"Protect" HWFMR
12-21-2008, 05:15 PM
#31
12-21-2008, 05:20 PM
#32
Moderator and 993 whisperer
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Thread Starter
Okay . . . I needed time to think about this thing that I started. I will tell you, I have learned that I went about it entirely wrong. What I was TRYING to do was get everyone to pay attention to the rules, as it seems that the enforcement might be taken more seriously than in the past.
Bob went through at least this thread and bleeped out the most offensive vocabulary -- this should tell us not to go overboard on obscenities. Notice he let the less vulgar ones slide. I have done the same in the past, and got ridiculed for it. Ah, it comes with the 'job.' And when I put 'job' in quotes in my initial post, I did not mean that Bob or any other mod doesn't have to work at this . . . it's just that it is in fact a voluntary position that can sometimes seem like a job.
The other thing I was trying to warn you all about are some of the pics posted here. I know I've deleted at least one that was way over the top (in fact, if I recall, she had no top at all), and someone got rid of the 'camel toe' thread when it, too, got out of hand.
The rules that Bob posted should not be new to you, if you read them. I was not attempting to make it seem as if they were new (sorry Bob). I was just wanting to get your guys' attention on the program that is being implemented -- as far as I know the demerits thingee is new. Then again, I don't check into the mods forum half as much as I probably should. I forget sometimes. I will make an effort to stay more informed.
Initially, I tried to get across the above and more in a more fun way, but that did not work well. That or I did not word it in such a way that it would get across the way I had intended. All I really wanted to do was warn you all, without being a bore, that we really need to lighten up a bit on some of the vulgarity and profanity. I have actually been somewhat offended by some of the girlie pics -- but for the most part let it go 'cause I know it's just a bunch of guys having fun. However, if you read the rules, there are exceptions as to what you can post. This is but one example in the guidelines that have been in place since the list was started. If you are unsure of what you can and cannot post, either read those guidelines again, or consult a moderator.
NOW THEN . . . can we please go back to having fun? I am sorry that I brought this subject up and if it were not for my honesty, I'd probably weasel-out of it and delete the thread. But, alas, if I make a fool of myself, I shouldn't hide. I should take my lumps just as any of the rest of us would.
Hang on a minute . . . ahhh . . . there we go . . . fire suit is on.
Bob went through at least this thread and bleeped out the most offensive vocabulary -- this should tell us not to go overboard on obscenities. Notice he let the less vulgar ones slide. I have done the same in the past, and got ridiculed for it. Ah, it comes with the 'job.' And when I put 'job' in quotes in my initial post, I did not mean that Bob or any other mod doesn't have to work at this . . . it's just that it is in fact a voluntary position that can sometimes seem like a job.
The other thing I was trying to warn you all about are some of the pics posted here. I know I've deleted at least one that was way over the top (in fact, if I recall, she had no top at all), and someone got rid of the 'camel toe' thread when it, too, got out of hand.
The rules that Bob posted should not be new to you, if you read them. I was not attempting to make it seem as if they were new (sorry Bob). I was just wanting to get your guys' attention on the program that is being implemented -- as far as I know the demerits thingee is new. Then again, I don't check into the mods forum half as much as I probably should. I forget sometimes. I will make an effort to stay more informed.
Initially, I tried to get across the above and more in a more fun way, but that did not work well. That or I did not word it in such a way that it would get across the way I had intended. All I really wanted to do was warn you all, without being a bore, that we really need to lighten up a bit on some of the vulgarity and profanity. I have actually been somewhat offended by some of the girlie pics -- but for the most part let it go 'cause I know it's just a bunch of guys having fun. However, if you read the rules, there are exceptions as to what you can post. This is but one example in the guidelines that have been in place since the list was started. If you are unsure of what you can and cannot post, either read those guidelines again, or consult a moderator.
NOW THEN . . . can we please go back to having fun? I am sorry that I brought this subject up and if it were not for my honesty, I'd probably weasel-out of it and delete the thread. But, alas, if I make a fool of myself, I shouldn't hide. I should take my lumps just as any of the rest of us would.
Hang on a minute . . . ahhh . . . there we go . . . fire suit is on.
12-21-2008, 05:54 PM
#34
Still plays with cars.
