CGT Prices
02-28-2015, 03:53 PM
#1036
Drifting
We'll see ... I do agree the CGT must be part of a modern collection as spiritual successor to such homologation cars as the 959 and GT-1 and non-homologation specials such as the C4 Leichtbau.
However there are two major differences between those other examples you cite and the CGT that could influence future prices.
1. The initial build quantity was much smaller (904=~100, 959=~300, GT1=~25). The CGT is ~1300.
2. Those cars were not generally purchased to mothball (perhaps excluding some 959's and the GT-1).
Despite how few are left - condition and miles aside - it only takes 3 73RS to come to market at once for prices to take a hit. Imagine when prices spike and 30 CGT's pop out. That is what has recently happened with the 959 and the low production series cars of the 1990's. All MIA then like an elephant herd all on the market.
When the supply is low enough (original build ~-100 and many damaged or totalled) markets can absorb this to some degree but at ~1300 units and many being preserved for future sale .... I think today's price spikes in CGT's may be absorbing as much as decades worth of future appreciation.
I wish the best for all seeking appreciation in their CGT values as the performance of the cars at the top tend to lift all boats!
However there are two major differences between those other examples you cite and the CGT that could influence future prices.
1. The initial build quantity was much smaller (904=~100, 959=~300, GT1=~25). The CGT is ~1300.
2. Those cars were not generally purchased to mothball (perhaps excluding some 959's and the GT-1).
Despite how few are left - condition and miles aside - it only takes 3 73RS to come to market at once for prices to take a hit. Imagine when prices spike and 30 CGT's pop out. That is what has recently happened with the 959 and the low production series cars of the 1990's. All MIA then like an elephant herd all on the market.
When the supply is low enough (original build ~-100 and many damaged or totalled) markets can absorb this to some degree but at ~1300 units and many being preserved for future sale .... I think today's price spikes in CGT's may be absorbing as much as decades worth of future appreciation.
I wish the best for all seeking appreciation in their CGT values as the performance of the cars at the top tend to lift all boats!
The cars you mention aren't anywhere close in build or driving experience for that value alone the price of the CGT is a far secondary thought of ownership. It will take another year and my guess is there won't be owners to convince to release their CGT.
02-28-2015, 05:34 PM
#1037
Burning Brakes
What other car would you buy at 475+ and get an equal ROI investment and or driving experience?
The cars you mention aren't anywhere close in build or driving experience for that value alone the price of the CGT is a far secondary thought of ownership. It will take another year and my guess is there won't be owners to convince to release their CGT.
The cars you mention aren't anywhere close in build or driving experience for that value alone the price of the CGT is a far secondary thought of ownership. It will take another year and my guess is there won't be owners to convince to release their CGT.
As to the other cars and what you can get for $475k - I don't get the impression that you understand the motives behind collectors as regards the other cars mentioned - they are not bought for their leading edge driving experience.
02-28-2015, 07:10 PM
#1038
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Flachbau's comment about 959's coming out of the wood work and their pricing taking a hit makes me wonder where he is seeing lower prices. The most recent pricing I saw was over $2mil for the two Canepa had (his website no longer shows the 300 mile red one). I've watched prices go only one direction on this car for the four years I've been tracking them.
02-28-2015, 07:10 PM
#1039
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Goldman rotating inventory. Still under there car fax. First thing a dealer does when they get a car. Is get there banner on it. Free enterprise of America of course. But jus makes me laugh and sit down. To pry the car. That couldn't sell to the publiic in the mid 700"s. To pry from the private collection Now takes. An offer over 900k
02-28-2015, 07:30 PM
#1040
Burning Brakes
Flachbau's comment about 959's coming out of the wood work and their pricing taking a hit makes me wonder where he is seeing lower prices. The most recent pricing I saw was over $2mil for the two Canepa had (his website no longer shows the 300 mile red one). I've watched prices go only one direction on this car for the four years I've been tracking them.
While it is generally true that if there are multiple examples of a rare model on the market at the same time prices do take a relative hit, I cannot say that I have seen too many 959's on the market at the same time - except for at Canepa - whose asking prices btw are evidence of nothing as far as the true market is concerned. His 959's do not sell fast ...
