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I bought my first Porsche (2018 4GTS - 7sp) a couple of months ago after decades of dreaming. When researching performance driving, I discovered autocross and signed up for my first race a week into owning the car. I fell in love, have done three races, and won novice in the last race (out of 40) woop woop! My confidence quickly dropped when I realized I would be competing in SS next race, and my time was at the very bottom of SS.
I know nothing can beat seat time, and I plan to do every event possible, but what do you recommend beyond racing to improve my times?
recommendations on ways to practice?
Reading material recommendations?
Any other advice?
The car has new Michillen PS4's and I plan to run them until I need a new set but open to getting some new rubber.
I have started to read about alignments but am a little confused about what to get
I have noticed the 1-2 shift can be a little sticky and needs more force to get into gear than the rest, is this normal?
200tw tires are legal for stock classes - so Bridgestone RE-71RS, Yoko A052, etc. The two listed are generally regarded as the best of the 200tw tires for autocross - others may chime in with a different selection. I have no idea how they perform in the rain if your car is a daily driver. I grabbed a 2nd set of wheels for sticky tire track/autocross duty. Also - consider a wheelset down 1 inch to help in finding sticker tires if you want to go the spare wheelset route - that will still maintain SCCA stock class iirc.
As far as alignment the cars come from the factory fairly neutral as far as I'm aware. Camber (how much the top of the tire points inward vs. bottom pointing outward) is generally what you'll be after for autocross. Highly aggressive camber helps with turn-in and grip but it can come at the cost of excessive wear on the tire if you're just street driving most of the time. I have a modest 25% track - 75% street alignment since it is my daily driver and i'm also not chasing trophies at this point.
I don't know if the 911 manuals have the same 1-2 gear grind/break-in as the 718's but mine seems to have stopped doing it for my 718gts.
Get people to drive with you, do ridealongs with other fast drivers. You'll learn more from a good codriver in 2-3 events than a whole season by yourself.
Otherwise - some things you will need to have a chance as your skills improve:
200tw tires - Bridgestone RE17RS, Yokohama A052, Nankang CR-S (2023 compound), Falken RT660
Aggressive alignment - max out front camber, slight front toe out, ~2 deg rear camber and a little bit of toe in.
See if any clubs in your area have novice school, or if Evo school comes to your area. You'll get a ton of seat time and focused instruction.
Keep taking advantage of the instructors in your local events too, if they're available. I've been autocrossing for three years (roughly 25 events) and I still grab an instructor now and again, especially if it's somebody who's faster than me!
Also recommend trying to do more than the once a month I was able to do my first couple seasons - even two a month helps preserve the learnings from the last event. Once a month it's hard to progress.
Note that whole SCCA groups have the best competition, you often will get fewer runs than with other groups. Try a few and see what you like.
Check out SCCA.com and find the Region near you as they are the " Gold Standard " in Autocrossing and you will find a wealth of information available through them and at their events. There are other groups you will enjoy but this is the group that has the most time and expertise invested. BmacIL's advice is spot on and he is quite active in SCCA.
1300+ Drivers will be in Lincoln, Nebraska for the 50th Anniversary of the Solo Nationals, so put that on your " Bucket List " of things to do next year. BmacIL's list of tires , whether initentional or not, I would also suggest , with the RE71Rs being the best to start on.
Moving to the best 200 tread wear tire you can find will be the single best improvement in your time, aside from seat time, and riding along with other fast drivers. I'm guessing your car probably has 20" wheels? If so it will probably be hard to find a matched set of tires to fit.
Everyone in SCCA loves to throw a front bar on everything.... I have a hard time imagining that what a four wheel drive car really wants a front bar, so I wouldn't make any hardware changes until someone who really knows what they are doing drives it, maybe even does a whole event co driving with you. You don't want to just throw parts at a car. Sam Strano of Strano Parts makes his living selling autocross parts, he specializes in american cars, but he also has a cayman GTS 4.0. He would be worth a phone call to see about wheels and tires. I think he's selling Nankangs, which will probably be what you're stuck with on 20" wheels. We bought cayman and GT3 wheels from Sam. He wouldn't be someone that I would look to call just for free advice, but if you develop a relationship with him as a customer, he is a welath of knowledge, and will point you in the right direction.
Tires will make you faster, but IMO you shouldn't get 200 TW tires for the first year you're autocrossing. They're going to mask many of the mistakes you're making, and make it harder to fix them. I think mods beyond tires are not needed until/unless you're good enough to get a trophy at SCCA Nats. From the factory, modern cars are faster than the vast majority of drivers are capable of driving them. If you don't believe me, once you get to the point that you feel you're driving the car as fast as it can go, find a driver that's trophied at nats and have the drive your car. They will almost certainly be significantly faster than you.
