.

Tom W

RJ, it's a slippery slope. I also started with a cab. After a year or so of autocross and a bunch of money into suspension, shorter gearing and other mods, my wife and I started DEs. I used a DAS rollbar that was removed between events because my wife didn't like it's looks. Like Danny says, use the BK mounts to allow you to use the stock belts for daily driving. I also think different seat (with cut-outs for the harness are needed). Stock seats and 6 point belts do not work well.

I've since fallen off the cliff (it's no slippery slope, it's a cliff) and now have a track car with a cage, Recaro seats and the 6 point belts I originally got for the cab.

The one good thing about the cab is that when the roll bar is installed you still have access to the rear seat area - you just have to open the roof to get to it.

RJFabCab

Bill: Get the GT-3. Shed weight, gain thrust, and lose those pesky back seats. OOPS. Master Declan would not approve! Plus, with the GT-3, you could slide through the carousel like all the rest of us poor 2WD saps - minus those little racer types like Robert.

Robert: I sat around and thought about it for awhile. I can't find a darn thing wrong with MOOCHING!!! Custom trailer sounds nice. Real nice. I can't remember. Was your 993 a coupe or cab? Das bars look like quality pieces.

Tom W: This progression is fun. If I could go back again, I would still have gotten a cab as my first purchase. Losing the top is one of life's greatest motoring pleasures...

Robert Henriksen

Sliding? What's sliding?

My 993 is a coupe. No complaints about the DAS. If I ever get the car back from my mechanic, AND decide I'm not going to track it much anymore, I look forward to getting pretty much all my money back out of the bar.