When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
I know this subject has been beaten to death but I also believe that as long as people buy new Porsches that it will continue to come up. I take European delivery next week of a '24 GTS. As an engine builder I have my methods for break-in which for the most part is keeping revs low for the first 30-60 minutes then let the dogs run. This method has served our customers well for 50+ years on street and track motors and has crossed over generations of technical advances in materials. I intend to experiment in real time with my new 911 and put this to the test. Caveat: Since I have not been privy to main bearing/rod bearing clearances and ring gap on new Porsche engines, I'll be playing it by ear and NOSE but it's safe to say I'll drive at least 200 miles before redline shifts. (It's a manual.)
I see lots of conversations around this issue and as a recent owner of a new "T" find it hard to understand the reluctance to follow the Porsche recommended break-in period for these cars.
I'm not saying people are wrong but is the thought that Porsche engineers that have designed and built millions of engines, don't know what they are talking about when it comes to getting a high-performance engine to last 100-200K miles.
I'm sure these engines can be run to max rpm when brand new but that doesn't mean they should be. When built, each engine is dyno'd to redline and its performance must be within 5% over/under its designated hp, so the likelihood of some catastrophic failure occurring is very small.... but why roll the dice with a new $200k car!
sk911, Why? Because my experience is completely contradictory to what Porsche is stating and because I can. Its just a piece of machinery. If it blows up, so be it. Ill be pulling at least one oil sample on the trip to evaluate effects. This is a car I specd and plan on owning at least 10-15 years. As long as it doesnt get crashed on the Nordschleife, Ill be happy.
I see lots of conversations around this issue and as a recent owner of a new "T" find it hard to understand the reluctance to follow the Porsche recommended break-in period for these cars.
I'm not saying people are wrong but is the thought that Porsche engineers that have designed and built millions of engines, don't know what they are talking about when it comes to getting a high-performance engine to last 100-200K miles.
I'm sure these engines can be run to max rpm when brand new but that doesn't mean they should be. When built, each engine is dyno'd to redline and its performance must be within 5% over/under its designated hp, so the likelihood of some catastrophic failure occurring is very small.... but why roll the dice with a new $200k car!
Because the break-in periods required by Porsche in the owner's manual differ from regions to region (i.e. US v. EU v. ROW).
So how do you explain that if the car in question (in this case, a 911) is ostensibly the same?
Which then begs this question. Is the break-in requirement really a mechanical issue, or is it simply a regulatory and CYA issue?
All that said, it's yourcar, do what makes you feel comfortable sleeping at night. Everything else is irrelevant.
"Live and let live" applies here... to people and machinery. This obsession with "supposedly" preserving equipment at all costs fascinates me. While it would put a kink in our vacation if this engine blew up, I'm confident Porsche would provide another car to finish our trip. This is an experiment for me that directly correlates to my business and vocation. While testing to failure is in NO WAY my agenda, I see this as a unique opportunity to explore myths, folklore, and perhaps truth.
"Live and let live" applies here... to people and machinery. This obsession with "supposedly" preserving equipment at all costs fascinates me. While it would put a kink in our vacation if this engine blew up, I'm confident Porsche would provide another car to finish our trip. This is an experiment for me that directly correlates to my business and vocation. While testing to failure is in NO WAY my agenda, I see this as a unique opportunity to explore myths, folklore, and perhaps truth.
I see what you're saying... if you can, why not.
I was just asking if there was some theory or logic other than "I can" that would help those of us who spending weeks and months driving around under 4K rpm trying to get to that magic 1800 miles mark.
"Live and let live" applies here... to people and machinery. This obsession with "supposedly" preserving equipment at all costs fascinates me. While it would put a kink in our vacation if this engine blew up, I'm confident Porsche would provide another car to finish our trip. This is an experiment for me that directly correlates to my business and vocation. While testing to failure is in NO WAY my agenda, I see this as a unique opportunity to explore myths, folklore, and perhaps truth.
I don't have the knowledge or the guts (freedom) that you have, so I followed the recommended break-in when I did ED last month. It was very painful to not be able to push it on the Autobahn or in the Alps, so I'd likely have a different take on it if I was more knowledgeable on the topic to the extent of having my own educated opinions.
I'm also looking forward to seeing how this pans out, although I suspect the results will be inconclusive other than to say the engine did not display any abnormal wear characteristics.
I'm conflicted on this topic. I'm not the type to question everything without any basis for the questioning... But the whole break-in topic is of particular interest because of the wildly varying opinions about it and the ulterior motives of a car company to require such a thing (delay of warranty claims, the CYA factor , etc.)... Someone in another thread claimed that any good engineer wouldn't question the topic of break-in, but as a mechanical engineer by education I couldn't disagree more! I'm no engine builder, but that's not required to think critically about this problem.
My take is that there are simply too many unknown variables at play to form a truly rock solid and quantified opinion on the matter. What tolerances does the manufacturer use? Does it make sense that only RPM is limited by Porsche's guidelines and "load" (aka torque output) is not? Mechanical parts certainly do need some time to wear into eachother, but the starting tolerances, mechanical and thermal loads between components, and number of cycles are all of importance when thinking about break-in.