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
I don't see no steeenken thread. Oh, wait, it must be one of those threads, should there in fact be a thread, thread.
12-21-2008, 07:58 PM
#35
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Been traveling from the balmy Rockies to the frigid, bleak midwinter in the Midwest. Looks like I've missed a good discussion.
I'd like to give everyone my thoughts, but want a little time to think it through.
I will say, as has already been said, that the guidelines are just clairification of what everyone has already agreed to live by on Rennlist.
Having been part of the conversations on this in the palatial moderator's lounge, I don't think any will really see any significant change in the HWFM board.
thanks for your patience. More later.
I'd like to give everyone my thoughts, but want a little time to think it through.
I will say, as has already been said, that the guidelines are just clairification of what everyone has already agreed to live by on Rennlist.
Having been part of the conversations on this in the palatial moderator's lounge, I don't think any will really see any significant change in the HWFM board.
thanks for your patience. More later.
12-21-2008, 09:06 PM
#38
12-21-2008, 09:39 PM
#39
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
12-21-2008, 09:49 PM
#40
Moderator and 993 whisperer
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Thread Starter
I can give him a demerit, but he'd like it too much. It's far deeper torture not to give him that much attention.
12-21-2008, 10:00 PM
#41
12-21-2008, 10:59 PM
#42
Moderator and 993 whisperer
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Thread Starter
Serious, Steve??? Bwahahahaha. I can if you want. It'll give you 'street creds'. ROFL.
12-22-2008, 09:59 AM
#43
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
I know most of our reading habits don’t go much beyond comic books. Sorry this is so long, but as a guy named Lincoln once said, “I didn’t have time to write a brief response”
I’ve quoted Bob and Mark’s posts because they’ve already said much of what needed saying.
This board isn’t broken. Could it use a little tweekin’? Yeah. Not as much as in some other areas of Rennlist, but a little understanding can go a long way here as well.
As both Bob and Mark have mentioned, the “new” guidelines aren’t really new. They are clarifications of what everyone has already agreed to.
Even better, they actually cut everyone a little more slack with a means for behind the scenes warnings for inappropriate behavior.
But the fact is, some parts of Rennlist have become very mean and nasty.
Particularly disturbing is the disrespect shown anyone with a differing opinion. Even worse is the way that disrespect is expressed. (Remember, not so much on this board, but elsewhere…)
And the recent election seemed to be a catalyst for it.
Insults seems to be the first retort for some people. Political, ethnic, racial, religious, handicap, gay or sexual preference slurs were everywhere. Avatars and signatures appeared to be solely intended to bait or incite fights.
There is absolutely no need to get into this kind of crap on a car forum, or even on something like OT. And definitely not here.
I did not start Hey Wait For Me Racing to be a mean, nasty place.
It started in 2003 when I switched from the Skippy series to PCA racing and bought the Turtle Car.
HWFMR is what I named my race effort. A couple of race buddies in Chicago liked the idea, and joined in.
I’d already had 3 or 4 years on Rennlist at that point. I started posting about the team’s on-track exploits.
John D and others got a kick out of it, and asked to be team members, due to their similar… uhhh… abilities. Mark and Bob joined early.
In months there were well over a hundred teammates with committees that may or may not exist, and our infamous application process.
Through John’s efforts, we were sponsors of Kevin Buckler’s Le Mans car in ’04.
In 2005, thirty HWFM teammates even went to Le Mans.
Fast forward to January, 2008.
A troll we all know, Ghetto Racer, had reached legendary status among the track oriented members of Rennlist. At the urging of some of us, John D generously devoted a whole forum to the fun and games GR elicited. Unfortunately, over three or four months, that turned ugly. Really ugly.
Frankie was banned, ending the reason for being for the GR Forum.
At which point John, being a loyal teammate, and more importantly an exceedingly generous teammate, volunteered his server space for our inspired nonsense. And IB has generously allowed it to continue.
That’s the history, which hopefully helps you understand what this forum should be.
First on the Racing/DE board and the 993 board, and now on our own HWFMR board, my idea has been to recreate what we all experience and enjoy in the paddock.
A bunch of bright, clever people hanging around, bench racing, trading stories, having fun. We brag a bit, bust some *****, make fun of old guys like Bull and Larry, tell some jokes.
