Freipo

Hello..
I've been lurking on this site for some time now and have been lusting over Porsches for years. So I finally decided to sign up and ask some questions.

I remember the first time I saw a Porsche, I was 8 years old and I broke my arm. My orthopedic doctor had a black 964 Turbo and I thought it was the most amazing thing on four wheels. Well now I'm 24 and a Captain on a towboat in the Gulf region. I've been stopping in at Euroclassics in Richmond, VA over the past couple months and have got my eyes set on a 2001 Boxster S or a 1991 964 C2 cabriolet. I know, totally different cars so it's like apples and oranges, lol. Both cars look well taken care of. I finally set up a test drive for Saturday.

I've noticed that Euroclassics seems a little overpriced, but it seems like they've got everything in order. I'll be trading a Volvo S60R ( a bad*ss car by the way)plus cash so hopefully they'll come down in price some. My price ceiling is 24k.

I first looked at the Boxster S, but lately have been doing alot of research online about the IMS, RMS, and other issues with the m96 engine. I've been kind of leaning away from the water cooled Porsches just for that reason. I have the money to replace the engine if the IMS ever failed, but I really dont want to and I dont really want to have to worry about it happening to me.

Then I took notice to the older air cooled Porsches again. 993s are out of my price range, as are the new GT2/3s and Turbos. Then I noticed their 1991 C2 cabriolet. IMHO I prefer the look of the 964 to the 993. It's older but I dont have to worry about it's IMS failing and blowing up, although as an older car I can expect to have to shell out some extra $ for routine and preventative maintenance. It also has backseats, if that's what you'd call them, lol. It seems like the engines in the 964s are almost bulletproof and overall are a better made car.

If I do decide to get one I am planning on having a PPI done at Lufteknic in Richmond.

So does anyone here have any experience dealing with Euroclassics in Richmond? Lufteknic? Any opinions on whether the 964 or Boxster S? Any input will be greatly appreciated. Thanks

I also posted this over in the 964 forum to get their opinions..

Macster

No experience with the outlet you name.

As for the choices of cars... Boxster vs. 964 (even a Cab) is apples to oranges in many respects. Mid-engine vs. rear-engine. Water cooled vs. air cooled. Roadster vs. cab/coupe. The 964 has rear seats, but you try sitting in one for any length of time. I use the rear seats in my 996 Turbo for cargo space, not for carrying passengers.

You need to make up your mind which to get.

While I'm sure the 964 is a nice car the newest one is going on what 17 years old? Might be a nice car to own if one wanted to mess around with the car as a hobby/sideline but I prefer driving Porsches to working on them, so I like a newer example.

Boxsters can be reliable. I've racked up over 228K miles in my 02 base. Original engine. Original clutch. Heads have never been off car. Find a 964 with that many miles whose engine can say the same thing. No can do, I'd guess.

Furthermore, I dare say you'll *not* find a sweeter handling car, one that puts all other cars to shame, save those (mMid-engine exotica) costing 10 or more times as much.

Sincerely,

Macster.

FilthyF14

I'm writing from Va Bch and First Settlers Region of PCA. Euroclassics and Lufteknik are both club supporters with great reputations. Agree with Macster - completely different cars. Love the handling, performance, looks, features and realibility of my 02 Boxster S. Like the looks and heritage of the 964 but wouldn't trade because of the age and technology differences.

MikeBat

Personal opinion, I prefer the Boxster platform over the 964 CAB platform, hands down.

964 coupe... well, that is a completely different conversation.

But top down car vs top down car of the 964's vintage.... Boxster, all the way

wellcraft290

macster I think you should head to teh 964 forum and you will see lots of high mile examples of the 964 motor. Most will say it is bulletproof.
I will not say anything bad about the boxster they do handle well but a little underpowered in base form.
You really have to drive both and see if you like one over the other and if you like a car that is very pure with the modern conviences or a more electric computerized water cooled car with less storage.

Marc Gelefsky

Freipo,

Welcome to Rennlist! you may want to even add a 996 to your shopping list as the early ones can be had at great prices, that said I have owned a Boxster S and it's a great car, I also have had plenty of time behind the wheel of 964's and that are awesome cars as well. I suggest you drive them all and see what you like best!

Freipo

Well, I just got back from Euroclassics. What an experience, I'm completely amazed by the way the cars handled and drove. I ended up taking out an 2001 Boxster S and a 2003 Boxster S. Unfortunately the 964 wasn't there. I was concentrating on the '01 but they came back and would only give me 6500 for my car. Which I can't do. So the Volvos on craigslist and going in the paper next week. I'll def. be getting some kind of Porsche as even the Boxsters pretty much blew away every other vehicle I'd ever ridden in. They had a '97 993 at the dealership and that car was awesome, it seemed like it was build like a tank. I'd like to check out a 964 and an earlier 996 like someone else here recommended before I make a final decision. I imagine I'll have some time being as I have to sell my car first. Thanks for all the input guys..

sjfehr

You're going to have a hard time beating a Boxster S for fun Dealers are great for research and test drives and general market research, but you're going to get way better deals both buying and selling if you go for-sale-by-owner. Chances are you'll find an 03 for what you'd pay for an 01 at the dealer, and you'll get much more for your Volvo, too. Check out autotrader and the local classifieds. Drive to PA or SC if that's where the "right" car is. Don't skimp on the PPI. And be patient, it may take some time before the right car for you goes up for sale.

