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Old 07-05-2017, 07:52 PM
  #46  
SaratogaLefty
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Wing Commander,
That is very interesting information indeed on the mpg results. On the other e-Hybrid thread Thorfun indicated he was getting about 20 mpg when cruising at 70 mph and charging the battery. That seems like a pretty significant drop-off in mileage. Your gas engine and the e-hybrid version are both putting out the same horsepower and essentially the same size engine (3.0 vs. 2.9) so that would imply there is roughly a 33% drop in mpg when using the e-Hybrid in charging mode!! It will be good to hear more information on this subject as we proceed through the various driving modes with the e-Hybrid. I won't have mine until late August/early September so will have to rely on Thorfun, Aj, Step, and Hymo for more detailed information.
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Old 07-05-2017, 08:56 PM
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I believe he is using UK gallons which are 5/4 as big as US gallons.
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Old 07-05-2017, 10:28 PM
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Originally Posted by thorfun View Post
so I went to the dealership and checked out the diesel and I could still get my clubs in sideways.
but, when I picked up the hybrid I was shocked to find that it wasn't so and that both arches are filled in and I have lost a lot of sideways space at the rear of the car and I can no longer fit my clubs in sideways and it's a struggle to get the clubs and trolley in at all.
Do you have a quick pic on the boot? Maybe the Sport Turismo would be the solution?
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Old 07-06-2017, 03:46 AM
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Originally Posted by XT6Wagon View Post
I believe he is using UK gallons which are 5/4 as big as US gallons.
Correct. Yes, as stated, I am in the U.K. And so is Thorfun.

My Panamera 4 has the 3.0 V6 putting out about 330hp. I believe the e-hybrid uses the 2.9 V6, which if memory serves me well, puts out something like 440hp from the petrol engine.
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Old 07-06-2017, 06:45 AM
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The e-Hybrid has a detuned version of the 4S at 330 hp + 136hp from the electric.

On a 30 mile trip with Motorway I have achieved 60 + mpg. Will be taking her for 150 miles on Tuesday so will report after that.

Still not hit the twisty stuff!
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Old 07-06-2017, 09:23 AM
  #51  
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Wing Commander mustn't have as heavy a right foot as me!

today i have done a couple of trips, dropped the kids off at school and had to head for a meeting.

I started with a full charge this morning and all in all i did 66.1 miles and had minimal batter charge when i got back. fuel consumption was 51.0 mpg (UK). and i used the boost button a few times to overtake and wasn't driving slowly/economically all the time.

i am happy with the fun:economy ratio of this car!
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Old 07-06-2017, 12:44 PM
  #52  
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AJ,
What mode do you anticipate using for your 150 mile trip?

Thorfun,
What mode were you using for your 66.1 mile trip during which you averaged 51 mpg?

I agree wholeheartedly this car is for driving in a spirited mode when it suits you and I certainly intend to drive it like a Porsche, not a Prius! My questions are for "scientific purposes" only and to help me get better informed and be prepared when I finally get mine!!
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Old 07-06-2017, 01:12 PM
  #53  
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Hybrid + some Sport on the twisty stuff (if any).

I am taking her for 2,000 miles across Europe in the Summer and I think it makes sense if no charging available (although it seems quite prevalent) to use e-charge if I know there are cities or fun roads coming up. Like the Alps : ). Otherwise, it seems to always have some charge left in regular hybrid so must trickle charge anyway.

This week the car managed only about 15 miles in electric-only when commuting to and from the train station. Lots of stop-start and all steep uphill on the return. Not great but within advertised tolerances. That did include pre-cooling, full a/c and massaging all the way...
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Old 07-06-2017, 11:19 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by SaratogaLefty View Post
Your gas engine and the e-hybrid version are both putting out the same horsepower and essentially the same size engine (3.0 vs. 2.9) so that would imply there is roughly a 33% drop in mpg when using the e-Hybrid in charging mode!
I'm not an e-Hybrid owner anymore, but I did spend some time testing the efficiency of eCharge mode while I still owned my 2015 S eHybrid.

Basically, eCharge saves energy for later. If you start at 20%, fill the battery with eCharge, and then run on ePower until you get back to 20%, you'll get the same mileage overall between both legs if you just ran in Hybrid mode the entire trip. Every mile you add of electric range comes at the cost of mile's worth of gasoline.

Actual charge rate was about 1/2 mile per mile traveled. This translates to a 33% drop in gas mileage, since you're spending 1.5x the fuel and saving 0.5x the energy for later electric travel.

As to why I'm no longer an owner - mostly it's the size. I came from a sport coupe, and thought the size wouldn't bother me as long as the performance was there. I was just never happy with how big the car was, so I traded it for a 991.1 4S.

