I suggest reading this http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showth...rple-etc/page2

Which references this post in another forum

http://forums.noria.com/eve/forums/a...5/m/8381065241

Of note is the comment by the self proclaimed Redline engineer.

Having said that, there are only two Xw50 oils (both from Mobil) on the Porsche approved A30 list, all of the others are Xw40 oils.

See above.

My own experience living in a place which is 30C+ for 9 months of the year and reaches 45C+ frequently during 3 of those months.

All on Mobil1:
2009 GTS 15k km changes, no top between changes, oil always clean at change.
2009 CTT 15k km changes, no top between changes, oil always clean at change.
2005 CTT 20k km changes, 4 litres added between changes, oil always clean at changes and no change in this behaviour in the 130k kms that I have known this car.

The oil temp gauge on all of these cars, no matter how hard they have been pushed, has never moved from 90C

People may not like Exxon Mobil, and it may not be the best oil, but does it need to be? Perhaps an oil which ends up at a 30 weight after extended use is not actually an issue. I'm sure Porsche and Exxon, better than anyone, know the failings of M1 and certainly Exxon Mobil have the wherewithal to change the formulation if it was actually causing issues.

There are certainly, now, plenty of Cayennes here in the Middle East with over 300k km having started life on M1 and are now running on cheap mineral oils; the 05 CTT is now a US$12k, 10 year old, used car and the majority of current owners have no knowledge of or interest in the oil they put in the car...and as I said, there are still plenty of them running.

I continue to use M1 and have no issues with the way my car sounds or runs.

 

+1 I also use Motul. It's a little more expensive but it is sooooo much better than Mobil 1!

 

This is the response I got from RP:
Good Afternoon,
We have several engine oils that will work great in your 2014 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 4.8L engine, however we do not offer a Porsche licensed engine oil. So any of our recommended Royal Purple engine oils may not be considered warranty compliant for your 2014 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S. If OEM warranty compliance is still serious concern you would be served by using a Porsche licensed engine oil.

Once OEM warranty compliance is no longer a concern listed below is our recommended Royal Purple engine oils for your 2014 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 4.8L engine in order from awesome to most awesome in terms of performance and protection.

-Royal Purple SAE 0W-40 (part #11484, quart bottle)
-Royal Purple SAE 5W-40 (part #01540, quart bottle)
-Royal Purple HPS 10W-40 (part #31140, quart bottle)

The HPS 10W-40 is a non-licensed performance upgrade engine oil. The HPS oils offer a higher level of protection and performance than any other street oil and most of our competitors’ “race” oils. Since the HPS oils are not API licensed, they do not have to abide by the chemistry restrictions of those licenses, so there is a higher level of anti-wear additive than the SAE line, and the HPS also features our proprietary Synerlec additive technology. Synerlec increase oil film strength by 3 to 4 times, compared to any other engine oil, and this oil film strength increase reduces friction and metal to metal contact. The result of this is greatly reduced short and long term wear, and increased efficiency of operation (better fuel economy and more power to the ground).

HPS: http://royalpurpleconsumer.com/produ...!hps-motor-oil

Synerlec: http://royalpurpleconsumer.com/about...rple/synerlec/

The SAE 5W-40 and SAE 0W-40 are Eurospec engine oils that are formulated for use in passenger car gasoline and light duty diesel engines. Both oils carry the API-SM and ACEA A3/B3-04 licenses on it, and the SAE 5W-40 also contains our proprietary Synerlec additive technology.

SAE: http://www.royalpurpleconsumer.com/p...ple-motor-oil/
Thank you for choosing Royal Purple, and have a great day!



Well RP is out for now......

I'm amazed that Porsche would use such a basic over the counter motor oil for their performance engines. LR/Jag went to Castol to get a special blend made for their new engines ( petrol and diesel), 2012 they had it so that can only be purchased at a jag/lr dealer. Now BMW is using that blend in their Diesels, and V6 engines as a recommendation.

Well, going to read up more and after the 2-3K brake-in period either stick with mobil one or goto the Motul. Def going to ask the master tech on this coming friday when I pick it up, what they are using or recommending for someone that is above " normal" behind the wheel. I just e-mailed my sales rep and asked him to get me an up to date official document of what is approved by Porsche for brands, blends, and weights as for as tires, oil, and other fluids.

