DUMP THE PAPRIKA AND GIVE US OUR 911 BACK.
07-31-2002, 02:32 PM
#76
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Christian, one must be thoughtful about going bar-hopping w/ a Finn... the last time I did, we only made it to 1 bar & I don't recall much afterwards... and these were Univ. Profs.! Anyway, I'll try almost anything to create harmony & extend knowledge...
Adrian, as always your insight & sources are impeccable. All-in-all, regardless of the vehemence of discourse around here, we are all enthusiastic about Porsches & competition... so no wonder.
Adrian, as always your insight & sources are impeccable. All-in-all, regardless of the vehemence of discourse around here, we are all enthusiastic about Porsches & competition... so no wonder.
07-31-2002, 02:46 PM
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A smart business man always diversifies his company. A niche market is only a profitable market during good times. People stop purchasing toys (such as Porsches, lambos, and Ferrari's) when the market goes south. Why do you think that Mercedes built an SUV.
Those things are huge here in the U.S. Why wouldn't you want to get a piece of the action. An SUV that looks like a Porsche and has the reliability and quality that a porsche is known for. Versus oh, let's see a $60,000 piece of crap Lincoln Navigator, that gets 8 mpg. Or, let's see what else, a Lexus....
A truck(Suv)is useful in all climates, all terrains, look at the Range Rover, those things have been around for decades, in Africa, the states, Europe.
It's not that Porsche want's to get out of the sports car market. Look at the early nineties for example, small market recession, Porsche almost went bankrupt. Simply because they were in a niche and fancy cars aren't sold easily when people are being frugal.
Simple Really. I like the SUV, they split chasis design costs with VW. Who is also going to release their SUV later this year. I think Porsche is doing a fine job of diversifying the business. Who cares if they add another model, that means they only have three different cars with variations. Besides it's got a beefed up 928 V-8 in it!!! Who can deny it???
Those things are huge here in the U.S. Why wouldn't you want to get a piece of the action. An SUV that looks like a Porsche and has the reliability and quality that a porsche is known for. Versus oh, let's see a $60,000 piece of crap Lincoln Navigator, that gets 8 mpg. Or, let's see what else, a Lexus....
A truck(Suv)is useful in all climates, all terrains, look at the Range Rover, those things have been around for decades, in Africa, the states, Europe.
It's not that Porsche want's to get out of the sports car market. Look at the early nineties for example, small market recession, Porsche almost went bankrupt. Simply because they were in a niche and fancy cars aren't sold easily when people are being frugal.
Simple Really. I like the SUV, they split chasis design costs with VW. Who is also going to release their SUV later this year. I think Porsche is doing a fine job of diversifying the business. Who cares if they add another model, that means they only have three different cars with variations. Besides it's got a beefed up 928 V-8 in it!!! Who can deny it???
07-31-2002, 04:38 PM
#78
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Dear Adrian
Yes Freddie's contribution towards PAG's successes over the last few years ought to be put in context with the real Boss, Dr Wiedeking.
He is no doubt due the real credits in ringing the changes and procuring Porsche's rennaisance over the last decade. Reading back over a few of my posts on the subject of Freddie, many of the compliments paid really ought to be aimed closer to home. He certainly seems to walk on water in the minds of those I have met in Germany.
Interesting to speculate about the relationship between the two and the "power" that PCNA holds over PAG in decision making. From the wilds of Scotland, America is a long way away, much further than Europe in our thinking, despite our large Eurosceptic contingent here in the UK. The gradual increase in the importance of the US market to PAG over the years is probably a whole different thread in itself......
Yes Freddie's contribution towards PAG's successes over the last few years ought to be put in context with the real Boss, Dr Wiedeking.
He is no doubt due the real credits in ringing the changes and procuring Porsche's rennaisance over the last decade. Reading back over a few of my posts on the subject of Freddie, many of the compliments paid really ought to be aimed closer to home. He certainly seems to walk on water in the minds of those I have met in Germany.
Interesting to speculate about the relationship between the two and the "power" that PCNA holds over PAG in decision making. From the wilds of Scotland, America is a long way away, much further than Europe in our thinking, despite our large Eurosceptic contingent here in the UK. The gradual increase in the importance of the US market to PAG over the years is probably a whole different thread in itself......
07-31-2002, 04:42 PM
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Kevin
Bar-Hopping is a bit of a speciality for me - I make my living from owning a few!!
As for Finn's abilities in that department, you should bear in mind that us Scots have a lot in common with the the Finns - we both do after all consistently produce the best drivers from the smallest of countries......
I'll duck now <img src="graemlins/icon107.gif" border="0" alt="[icon107]" />
Bar-Hopping is a bit of a speciality for me - I make my living from owning a few!!
As for Finn's abilities in that department, you should bear in mind that us Scots have a lot in common with the the Finns - we both do after all consistently produce the best drivers from the smallest of countries......
I'll duck now <img src="graemlins/icon107.gif" border="0" alt="[icon107]" />
07-31-2002, 10:51 PM
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Adrian,
Debate coach or just plain sage would be a better description...
And I totally agree that GT3 is poorly covered. Hats off to the Racer's Group for the great year they are having. Perhaps some day cable will let us dial in the race we want to watch - and pick the actual cars we want to follow. And it is good to know PAG is somewhat involved.