As other have said, the best way to learn is instruction and seat time. You should probably be taking an instructor every run for you first year. Going to as many events as you can will also help. Another way I've found to improve is to use a data acquisition/video system. I use TrackAddict on an old Android phone with a QStarz BT-818XT 10 Hz GPS receiver to review and compare runs during an event. I already had the phone, so the GPS and mounts cost me less than $200. After a school, probably the best money you can spend to improve.
Tires will make you faster, but IMO you shouldn't get 200 TW tires for the first year you're autocrossing. They're going to mask many of the mistakes you're making, and make it harder to fix them. I think mods beyond tires are not needed until/unless you're good enough to get a trophy at SCCA Nats. From the factory, modern cars are faster than the vast majority of drivers are capable of driving them. If you don't believe me, once you get to the point that you feel you're driving the car as fast as it can go, find a driver that's trophied at nats and have the drive your car. They will almost certainly be significantly faster than you.
As other have said, the best way to learn is instruction and seat time. You should probably be taking an instructor every run for you first year. Going to as many events as you can will also help. Another way I've found to improve is to use a data acquisition/video system. I use TrackAddict on an old Android phone with a QStarz BT-818XT 10 Hz GPS receiver to review and compare runs during an event. I already had the phone, so the GPS and mounts cost me less than $200. After a school, probably the best money you can spend to improve.
The only caveat I'd say regarding tires is that passenger street tires (including summer tires) react very differently to approaching and exceeding the limit of grip than a competition-focused tire. On a 200tw tire you can learn to work up to, and even when exceeding, back off slightly to get the car back in control/on the line. On a typical passenger/summer tire, it's very easy to get to terminal understeer which requires massive (comparatively) changes in inputs to recover. The way you can drive the car is significantly different. I would say tires like the Yok A052 in particular will very easily hide bad habits, but some of the others provide good feedback and help you learn how to manage the car (Bridgestone and Falken in particular).
Have to politely disagree with cenotaph and suggest you take BmacIL's advice, as using a less than effective tire for autocross will just delay your progress because you will have to completely rethink and adjust your driving once you get on a ultra competitive 200 TWR rubber filled auto balloon! Tires are the numero Uno way to improve times, so jump into the fray soon to see what grip is really like!
The only caveat I'd say regarding tires is that passenger street tires (including summer tires) react very differently to approaching and exceeding the limit of grip than a competition-focused tire. On a 200tw tire you can learn to work up to, and even when exceeding, back off slightly to get the car back in control/on the line. On a typical passenger/summer tire, it's very easy to get to terminal understeer which requires massive (comparatively) changes in inputs to recover. The way you can drive the car is significantly different. I would say tires like the Yok A052 in particular will very easily hide bad habits, but some of the others provide good feedback and help you learn how to manage the car (Bridgestone and Falken in particular).
It's probably worth it to do your first event or two on whatever garbage tires you have to learn the basics. But beyond that, if you know good tires are in your future, just get them. Yeah there's something to be said for learning on bad tires, but there's also something to be said for not having to totally relearn the car once it's on good tires. I've seen too many people struggle because they can't get over their learned expectations of how the car works/feels on bad tires.
My other semi-controversial take is that data doesn't really help unless you have something to compare to (a codriver or someone else in a very similar car). It can show you where you made mistakes relative to your own capabilities but not really what the car is capable of. For a single driver, video is way more useful to learning because you can actually see what went wrong, not just how much time you lost from it.
It's probably worth it to do your first event or two on whatever garbage tires you have to learn the basics. But beyond that, if you know good tires are in your future, just get them. Yeah there's something to be said for learning on bad tires, but there's also something to be said for not having to totally relearn the car once it's on good tires. I've seen too many people struggle because they can't get over their learned expectations of how the car works/feels on bad tires.
Similar remarks to the others. I’ve been autocrossing since 2007 in just about everything. Tires are going to help the most with shaving time off, after seat time. My 997 is not my primary autocross car and I know I’m giving 1.25-1.5 seconds on a 50 second course because I have Pilot Sport 4S and not A052 or RE71RS on. I’m personally not a fan of RT660. Different sway bar can help but don’t focus on that now. Biggest help is coaching, riding with fast drivers and having them ride with you. As for the 1 to 2 shift, it shouldn’t feel different than pushing the car hard on a street. Biggest thing is not to shift too much and use the torque of the turbo engine.
08-17-2023, 04:56 PM
What to do next? New to Autocross
