Not another turbo vs. GT3 thread - ok, it is...
02-18-2011, 08:33 PM
#16
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Thread Starter
I had a little bit of time to stop by my dealer today. Final decision is: Turbo!
I now have the dealer's first allocation slot for the next generation Turbo coupe. I really hope it's worth the wait.
I now have the dealer's first allocation slot for the next generation Turbo coupe. I really hope it's worth the wait.
02-18-2011, 10:42 PM
#17
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Maybe I have forgotten the difference between a stock Turbo and my highly modified one (with upgraded suspension, and powerkit) but I haven't come close to 'yawning' once in my Turbo since I bought it in Dec 07. It blows my socks off every time I take it out at the weekend.
Now the GT3 is a huge yawn when you floor the accelerator out of a bend - you think there is something wrong with the car it's so slow...
Now the GT3 is a huge yawn when you floor the accelerator out of a bend - you think there is something wrong with the car it's so slow...
I have not driven a GT3 but I have an RS and I highly doubt your statement stands if you ever get behind the wheel of one....
All of my DD cars have been turbos (better road manners), however when compared to my RS's there is a YAWN in the turbo.
The turbo is Not as good as the RS on track either...it does not handle entery and exits as well as the RS...not to mention the power delivery curve on the turbo compared to the NA RS....
You need to get behind the wheel of one ( an RS) before you yawn on exits
02-19-2011, 12:08 AM
#18
Turbo is epic yawn based on my experience. For reference i had a 650 HP 996tt with exhaust etc... Now i have a 2011 Gt3...Better in every aspect! Gt3 maybe slower than a turbo but its very fast for any street...anything faster is useless IMO.
02-19-2011, 01:10 AM
#19
...but not asking the same question.
For those who have driven both, which would you say is more fun?
That's it. Not concerned about GT vs. track, which is more comfortable, better ride quality, etc.
Fun factor as a weekender - GT3 or turbo?
BTW, I had a 993 turbo that I sold to pay for my wedding (please, no comments) - so I'm not anti-turbo at all.
I've finally closed the book on the "dark years" with my business and need to get back to enjoying life again.
For those who have driven both, which would you say is more fun?
That's it. Not concerned about GT vs. track, which is more comfortable, better ride quality, etc.
Fun factor as a weekender - GT3 or turbo?
BTW, I had a 993 turbo that I sold to pay for my wedding (please, no comments) - so I'm not anti-turbo at all.
I've finally closed the book on the "dark years" with my business and need to get back to enjoying life again.
Duh, a GT3 has a much stiffer suspension with a lot of race oriented parts: adjustable coilover shocks, monoball upper mounts, split front control arms, adjustable sway bars, etc. If you like a safe car that understeers, you can make a GT3 do that. You can also make is perfectly neutral or a tail out beast just turning it with the stock suspension parts. With the Turbo it is just nice safe understeer unless you want to open your wallet and start buying more parts. Despite the differences, your not going to see the advantage of the GT3's better suspension on the street where you can't properly explore its limits.
Exactly which Turbo are you comparing to which GT3? I lots of very misguided comments here about the quickness of these 2 cars. The current 997.2 GT3 is quicker and faster than a stock 996 Turbo or Turbo S, and almost dead even in acceleration with a stock 997.1 Turbo. Both run quarter miles in the high 11's in the low 120's. Despite similar straightline performance, the way the cars put down power is completely different. A Turbo is a torque monster with Turbos spooling early. A GT3 is a revver, where things don't get exciting until about 6000 rpms. From 6K up, there is a feel and roar of the engine that you never get out of a Turbo.
BTW, I completely hate these types of threads. You don't need to ask people what they think, just drive both and make up your own mind. That's what I did. I enjoy track driving and exploring my limits as a driver. I like a car where the entire driving experience is centered around the driver's seat and what the driver can do with the tools he is given. I bought a GT3 because a Turbo was never going to give me what I was looking for.
02-19-2011, 11:56 AM
#21
Rennlist Member
[QUOTE=10 GT3;8313725]
Duh, a GT3 has a much stiffer suspension with a lot of race oriented parts: adjustable coilover shocks, monoball upper mounts, split front control arms, adjustable sway bars, etc. If you like a safe car that understeers, you can make a GT3 do that. You can also make is perfectly neutral or a tail out beast just turning it with the stock suspension parts. With the Turbo it is just nice safe understeer unless you want to open your wallet and start buying more parts. Despite the differences, your not going to see the advantage of the GT3's better suspension on the street where you can't properly explore its limits.
QUOTE]
The latter part of this quote is right on the mark and I wish more people would take it seriously. Some aspects of one car over another are just simply not explorable on the street, even in good conditions for spirited driving. Sorry to be a buzzkill but I just think it is irresponsible if someone is really using 10/10 of the GT3's cornering ability on public roads (or any car), especially if this cornering is anything beyond a 2nd gear turn, and on most turns where you can't fully see what's on the road surface ahead. So many uncontrollable factors exist on public roads that are less likely on tracks, and other people can be hurt.
It's a little different with other attributes a car may have. Torque and straightline acceleration can be enjoyed 10/10 without the same high level of risk mentioned above. Punching it on a solitary entrance ramp up to highway speeds on a quiet highway is very different than taking a 3rd gear turn at 10/10 of the car's ability.
Even in a mere Carrera S I don't think it's wise to be cornering at or near the limits of the car's ability. I've been in the 997.2S with PDE drivers on the track multiple times here in AZ, so I've seen what the Carrera S can do. I just think it would be grossly irresponsible for me, or even a DE regular or track junkie to be doing those turns like that on public roads. So, really these differences are only for track experiences, and if someone is really on the track often enough for these differences to be appreciated then I don't see how they wouldn't know the answer already to the OP's dilemma.