I still feel a bit bad for trading the car in so quickly, which is why I haunt Panamera boards now and then.
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Old 07-07-2017, 01:28 AM
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Well Gus, your experience correlates well with the inputs I received from Wing Commander (30 miles/gallon) and Thorfun (20 miles/gallon in e-charge mode).
I hear what you are saying about size. I've owned a 356B, a 911SC, and a Boxster S and I raced the 911 for five years. That said, I've also owned a Landrover, three Lexus RX SUV's, and most recently a Lexus F Sport LS. The Lexus F Sport is pretty nice to drive fast and even on twisty roads, but it's not a 911 or Boxster. The Panamera is almost identical in size to the LS. I don't expect the Panamera to act like a 911 but I'm older now and like a little luxury with my handling so I'm anticipating the Panamera will be exactly what I'm looking for in my next vehicle. Almost wish I'd waited for the Turbo S e-hybrid, but maybe in a few years I'll get the Mission E, who knows.
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Old 07-07-2017, 04:55 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by SaratogaLefty View Post
Thorfun,
What mode were you using for your 66.1 mile trip during which you averaged 51 mpg?
Hybrid Auto mode

Originally Posted by SaratogaLefty View Post
I agree wholeheartedly this car is for driving in a spirited mode when it suits you and I certainly intend to drive it like a Porsche, not a Prius! My questions are for "scientific purposes" only and to help me get better informed and be prepared when I finally get mine!!
i agree, but you can't drive it like a Porsche all the time! especially when i have my wife, children and dog in the car. on those family trips it'll be driving with economy in mind and then when i'm on my own i'll let my heavy right foot do the talking.
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Old 07-07-2017, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by thorfun View Post
Hybrid Auto mode



i agree, but you can't drive it like a Porsche all the time! especially when i have my wife, children and dog in the car. on those family trips it'll be driving with economy in mind and then when i'm on my own i'll let my heavy right foot do the talking.
yes I hear you loud and clear!! Same situation for me when driving with the wife. I expect the majority of my driving will be in auto hybrid with occasional use of the boost button. Have you tried the Launch Control from a standing start? How exactly does it know that is what you want to do and how does it work?
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Old 07-07-2017, 12:26 PM
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Not found the opportunity yet...

Fastest launch - Sports +, foot hard on brake then straight to full throttle. Then release brake.
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Old 07-07-2017, 02:37 PM
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Any time I was behind other cars on surface streets, I couldn't drive my Panamera like a Porsche. Even with the lower-HP electric engine (95 HP vs. 136 HP), the electric motor was almost always enough by itself to keep up with traffic.

This leads to another issue I had with the car - I very much wanted it in ePower mode a lot of the time, just because traffic wouldn't let me use Sport (let alone Sport+), but if I suddenly wanted power in a hurry, ePower wasn't going to deliver it. Even with foot to the floor, where it's supposed to wake up and give you everything, it felt slow. I suspect it was the shifting points more than anything else.

Unlike the 2017+ models, the Sport / Sport+ buttons were on the center console instead of the steering wheel, and reaching for either one by feel was just iffy. I think I might have liked the car better if they'd had the mode control on the steering wheel, the way they are now.

Alternately, if the car had been a manual transmission, I could probably have gotten power when I wanted it just through delaying shifts. My impression is that manual is unworkable with a hybrid powertrain, unfortunately.
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Old 07-07-2017, 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Gus_Smedstad View Post
Any time I was behind other cars on surface streets, I couldn't drive my Panamera like a Porsche. Even with the lower-HP electric engine (95 HP vs. 136 HP), the electric motor was almost always enough by itself to keep up with traffic.

This leads to another issue I had with the car - I very much wanted it in ePower mode a lot of the time, just because traffic wouldn't let me use Sport (let alone Sport+), but if I suddenly wanted power in a hurry, ePower wasn't going to deliver it. Even with foot to the floor, where it's supposed to wake up and give you everything, it felt slow. I suspect it was the shifting points more than anything else.

Unlike the 2017+ models, the Sport / Sport+ buttons were on the center console instead of the steering wheel, and reaching for either one by feel was just iffy. I think I might have liked the car better if they'd had the mode control on the steering wheel, the way they are now.

Alternately, if the car had been a manual transmission, I could probably have gotten power when I wanted it just through delaying shifts. My impression is that manual is unworkable with a hybrid powertrain, unfortunately.
in hybrid auto mode if you're running on electric there is still a small delay when you put you foot down. But it's small and hasn't caused me any issues yet. If I can see that I'll need a lot of power quickly then I'll just hit the boost button or switch to sport or sports+ mode.
But im continuously impressed with the power of the electric engine on its own. Just got back from picking my daughter up from a party and I was pulling away from traffic up to 75mph on electric alone.

This all bodes well for mission E!
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