I also wanted to say THANK YOU to everyone that has responded. This is a learning curve for me, and I very much appreciate all your input and advice!

 

^ I'd bet your dealership is using Porsche approved Penzoil 5W40. Many do. Porsche approved and less $.

Sent from my iPhone using Rennlist

 

I have 2009 GTS, I am going with Royal Purple HPS, just like in my Lexus ISF.
I think the hype about the Mobil 1 is exaggerated.

As long as you take care of the maintenance, I think any high performance oil will do the job.

 

Does anyone know what EXACTLY (not speculation) goes in to being on the "Porsche approved" list?

 

Since you are talking breaking in, heed RP's warning. God forbid something major happens to your motor, Porsche will test your oil to make sure it meets the standards and may require proof of OCIs since you aren't taking it to the dealer. Having to pay for a new motor is probably something you don't want to do, so stick with any oil that carries the correct Porsche approval until your warranty is done. Then go for something you think is a better option.

And still charge M1 prices I'm sure!

 

And charge for 10 quarts when they can only fill with 8.

Sent from my iPhone using Rennlist

 

Oil company submits oil sample to Porsche. Porsche sends it to a lab, it gets tested, and either passes or fails. If it's approved, the oil company then agrees to pay a hefty licensing fee to list the Porsche approval on the bottle, and is added to the approval list. When they stop paying this licensing fee, they are removed from the list and can no longer list the Porsche approval. If the oil company doesn't submit a sample, they aren't listed on the approval list, and can't list the Porsche approval spec. Oil companies know which oils will meet the approval, but typically only submit one or two types because of the licensing fees. Some oil companies won't bother submitting a sample because it's just too expensive to pay all the licensing fees (Amsoil and Redline, for example). Some oil types just aren't profitable to submit samples (tranny fluid rarely gets changed, and thus, no point in getting on the approval list).

There isn't anything special about the Porsche spec since anywhere you see it, you'll also see the VW/Audi, and a number of other german car specs. Motul's spec list for the oils is seemingly a mile long, giving you an idea of just how ordinary the Porsche spec is.

Some think that since it's not on the approval list, it must not be a good oil. That's simply not true. Whether to get on any approval list or not is just a revenue game. Small companies like Amsoil, Redline, Brad Penn - it's just far too costly given the quantities they sell. Other companies will not see much revenue from a certain car company, and if they think the approval isn't netting them much money, they'll get off of it.

This is how it works for all the approval lists from the various car companies. It's not just an FYI to the drivers from Porsche - it's a revenue stream for them.

 

This is both the most naive statement on oil one could make, and the smartest one.

There are two basic approaches to oil and cars. The first is that you follow the factory spec knowing it's probably a good oil, but maybe not the best. I mean, there are dozens of oil reports out there for M1 showing it shearing out of grade, but like you said, does it matter? You get a bit more consumption, wear metals are slightly up, but that's it. Motors are burning down, and lots of people for years have pushed beyond 300K miles with M1. So, to your point - does any of this matter? I would say probably not. It's no secret M1 shears out, and I'm sure Porsche is well aware of it. But, like you said, in the grand scheme of things, it's probably not a problem.

But - to say that it's the best choice is like saying chinese tires are OK to run because they roll, stop, and corner just fine if driven like a normal human being. M1, while approved by Porsche, is most certainly not the best, or even close to the top, for what a "good oil" is. So, if you *DO* want a good oil in your car that will perform better, then you need to know how to make an informed decision. Do you need to run a better oil? No. Clearly, thousand of cars out there running M1, like yourself, and they're doing just fine. Ambient temps only matter if the oil temp rises (like in an air-cooled car). So, the fact that you live where it's well over 100 degrees outside doesn't much matter if the car can keep the oil temps in check.