If you don't work the engine hard and average 2k RPM all day during your break-in period, perhaps 1800 miles is "necessary" for all the wear-in to occur. But if you're spending more of your time closer to 4k RPMs and under moderate to heavy mechanical load with lots of thermal cycling, then break-in will certainly be achieved much sooner. Neither of these scenarios puts the rotating assembly at risk of damage. And don't forget that Porsche has certainly applied a factor of safety here as well.
On the other extreme end, if you go to redline often (like on a track) right from mile zero, there's a non-zero chance that the interfacing surfaces will wear too quickly and therefore unevenly causing potential sealing issues, etc. So my take is to approach break-in moderately. Don't abuse the engine, but also 1800 miles under 4k RPM is a very, very conservative ask.
sk911, I intend to follow this through and post updates along the way, including the oil sample report. Hopefully all of my data will encourage (or discourage!) the average new 911 owner to re-think Porsche's ridiculous recommendations. When I see manufacturers compromise the ownership experience for their loyal customers because of possible ulterior motives, that's a hard pill to swallow for me. But... let's see what happens.
This is a bucket list item for my wife and I and she's always been game for adventure. (Including breakdowns... those trips seem to create the most memories!)
Can any of you imagine driving the Autobahn or Nurburgring at under 4k! Laugable at its core!
I find it interesting that people seem to think that break in is only about the engine. There are plenty of other things that need breaking in. For example I have never bought a clutch, transmission, or tires that didn't come with a break in period from the MFG. So unless you are experienced enough with every system in the car to ignore the recommendations, it might be wise to just follow what the people who are (Porsche) recommend.
Or don't, it's your stuff, neglect it at your pleasure. I will point out that OEM's have been crawling social media looking for excuses to void warranty claims for a long time, so proudly proclaiming you are not following instructions might be a self own down the line.
You dont have to be around here very long to realize that withregards to engine run in, people can and will do whatever they want. And they will subscribe to the facts that support their point of view. Also, theyre generally not happy until they hear their opinion coming out of your mouth. Otherwise, it gets a bit dicey on the threads.
as to this particular instance, no matter what happens it will still only be an N of one which is not scientific. If things go sideways, that is not necessarily an indication that the run-in (or lack of factory recommended ) contributed. If things go well, same thing, but hey, its your rig👍
I find it interesting that people seem to think that break in is only about the engine. There are plenty of other things that need breaking in. For example I have never bought a clutch, transmission, or tires that didn't come with a break in period from the MFG. So unless you are experienced enough with every system in the car to ignore the recommendations, it might be wise to just follow what the people who are (Porsche) recommend.
Or don't, it's your stuff, neglect it at your pleasure. I will point out that OEM's have been crawling social media looking for excuses to void warranty claims for a long time, so proudly proclaiming you are not following instructions might be a self own down the line.
This ^^. Follow a break in process (maybe not the full 1800 miles) for all mechanical, moving things. At the very least, the brakes need bedding in properly with with a few hard slow downs and then cooling off.
I know this subject has been beaten to death but I also believe that as long as people buy new Porsches that it will continue to come up. I take European delivery next week of a '24 GTS. As an engine builder I have my methods for break-in which for the most part is keeping revs low for the first 30-60 minutes then let the dogs run. This method has served our customers well for 50+ years on street and track motors and has crossed over generations of technical advances in materials. I intend to experiment in real time with my new 911 and put this to the test. Caveat: Since I have not been privy to main bearing/rod bearing clearances and ring gap on new Porsche engines, I'll be playing it by ear and NOSE but it's safe to say I'll drive at least 200 miles before redline shifts. (It's a manual.)
Stay tuned.
My only gripe with the break-in process is that there is essentially no engine braking in modern cars and I'm not sure how critical that vacuum effect is for clearing out the particulates that are created from the rings wearing in.
sk911, I intend to follow this through and post updates along the way, including the oil sample report. Hopefully all of my data will encourage (or discourage!) the average new 911 owner to re-think Porsche's ridiculous recommendations. When I see manufacturers compromise the ownership experience for their loyal customers because of possible ulterior motives, that's a hard pill to swallow for me. But... let's see what happens.
This is a bucket list item for my wife and I and she's always been game for adventure. (Including breakdowns... those trips seem to create the most memories!)
Can any of you imagine driving the Autobahn or Nurburgring at under 4k! Laugable at its core!
Absolutely sounds like a fantastic adventure and I'm sure you will not have any mechanical issues.
Driving the Autobahn and Nürburgring...in your own car...PRICELESS!
When I first drove my car, I too thought "4K rpm, are they crazy". But the 8 spd PDK along with 400hp is just amazing. This car can cruise down the highway easily at 90mph spinning at 2K rpm in 8th gear...add another 1K rpm and you're at 130mph. So, keeping it under 4K rpm and still enjoying the car can be done as one racks up the miles. You just have to be mindful in "Sport" or "Sport+" modes because it will want to rev. from gear to gear.
Today, 09:39 AM
2024 992 GTS break-in