02-28-2015, 08:29 PM
#1041
Burning Brakes
We presently have 2 types of CGT owners. A: The ones who have bought this car to drive and enjoy and B: The ones who buy for their collection. IMO, 1st group would not part with their cars because there is NOTHING out there in the $500K price range that would deliver the same feel, experience and fun. (please don't mention cars with flappy paddles because some of us truly don't enjoy driving them unless they are track cars). Now you have the 2nd group which buys the real low mileage cars for their collection and are not about to part with them because of the car's looks and reputation and being able to own one for the hell of it. This, IMO would cause a shortage in the market and will drive the prices up as it has been doing for the last 18 months. That's the reason that they have been getting sold soon as they hit the market and frankly speaking there are 1 or 2 for sale in US currently out of 1270 and then there are 2 F40s for sale in US out of 499. Most people on this board bought these machines for what they are and how they make us feel. If there is ever a correction not too many of us would care. We will drive and enjoy them even more not worrying they are becoming investment properties (hell, I would buy a 3rd one for my 3rd kid
). I agree with Nuvolari612, once one crosses the auction line, they would be even more expensive to buy. Now, only if I could get some warm weather in NY so that I could take mine for a drive.
). I agree with Nuvolari612, once one crosses the auction line, they would be even more expensive to buy. Now, only if I could get some warm weather in NY so that I could take mine for a drive.
02-28-2015, 08:46 PM
#1042
Burning Brakes
True
It would be interesting to know the average price that current owners are actually in their cars for. CGT's dipped below MSRP for quite a long time as I recall.
It would be interesting to know the average price that current owners are actually in their cars for. CGT's dipped below MSRP for quite a long time as I recall.
02-28-2015, 09:39 PM
#1044
Burning Brakes
Correct me if I am wrong. Worldwide production: 1270 CGTs & 499 F40s. More CGTs wrecked than F40s.
02-28-2015, 11:40 PM
#1046
Rennlist Member
I made the mistake last year of not buying the 24k mile CGT for $350k, but instead bought a FGT for $250k. FGT is a great car, easy to drive, classic looks. Now that a new FGT has been announced, more than 40 cars for sale on autotrader. While I think the FGT will not go down in price, it wont increase like it has the last 2 years.
03-01-2015, 01:40 AM
#1047
Drifting
I made the mistake last year of not buying the 24k mile CGT for $350k, but instead bought a FGT for $250k. FGT is a great car, easy to drive, classic looks. Now that a new FGT has been announced, more than 40 cars for sale on autotrader. While I think the FGT will not go down in price, it wont increase like it has the last 2 years.
Ones that are wrecked and ones that will be.
Returned again and decided on an MP4 - lost 50k and CGT's rose another 100k and were moving up at least 10 - 20k per month.
It's a drivers first and a collectors car second miles only matter to collectors.
I very rarely buy new - but have 2 GT slots in hopes to get at least one.
Ford GT guys are cashing in - not a bad idea if it's for a CGT
Last edited by nuvolari612; 03-01-2015 at 02:00 AM.
03-01-2015, 01:52 AM
#1048
Drifting
Well ROI is the question isn't it and I hope you are right ... but the more you drive it the less its worth, as has been pointed out by many, so unfortunately getting to have the 'driving experience' is diametrically opposed to increase in value.
As to the other cars and what you can get for $475k - I don't get the impression that you understand the motives behind collectors as regards the other cars mentioned - they are not bought for their leading edge driving experience.
As to the other cars and what you can get for $475k - I don't get the impression that you understand the motives behind collectors as regards the other cars mentioned - they are not bought for their leading edge driving experience.
2nd point disagree when one gets into this league - Porsche taking it to the extreme as I believe they spent 1M per unit. You are correct about the other cars mentioned.
The CGT has 70 some odd patents - no idea what others think other than collectors i know with many cars buy em to drive em.
03-01-2015, 08:57 AM
#1049
Drifting
03-01-2015, 09:46 AM
#1050
Burning Brakes