Is M1 an adequate oil. I would say yes. Sure, you can look at an oil report and see that it wears slightly more than other oils, but just because it's more or less may not actually correlate to longevity. My guess is these motors will last longer than any of us will likely drive them if cared for and driven appropriately. But, if you want a better oil - you have a lot of options. I mean - car guys don't make decisions based on what is necessary to get buy. Sometimes, you just want a better quality product. If you're willing to spend the money on a better oil that will perform better, I don't see why this is a bad thing. Everyday this forum discusses the pros and cons to things. Oil - somehow - is like talking about religion, or climate change. It's like everyone's rational and ability to interpret data just goes right out the window.

If the approval rating is an indication that the oil is great, then it's not saying much for the approval rating if M1 can't stay in grade for very long, but is the choice oil from the dealer. On the other hand, what's it saying about the overall discussion about the fine details of motor oil, if a car spec'ing 0W40 up to 5W50 can run a 0W30 just fine? This goes back to should you care. If you don't care, run M1. Nothing terrible will happen. If you do care, then lots of good data out there to make an informed decision.

I just think it's silly to use the fact that many cayennes haven't burned down as evidence to why you should just run M1, and ignore the actual data that indicates what's a good oil. I mean - with that rational, why don't we just run chinese tires and aftermarket parts? Why do we put in any effort at all into keeping these cars in top shape, use data metrics and cost profiles to evaluate everything, and then when it comes to oil - through it all out the window?

 

Not to throw wood on the fire here, but also the issue of Mobil not paying corp taxes for the past 15+years is an issue with me as well. I do my best to avoid giving Exxon/Mobil, Walmart, and couple others, because of their business practices, employee treatment, screwing over this country (USA) in tax evading tactics. Then the oil billionaires cry broke that they lost billions because of the oil prices. Just sends me on a rant about those greedy bastards, ESP Exxon/Mobil thats made billions off everyone during the 08/09/10 market issues and is now crying they are seeing losses. Just my 2-cents for whatever it's worth.

ANYHOW.... I spoke with my dealer this morning on my 3 hr drive to NYC, The master tech suggested leaving the mobil one in for 2-3K miles break-in, and then doing an oil change to Castol or Pennzoil. I told him that I am known to put 4-6K a month on my vehicles so he said I'd be one of the few in his 23 years of a Porsche tech to put on that many miles in a month. I jokingly told him to expect to see me for oil changes every other month. He laughed and said " Finally someone will use their vehicle as intended ".

 

My 2-cents… and I know this is a Porsche Forum so I apologize. However, I feel your comments are unreservedly misinformed. Unfortunately people tend to formulate their opinion and perception from what the media provide, rather than from researching facts. Popular perception is oil companies, like ExxonMobil, are greedy bustards that screw all mankind. However, this is simply not true. Yes, they make big bucks; but they also spend big bucks and they employ hundreds of thousands of people with significantly higher than median wages, all across the globe… wages sufficient for buying Porsches, second homes, college educations, paying for Obama care, etc. And what’s wrong with that?

History would suggest oil companies are responsible for more world good than bad. And per capita, they have better human rights records than companies you likely hold fond; such as Apple and Nike. Explore any component of running an energy company and see how much it costs to do anything - it’s absolutely staggering. Look into operating costs and liability risk, it may change your perception. Energy companies need to be big or they can’t exist in today’s world.

 

Wow... OK let me put more information into my statement.

My team is responsible of card transactions & auditing for many of the oil companies retail locations. Here is some information for you
1: exxon/mobile only has 63,219 employees after their latest layoffs
2: Shell has 112,825
3: BP has 105,024
4: Chevron has 83,708

Why do I know this ? because they have to disclose active employee counts, and employee discount cards given to employees that my company is responsible for their card transactions worldwide on a daily basis.