But I'm curious about something else you said...
[quote]I very much doubt that Freddie has much influence in Stuttgart. He is big in the USA because the PCNA is the official Porsche distributor for the USA but it is a long way from the real power at Porsche which lies in the boards and the shareholders.<hr></blockquote>
So when Fatuous Freddie is interviewed, and quoted in magazines, and heard giving speeches about how he brought Japanese manufacturing techniques to Porsche, and how he pushed the firm to build the P-fish is he just a big blow hard?
Christian,
[quote]...discussions here about the Cayenne, Racing etc are being done in good humor and in the vein of good natured but passionate bar-room debate, nothing more <hr></blockquote>
Yep, you can pretty much count on me playing the bar cynic - as I top off another cold one (we prefer them cold here) <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />
Debate coach or just plain sage would be a better description...
And I totally agree that GT3 is poorly covered. Hats off to the Racer's Group for the great year they are having. Perhaps some day cable will let us dial in the race we want to watch - and pick the actual cars we want to follow. And it is good to know PAG is somewhat involved.
But I'm curious about something else you said...
[quote]I very much doubt that Freddie has much influence in Stuttgart. He is big in the USA because the PCNA is the official Porsche distributor for the USA but it is a long way from the real power at Porsche which lies in the boards and the shareholders.<hr></blockquote>
So when Fatuous Freddie is interviewed, and quoted in magazines, and heard giving speeches about how he brought Japanese manufacturing techniques to Porsche, and how he pushed the firm to build the P-fish is he just a big blow hard?
Christian,
[quote]...discussions here about the Cayenne, Racing etc are being done in good humor and in the vein of good natured but passionate bar-room debate, nothing more <hr></blockquote>
Yep, you can pretty much count on me playing the bar cynic - as I top off another cold one (we prefer them cold here) <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />
07-31-2002, 11:26 PM
#82
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[quote]Originally posted by Kevin E Davis:
<strong>or is it the smallest drivers from the hardest-drinking countries?</strong><hr></blockquote>
That sounds about right!
Maybe that's why we're so fast when it comes to motor racing, no fear... <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />
OK everyone, let have some more so that we can heat up this battle again! I can still type, so that means I'm totally sober! <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
Christian,
I'll bet a pint (ok, and double Scotch on the side too) that Marcus beats Colin & Richard this year! <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />
<strong>or is it the smallest drivers from the hardest-drinking countries?</strong><hr></blockquote>
That sounds about right!
Maybe that's why we're so fast when it comes to motor racing, no fear... <img src="graemlins/c.gif" border="0" alt="[ouch]" />
OK everyone, let have some more so that we can heat up this battle again! I can still type, so that means I'm totally sober! <img src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" border="0" alt="[cheers]" />
Christian,
I'll bet a pint (ok, and double Scotch on the side too) that Marcus beats Colin & Richard this year! <img src="graemlins/drink.gif" border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" />
08-01-2002, 10:59 AM
#83
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Dear mpm,
Thank you for bringing a smile to my face. I do not mean this in a bad way either. I am the foreigner in the germanic world. Believe me, the top brass of PAG do not care what young Freddie takes credit for, or says. Freddies´ job is to sell lots of Porsches in the USA. If he needs to to think he important to achieve his emplyoment goals then they let him think he is important. In business we all know, nobody is really important and the business goes on. PAG senior management do not watch American TV anyway. You see this is a very germanic attitude. They know who is really in control and when you step over the line they reel you back in.
There is only one chief of Porsche. In the business world in Europe he is up there at the top. Highly sought after as well.
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4
PS: Please also remember that the current management inherited the SUV deal. They were sort of forced to try and make it work. Nobody really knows their deep seated feelings about it. The stories told above nobody can verify because there is almost nobody left in PAG from these days. I met one of the last ones last year just before he retired. Also remember that PAG is still very much a family affair. Also no foreigners on the boards either.
Thank you for bringing a smile to my face. I do not mean this in a bad way either. I am the foreigner in the germanic world. Believe me, the top brass of PAG do not care what young Freddie takes credit for, or says. Freddies´ job is to sell lots of Porsches in the USA. If he needs to to think he important to achieve his emplyoment goals then they let him think he is important. In business we all know, nobody is really important and the business goes on. PAG senior management do not watch American TV anyway. You see this is a very germanic attitude. They know who is really in control and when you step over the line they reel you back in.
There is only one chief of Porsche. In the business world in Europe he is up there at the top. Highly sought after as well.
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4
PS: Please also remember that the current management inherited the SUV deal. They were sort of forced to try and make it work. Nobody really knows their deep seated feelings about it. The stories told above nobody can verify because there is almost nobody left in PAG from these days. I met one of the last ones last year just before he retired. Also remember that PAG is still very much a family affair. Also no foreigners on the boards either.
08-02-2002, 07:20 AM
#85
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Dear mpm,
There are some that say that I got all I deserved this year. I do not know what I really deserve but I wish 2002 never happened and I wish I deserved nothing,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4
There are some that say that I got all I deserved this year. I do not know what I really deserve but I wish 2002 never happened and I wish I deserved nothing,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4