Are some of the jokes off-color? Sure. But not the kind of thing that we couldn't tell in person, in the paddock, in front of our spouses, someone else’s spouses, or someone we didn't know.
Just like in the paddock, it’s certainly not a place to pick fights, with friends or strangers. And just like in the paddock, the asshats are shunned.
These clarified guidelines aren’t going to change that. If it’s appropriate for a bunch of friends standing around in the paddock, it’s appropriate for this board.
We're friends, with the underlying respect friends have for each other.
I love car people. I love DEs. I love racing. I love my weekends at the track.
And what I love about this board is, it feels exactly like what goes on in the paddock.
Nothing has changed about our board. And we are still a unique little corner of Rennlist. I am convinced everybody on the HWFMR board can be just as funny, and still have as just as much fun as we've always had, and live within the guidelines.
How you behave in the paddock is exactly how you should behave here.
Bonnie - HWFMR is a forum "just for us" already. On the other hand it is a public forum, open to all. In case you think the guidelines I posted are new, go read the existing ones, the Rennlist Charter and the Terms of Service you agreed to. All I have done is summarize them and post them in a forum so they are easy to find. I start with the notion that following guidelines is a heck of a lot easier if you know what they are.
Based on what I've seen in the past, this forum is pretty much G rated, deep-uv's recent gesture (now edited) notwithstanding. If I had to describe it in few words to someone, I'd say it is a hangout for HWFMR team-members originally founded to torment GR which has evolved into a place of good humor and friendly teasing. Is there a reason why it can't stay like that in spite of the existing rules?
As to "Infractions" that's a new feature which was added by John D and explained in the Moderators forum and a few public ones as well. All the Mods agreed that infractions are a better and more evenhanded way to deal with problems than an abrupt "vacation" or worse.
If you get an infraction, you are automatically informed. Get too many and then you pay the price. At least you get warnings and can hopefully think about your post before hitting "submit".
In sum, I am quite surprised by your reaction. I think it would be wise to wait for the Big Turtle himself to weigh in. Unless I am mistaken, HWFMR is his team and by extension, this is his forum.
Lastly, I assume you are aware that sigs and avatars are the same no matter where you post, so something which busts the rules will be visible on any forum where you post.
Best,
Based on what I've seen in the past, this forum is pretty much G rated, deep-uv's recent gesture (now edited) notwithstanding. If I had to describe it in few words to someone, I'd say it is a hangout for HWFMR team-members originally founded to torment GR which has evolved into a place of good humor and friendly teasing. Is there a reason why it can't stay like that in spite of the existing rules?
As to "Infractions" that's a new feature which was added by John D and explained in the Moderators forum and a few public ones as well. All the Mods agreed that infractions are a better and more evenhanded way to deal with problems than an abrupt "vacation" or worse.
If you get an infraction, you are automatically informed. Get too many and then you pay the price. At least you get warnings and can hopefully think about your post before hitting "submit".
In sum, I am quite surprised by your reaction. I think it would be wise to wait for the Big Turtle himself to weigh in. Unless I am mistaken, HWFMR is his team and by extension, this is his forum.
Lastly, I assume you are aware that sigs and avatars are the same no matter where you post, so something which busts the rules will be visible on any forum where you post.
Best,
I am not sure what your definition is of "not broken". As a moderator, I can see not only the original posts before they get fixed (like everyone), but the deleted posts as well. I have seen photos and links that range from mild soft core to full on hardcore ****. I have seen personal attacks full of profanity. I have seen a lot of nastiness (especially in OT). I have seen dozens of copyright violations. The list goes on.
If you think those are all acceptable, then I guess nothing was broken. There are essentially no new rules here, as Bob said. We are clarifying the rules that many seem to have forgotten, added a system to provide fair warning and improved the coverage by moderators.
As far as HWFMR, Mike will, I am sure, chime in with his view - this is his team and mostly his forum in which we are guests. But knowing Mike as well as I do, I think he will find that the vast majority of the posts here (in the past) have been just fine. There are some exceptions and they will continue to be dealt with. As I said in my post in theRacing/DE forum, each area has its own personality and I am sure the clarification of the rules is not going to destroy the personality of the HWFMR forum - again I will leave it to Mike to clarify what that personality is and what the purpose of this place is.