The 03 has a glass rear window, cupholders and a glove box, so keep that in mind when you decide.

dave morris

No offense meant, but .... huh??

sjfehr

You may laugh, but little things like cupholders are extremely important to the driveability of a car that has dual roles as both a toy and daily transportation. Not necessarily a make-or-break thing, but certainly factored into my likes/dislikes when I was testdriving. Porsches simply have crappy cupholders- if they have any at all. S2000 has better cupholders, but put them in an asinine spot where you can't reach it. Corvette cupholders seemed designed specifically to accomodate 80oz superbiggulps, and then immediately spill them. It's a real shame these cars can't be designed with decent g-resistant cupholders from the factory. Such a little thing, should be trivial to include!

Don't worry, Freipo, don't let the weekend drivers bug you, there are aftermarket cupholders for those of us who live in our cars 2 hours a day

Macster

My 02 Boxster has more storage space than my 03 Turbo. I can get two large soft bags in the front trunk of my Boxster when only one will fit in my Turbo's front trunk.

Then of course there is the rear trunk for stuff as well. The Turbo's rear seats will hold some "cargo" but it is awkward to move stuff in and out of the rear seats while avoiding marring the leather.

I agree that driving both is called for. They are as has been pointed out quite different cars. Not only in age but in implementation.

Early on before I bought the Boxster I considered a variety of older Porsches from a 968 to an older 911 model. I decided though that save for perhaps a '95 to '97 993 earlier 911 models just too old for my requirements. (Shortly after I bought my 02 Boxster I could have also picked up a nice low miles 968 which I declined and kick myself to this day for doing so.)

I use my cars rain or shine, summer or winter, for daily commuting to long distance (4000+ mile week long road trips) touring and reliability with comfort very important to me. For instance: autoclimate control a must have given the climate conditions I sometimes find myself in while driving cross country.

Just didn't feel an older car would deliver this kind of performance and reliability and comfort. Plus I really wanted to try out a mid-engine car and I looked at a Toyota MR2 but its total lack of any storage space meant it would not be useable for my touring trips and Ferraris were out of my price range.

I read several Porsche magazines and articles by owners with older 911s and it seems the cars are always in need of some attention. In some areas the cars are not driven in the winter and during this down time the cars are worked on, various areas refurbished. The owners seem to take some pleasure from this activity which is ok, but I do not have the place or the time to do this work though I still think I'm capable of it.

My time with my Boxster has been so good that in early 09 I bought a new 08 Cayman S. I never use the top down mode with my Boxster but I sure do like the dynamics of the mid-engine layout. Unfortunately I lost the CS to an accident (not my fault) and I tried to replace it with a similar car but got introduced to the 996 Turbo, did some research and found out how underrated these cars are and how affordable they are then searched for and found a good example and bought it.

I like this 996 Turbo car very much and it suits my daily and touring needs nicely - when I bought the CS I traded in my "tourer" an 06 GTO ( a pretty good car but GM service sucks so bad I got tired of dealing with it and sold the car) -- but I continue to own and drive the Boxster. It is a bit lighter on its feet if you will than the Turbo and a bit easier to get around in and a bit more economical, too.

Besides driving the Boxster especially the 60 miles a day commute keeps me from racking up huge miles on the Turbo, though since I bought it June of last year I have added nearly 20K miles to its 9500 miles.

The 964 is for some people the ideal car. But it is not for everybody. The same can be said for Boxster/Cayman and of course for any of the other older or newer Porsches. But for a driver that really wants a Porsche, there's a Porsche out there with his or her name on it.

The trick is to learn which Porsche that is.

Sincerely,

Macster.

mikefocke

I value my '01 S Boxster at ~$16.5k with 56k miles needing nothing (not for sale but to give you a price point). No idea what the VA dealer is asking but keep in mind that www.cars.com has about 1200 Boxsters for sale today...there are a lot out there. So shop around, don't fall in love with one car, and don't overpay. Posted prices are asking prices and no one pays those in this economic climate.

If I was worried about the IMS, I'd take it (or ship it) to Jake Raby at www.flat6innovations.com (just above Atlanta) and have him put in a new clutch, rear main seal and IMS bearing for ~$3k. If I were buying, I might even buy a Boxster with a broken engine just so he could rebuild it and I'd have a tuned, well sorted, reliable, almost completely new engine. That wouldn't be as cheap but would have long term reliability benefits and give me a boost in torque and power while not sacrificing driveability. He might even be able to find you a car he has done one or the other to...

racer

the 964 is a classic. but in choosing between a Boxster S and a 964 Cab, the Boxster S wins. Much more modern feeling and driving car. Better performing as well. Cheaper to buy. Regular maintenance should be less as well (cmon, who want to worry about Valve adjustments anymore )

Heck, at $24K, you are approaching 987 based used car prices.. and certainly can find a nice 986S as well.

aron in toronto

Yep, there are 14 base 987s listed on cars (dot) com for $24k or less. The base 987 have similar HP to the 986 S models, but with a bit less torque.

eclou

FYI I just purchased a clean 00 986S with 70k miles for less than half of your price ceiling