Exxon is also known and have admitted they are the worse environmental polluters of them all, because and I quote " It's easier and less expensive to clean up, than to prevent" That was a quote from a executive at Exxon. They ( Exxon) even tried to get my company to host the servers in Ireland for the transactions so that they wouldn't have to claim the income on US corp income taxes ! That is how slick that sleezy company is. I have e-mails as proof of this as-well. Yes Sony, Apple, and many others are just as guilty, but one thing I know for a fact is that I know and see the transactions , know the contracts and agreements very well, and know where many companies transactions are really happening stateside or offshore, and who is avoiding their fair share of taxes. I also know the exact numbers for all of north america for all retail location. My team, and I have been called into court more times than I can count to verify their lies on IRS statements. Shell, Exxon, and Irving has dropped us because we refused to lie about the investigations . But they've come back to us because of the detailed information, reliability of our worldwide network, and our technologies for card transactions I've been in the card processing business for over 21 years. I find it very entertaining with people defend Exxon, Walmart, GM, John Deere , Amazon, Ford, Comcast, AT&T, Apple,Walt Disney when I am the one getting the e-mails, conference calls, or when the sheriff shows up in the office or my home to hand me a court subpena I cringe because it's probably for one of our " top 10 high maintenance clients" trying to avoid disclosing income, get out of taxes , or lied about amount of their transactions.

Don't assume, it just makes people look foolish. I like apple products, I'm not " fond" of them( they are also a client of ours), I don't like Nike they are over priced and cheaply made and worse than walmart or apple with human rights. I don't watch the news media it's a joke and 80% lies. Again, don't assume. You don't know me, or what I know, of companies and their transactions. My team did $3.68 trillion ( yes trillion) in merchant transactions I know A LOT about many companies, their financials and we get federally escorted to DC often to testify in-front of congress, Senate, IRS, FBI, SEC and for class actions law suits against our top-10 and many others.

If you'd like to discuss further you can PM me. This is not the place for this off topic discussion. It was simple & at a HIGH level voicing my 2-cents on why I did not want to use Exxon, and what my other options were for motor oil in my soon to be new vehicle.

Now back to topic !

I'm hearing I should also carry 2-3 quarts of oil because of oil consumption during and after break-in? is this true? Should I just buy a case of oil during the break-in because of the amount of driving I do?

Thanks for all your input it is greatly appreciated as I and still learning the ins and outs of being new in the Porsche world.

 

Thanks. Good discussion. I figured the dollar was involved in being on the approved list. What would you say the "best" oil for the Cayenne is, in fact? RP? Motul?

From a testing standpoint, that article showed substantial result for that test, but do those results translate into greater or less wear on the engine?

This exact discussion on a F250 forum is how I ended up putting CAT ELC in my diesel. Lots of big brains and good research suggesting Ford was wrong on their recommendation of their brand coolant.

 

It goes back to what Mcbit said. Sure, you can see measurable wear differences with different oils being used, but I've never seen any evidence to suggest that the small PPM differences in the wear metals actually translates to a substantial life decrease in the motor. I mean, logic would state that yes - the motor will wear out faster. But, that could just mean the difference between 600K miles and 550K miles. I highly doubt anyone here will own a Cayenne up to that many miles, and be the sole owner.

There is no real "best" oil for any car. There are good oils, and a handful of great oils. But, I think the actual ROI for a great oil is debatable. And that rational of getting the best for our cars also ties into "why do we need to drive expensive cars, and then go mediocre with the fluids?" For most people - there is a reward that goes beyond just transportation from point A to point B when owning a great car. It's a whole-ownership experience, and part of that is the enjoyment of taking great care of something that will reward you in kind. So, if you fall into that category, then do some research to see what you want to get out of your oil. Some people don't like changing weights for the winter. Some people want less consumption. Some want shear stability. Some want lots of anti-wear additives.

For cheap, readily available, and well documented oil - Shell T6 is hard to beat. It's what I'm currently running, but will be switching to Redline. Mobil 5W40 TDT is also a really great oil. Actually, most HDEO oils for with diesel specs are fantastic oils. Lots of anti-wear, very shear stable, and usually easy to find. Amsoil and Redline are expensive, hard to find locally, but regarded as some of the best fluids anywhere. Motul is also fantastic, is a group IV oil, on the approval list, and is more readily available. Royal Purple has good fluids, too, but I don't know much about them. German Castrol 0W30 is often used in place of M1 0W40, and is a bit more shear stable. I mean, you're starting off with a heavy 30 weight in the GC formula, and that's basically where you end up with on M1.

You have tons of options, and while some differences are very noticeable (consumption, cold starts, etc), life expectancy of your motor shouldn't be a concern if you're picking a relatively good fluid.