steve_Cayenne

Yup, AWD/4WD has absolutely no advantage while stopping. In fact the "heavy SUV" + wide tires + additional speed you were able to reach because of the 4 wheel traction, puts you at a disadvantage.

Too many people don't understand this! Those people can often be found in the ditch!

This was in the Cayenne??? Winter tires?

Cole

Well......technically......there is no "added traction" with 4wd/AWD


What you experience is each wheel having to do less work.

For example: a 2wd car that weighs 4,000 needs each drive wheel to move 2,000lbs of weight. The same car with 4wd only has to move 1,000lbs of weight per wheel. Making it easier to get going. Since each wheel has to do half as much work its less likely to slip a tire.

Obviously since the brakes always work on all 4 wheels in every car it doesn't change the dynamics ever.

The real issue isn't that "people don't understand" as much as it is "people don't perceive it to be as slick as it is with 4wd". Think ouat this: If you step on the gas in your 2wd car and it spins the tires you immediately think its slick out. Step on the gas in a 4wd and it simply moves forward, giving you the sense that there is plenty of grip.

So this issue is more of perception than simply "not understanding" (of course understanding at even a deeper level helps all around)

steve_Cayenne

Two dozen of one, and 24 of the other:

2WD uses two tires of traction to create forward movement, 4WD uses four tires worth of traction. Yes, making it less likely for 4 wheels of traction be overdrawn by engine torque causing slippage. Long story short, 4WD = faster forward movement on the slippery surface.

4WD does not provide extra traction for steering.
4WD does not provide extra traction for braking.

Since you can accelerate faster, the bigger the bang when you can't stop/turn! Not just perception, you can take off faster with 4WD getting you in trouble. 2WD stuck in the driveway, does not get into an accident

endless_corners

two words: SNOW TIRES!

Cole

Haha...... Did you speed read my post or actually take the time to understand it?




How fast you got to 60 has no bearing on your ability to stop or turn! Your perception of how slick it is out will effect how you try to stop or turn!

endless_corners

You guys should agree more often.. makes an entertaining argument.

steve_Cayenne

I feel like I am playing verbal chess ... but yes I must apologize for using inaccurate wording:

Since you can accelerate faster, the bigger the bang when you can't stop/turn!

meant to say:

Since you may be capable of achieving a higher velocity (in a set time or distance), before having to stop on a slick surface, it will take a longer distance to come to a stop increasing possibility of collision.

Cole

You are still missing the point. It's not just about wording.

What about two cars that are just cruising along at the same speed on a long *** highway? The one that ends up in the ditch is usually the one that underestimated how slick it was out. Has nothing to do with how fast each one of them got up to speed. It has do with how easily it was to get up to speed without some sign that the road was slick. 2wd gives you signs of a slick road 2x faster than a 4wd. Even when its not slick enough to make a significant difference in overall normal driving acceleration.

endless_corners

Well by that logic people with snow tires would get up to speed faster... does that mean they end up in the ditch more?

Cole

Now your talking about actual grip though. Not the difference in 2wd and 4wd and why people tend to see lots of 4x4 in the ditch.

endless_corners

gotcha

steve_Cayenne

No, because winter tires also greatly improve breaking and steering, allowing you to avoid the ditch.

I am not disagreeing with your point, just disagreeing with your disagreement of my point.

dale59911

Thanks for the input. I have driven Subarus (great on snow) and for the last 12 years a Toyota Highlander (yep the same one...buy and hold does not just apply to good stocks :-) ) Both were excellent vehicles on snow although I do use studded snow tires for that little little extra help.

I am really looking forward to the Cayenne.

Thanks again.

mudman2

ok lets end this I just put my sneakers on her today, no more snow please

mtnrat

I always test the roads around here every time I get on the snow or ice covered hwy. I get it up to about 40 mph and hit the binders and see what happens. I can pretty much guess as to the traction I will have, but that gives me real time info. If I am driving a long distance I will repeat as I feel appropriate.