This move brought to you by the same people who moved the 10th anniversary GR86 from DS to BS based soley on 0.5" of wheel width change. They will put the 997.1 into BS but leave the 981S behind in AS, and then be upset when you point out that it looks like they don't use data when they make decisions. The 997.1S has better gearing, wider wheels, more power, 5 link rear vs strut rear when compared to the 981S. Having a 997 and a 981S in my garage, I've recommended the 981 to people countless times as a car the would probably enjoy owning. An aging 997 with potential bore score and IMS problems, makes no sense to put in to a place where it could be competitive. It should NOT be separated from the 997.2 which has a decent engine. You should always choose the .2 and have no motivation to buy the .1 which should stay buried. It just makes absolutely no sense.

 

IDK -- in terms of raw performance numbers, probably neither the 981 S/GTS or the 997's should be in BS as the baseline vehicles which include the Supra, M2, Lotus Evora, are all 3250-3500# cars. You can bet when Brandon P. won last year in the 987S, it surprised some folks and made them a bit more cautious because of the weight disparity in that tire to weight is probably one the biggest factors relative to pace and performance. I think the result may have been a byproduct of course dependencies but there is little doubt the 981 S/GTS has more performance potential than the 986S.

 

David Marcus has taken the wrapper off the supra. If he keeps wrecking people like he did in Georgia, it will be a moot point.

https://www.scca.com/downloads/66681...sults/download

fastest car at the event on 200tw tires.

the 986s is a strange benchmark, and a strange car to protect. I’d rather run heads up against David Marcus in a 981 and lose, than win a championship in a 986/987 if I had to actually own the car.

 

Congratulations, you entirely missed the point.

 

As pointed out, the issue with the GR86 10th anniversary edition was not solely upon a .5" wheel difference. The concern was this could be a one year unicorn and without update/backdate provisions which the SEB won't touch in Street, that one year would be perceived, reasonably or not, as the must have for class to the exclusion of non-anniversary GR86's whereas the entire run of 981S/GTS had an option on 8.5"/10" wheels. I personally thought the allowance for those cars to run non-anniversary wheels was fairly reasonable.

 

I got my notice

 

Yeah -- I saw that one too. That car is an AS/BS tweener much like the 718 S/GTS was perceived to be an SS/AS tweener. Even in the hands of some pretty fast drivers, it frequently looked like it was outside of it's comfort zone at certain speeds.

 

or you did.

 

The Philly region area now has multiple BS Supras, because David Graver is killing it in his. Top PAX by a significant gap at the first two events of the year, without a full prep. I'm sure many more Supras will follow.

 

IMO, if they are moving the 718S/GTS to AS, the 981S/GTS should move down. Or else they basically are buried. Also, I think the performance difference in autocross between the 987 and 981 is minimal.

I don't know anything about the 997 to have an input

 

I think I want to write a letter.

Can someone tell me (again!) what the max legal wheel widths are for the 997.1S? The 2023 Parade rules allow 8.5x11 19s.

 

quick searching looks like there is a "carrera sport" wheel for that car:

The fronts are 19x8.5 ET 55 (99736215655) and the rears are 19x11.5 ET 67 (99736216255)

 

Is this data from the Order Guide? That document has historically been untrustworthy, especially when it comes to rim sizes. It has been routinely ignored by the Parade Competition rules.

 

Here's the letter I wrote re 997 in BS. I'll write another about the Tesla.

Don’t Move Porsche 997 Into BS Except To Reduce The Number Of Classes

The Porsche 997.1S is likely to become a dominant car in BS. It is an extreme risk to the class to move it down from AS as it has the best numbers for three of four calculable parameters that predict autocross speed. Parameter 1) At manufacturer’s spec weight and rim sizes of 8.5”/11” the 997.1S* has a significantly lower weight per inch of rim width at 170.9lb/in than the C6Z51 (184.2lb/in), the best Supra variant (187.1lb/in), and the best M2 variant (192.1lb/in). The 997.1S can therefore be expected to steady-state corner faster than these other BS cars, all else equal. The only car in BS that matches the 997.1S’ low ratio is the 987.1 Cayman S at 170.5lb/in, the BS National Championship car for 2022. Parameter 2) The 997.1S is the narrowest car in the class, except for the 987.1 Cayman S. It is 1.8” narrower than the Supra and M2. The widths (lower is better) of the top BS cars are: M2 & Supra- 73.0”; C6Z51- 72.6”; 997.1S- 71.2”; 987.1 Cayman S- 70.9”. Therefore, the 997.1S has an advantage when traversing slaloms where width directly controls speed as compared to the M2/Supra or C6Z51 and is most similar to the 987.1 Cayman S. Parameter 3) The 997.1S can be expected to have the best transient response of any top car in the class as measured by the approximated mass moment of inertia around the initial center of rotation during corner turn-in. Less rotational inertia about the car’s initial center of rotation, which is not at the center of mass and is, in fact, some distance behind the rear bumper, allows the car to change direction faster, all else equal, conferring a speed advantage at every transition on course where the time it takes to change direction affects speed. Such locations are not only within slaloms, but at every transition from straight to turning as a fast-turning car can brake later. The numbers (lb-in^2) of the best version of each model are as follows, with lower being better: 997.1S- 94.1; 987.2 Cayman S-144.2; Supra- 204.3; C6Z51- 231.7; M2- 240.3 Parameter 4) The only calculated metric for which the 997.1S is not best or near-best in class is peak thrust. The calculation for peak thrust in 2nd gear (with a 200lb driver and actually-used tire sizes) results in the following numbers, higher being better: M2C- 0.766g; ‘23Supra manual- 0.760g; C6Z51- 0.700g; 997.1S- 0.616g; 987.1Cayman S- 0.533g. Please note that the car with the lowest value was the ’22 national championship winning car in BS. Also, the 997.1S will likely put more of its power down coming off corners due to having the widest rear rim in the class (by 1”) and the most rear weight bias. In summary, the combination of best or near-best parameters in three of four categories and with the fourth category being not far off the other top cars will likely make the 997.1S a class-killer.
* Some believe that a 11.5”-wide rear rim was available for the 997.1S. If true, this will make the car even more formidable.

 

While I am not rooting for or against the 997.1S, I will state this is what you need to include when you write a letter in support or against a proposal with the SEB.