If you think those are all acceptable, then I guess nothing was broken. There are essentially no new rules here, as Bob said. We are clarifying the rules that many seem to have forgotten, added a system to provide fair warning and improved the coverage by moderators.
As far as HWFMR, Mike will, I am sure, chime in with his view - this is his team and mostly his forum in which we are guests. But knowing Mike as well as I do, I think he will find that the vast majority of the posts here (in the past) have been just fine. There are some exceptions and they will continue to be dealt with. As I said in my post in theRacing/DE forum, each area has its own personality and I am sure the clarification of the rules is not going to destroy the personality of the HWFMR forum - again I will leave it to Mike to clarify what that personality is and what the purpose of this place is.
This board isn’t broken. Could it use a little tweekin’? Yeah. Not as much as in some other areas of Rennlist, but a little understanding can go a long way here as well.
As both Bob and Mark have mentioned, the “new” guidelines aren’t really new. They are clarifications of what everyone has already agreed to.
Even better, they actually cut everyone a little more slack with a means for behind the scenes warnings for inappropriate behavior.
But the fact is, some parts of Rennlist have become very mean and nasty.
Particularly disturbing is the disrespect shown anyone with a differing opinion. Even worse is the way that disrespect is expressed. (Remember, not so much on this board, but elsewhere…)
And the recent election seemed to be a catalyst for it.
Insults seems to be the first retort for some people. Political, ethnic, racial, religious, handicap, gay or sexual preference slurs were everywhere. Avatars and signatures appeared to be solely intended to bait or incite fights.
There is absolutely no need to get into this kind of crap on a car forum, or even on something like OT. And definitely not here.
I did not start Hey Wait For Me Racing to be a mean, nasty place.
It started in 2003 when I switched from the Skippy series to PCA racing and bought the Turtle Car.
HWFMR is what I named my race effort. A couple of race buddies in Chicago liked the idea, and joined in.
I’d already had 3 or 4 years on Rennlist at that point. I started posting about the team’s on-track exploits.
John D and others got a kick out of it, and asked to be team members, due to their similar… uhhh… abilities. Mark and Bob joined early.
In months there were well over a hundred teammates with committees that may or may not exist, and our infamous application process.
Through John’s efforts, we were sponsors of Kevin Buckler’s Le Mans car in ’04.
In 2005, thirty HWFM teammates even went to Le Mans.
Fast forward to January, 2008.
A troll we all know, Ghetto Racer, had reached legendary status among the track oriented members of Rennlist. At the urging of some of us, John D generously devoted a whole forum to the fun and games GR elicited. Unfortunately, over three or four months, that turned ugly. Really ugly.
Frankie was banned, ending the reason for being for the GR Forum.
At which point John, being a loyal teammate, and more importantly an exceedingly generous teammate, volunteered his server space for our inspired nonsense. And IB has generously allowed it to continue.
That’s the history, which hopefully helps you understand what this forum should be.
First on the Racing/DE board and the 993 board, and now on our own HWFMR board, my idea has been to recreate what we all experience and enjoy in the paddock.
A bunch of bright, clever people hanging around, bench racing, trading stories, having fun. We brag a bit, bust some *****, make fun of old guys like Bull and Larry, tell some jokes.
Are some of the jokes off-color? Sure. But not the kind of thing that we couldn't tell in person, in the paddock, in front of our spouses, someone else’s spouses, or someone we didn't know.
Just like in the paddock, it’s certainly not a place to pick fights, with friends or strangers. And just like in the paddock, the asshats are shunned.
These clarified guidelines aren’t going to change that. If it’s appropriate for a bunch of friends standing around in the paddock, it’s appropriate for this board.
We're friends, with the underlying respect friends have for each other.
I love car people. I love DEs. I love racing. I love my weekends at the track.
And what I love about this board is, it feels exactly like what goes on in the paddock.
Nothing has changed about our board. And we are still a unique little corner of Rennlist. I am convinced everybody on the HWFMR board can be just as funny, and still have as just as much fun as we've always had, and live within the guidelines.
How you behave in the paddock is exactly how you should behave here.
12-22-2008, 10:05 AM
#44
The Penguin King
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
12-22-2008, 10:16 AM
#45
Lifetime Rennlist
Member