Duh, a GT3 has a much stiffer suspension with a lot of race oriented parts: adjustable coilover shocks, monoball upper mounts, split front control arms, adjustable sway bars, etc. If you like a safe car that understeers, you can make a GT3 do that. You can also make is perfectly neutral or a tail out beast just turning it with the stock suspension parts. With the Turbo it is just nice safe understeer unless you want to open your wallet and start buying more parts. Despite the differences, your not going to see the advantage of the GT3's better suspension on the street where you can't properly explore its limits.
QUOTE]
The latter part of this quote is right on the mark and I wish more people would take it seriously. Some aspects of one car over another are just simply not explorable on the street, even in good conditions for spirited driving. Sorry to be a buzzkill but I just think it is irresponsible if someone is really using 10/10 of the GT3's cornering ability on public roads (or any car), especially if this cornering is anything beyond a 2nd gear turn, and on most turns where you can't fully see what's on the road surface ahead. So many uncontrollable factors exist on public roads that are less likely on tracks, and other people can be hurt.
It's a little different with other attributes a car may have. Torque and straightline acceleration can be enjoyed 10/10 without the same high level of risk mentioned above. Punching it on a solitary entrance ramp up to highway speeds on a quiet highway is very different than taking a 3rd gear turn at 10/10 of the car's ability.
Even in a mere Carrera S I don't think it's wise to be cornering at or near the limits of the car's ability. I've been in the 997.2S with PDE drivers on the track multiple times here in AZ, so I've seen what the Carrera S can do. I just think it would be grossly irresponsible for me, or even a DE regular or track junkie to be doing those turns like that on public roads. So, really these differences are only for track experiences, and if someone is really on the track often enough for these differences to be appreciated then I don't see how they wouldn't know the answer already to the OP's dilemma.
02-19-2011, 12:05 PM
#22
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02-19-2011, 12:38 PM
#23
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You want a turbo, period. So why even ask it here. Are you just looking for justification for the decision you already made?
Duh, a GT3 has a much stiffer suspension with a lot of race oriented parts: adjustable coilover shocks, monoball upper mounts, split front control arms, adjustable sway bars, etc. If you like a safe car that understeers, you can make a GT3 do that. You can also make is perfectly neutral or a tail out beast just turning it with the stock suspension parts. With the Turbo it is just nice safe understeer unless you want to open your wallet and start buying more parts. Despite the differences, your not going to see the advantage of the GT3's better suspension on the street where you can't properly explore its limits.
Exactly which Turbo are you comparing to which GT3? I lots of very misguided comments here about the quickness of these 2 cars. The current 997.2 GT3 is quicker and faster than a stock 996 Turbo or Turbo S, and almost dead even in acceleration with a stock 997.1 Turbo. Both run quarter miles in the high 11's in the low 120's. Despite similar straightline performance, the way the cars put down power is completely different. A Turbo is a torque monster with Turbos spooling early. A GT3 is a revver, where things don't get exciting until about 6000 rpms. From 6K up, there is a feel and roar of the engine that you never get out of a Turbo.
BTW, I completely hate these types of threads. You don't need to ask people what they think, just drive both and make up your own mind. That's what I did. I enjoy track driving and exploring my limits as a driver. I like a car where the entire driving experience is centered around the driver's seat and what the driver can do with the tools he is given. I bought a GT3 because a Turbo was never going to give me what I was looking for.
Duh, a GT3 has a much stiffer suspension with a lot of race oriented parts: adjustable coilover shocks, monoball upper mounts, split front control arms, adjustable sway bars, etc. If you like a safe car that understeers, you can make a GT3 do that. You can also make is perfectly neutral or a tail out beast just turning it with the stock suspension parts. With the Turbo it is just nice safe understeer unless you want to open your wallet and start buying more parts. Despite the differences, your not going to see the advantage of the GT3's better suspension on the street where you can't properly explore its limits.
Exactly which Turbo are you comparing to which GT3? I lots of very misguided comments here about the quickness of these 2 cars. The current 997.2 GT3 is quicker and faster than a stock 996 Turbo or Turbo S, and almost dead even in acceleration with a stock 997.1 Turbo. Both run quarter miles in the high 11's in the low 120's. Despite similar straightline performance, the way the cars put down power is completely different. A Turbo is a torque monster with Turbos spooling early. A GT3 is a revver, where things don't get exciting until about 6000 rpms. From 6K up, there is a feel and roar of the engine that you never get out of a Turbo.
BTW, I completely hate these types of threads. You don't need to ask people what they think, just drive both and make up your own mind. That's what I did. I enjoy track driving and exploring my limits as a driver. I like a car where the entire driving experience is centered around the driver's seat and what the driver can do with the tools he is given. I bought a GT3 because a Turbo was never going to give me what I was looking for.
02-19-2011, 12:50 PM
#24
GT3 player par excellence
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Both good cars, take ur pick.
I wanted to try them all.
Got two TT for DD. 6 weeks And 4000 miles later sold both at extremely large loss bc I like my diesel truck more! It was a big yawn for ME, YMMV.
And to my a**, the stock TT was not fast at all and definitely has lag. That was the end of my turbo experiment. I'm back on track with gt3's.
I wanted to try them all.
Got two TT for DD. 6 weeks And 4000 miles later sold both at extremely large loss bc I like my diesel truck more! It was a big yawn for ME, YMMV.
And to my a**, the stock TT was not fast at all and definitely has lag. That was the end of my turbo experiment. I'm back on track with gt3's.
02-19-2011, 02:44 PM
#25
Nordschleife Master
Maybe I have forgotten the difference between a stock Turbo and my highly modified one (with upgraded suspension, and powerkit) but I haven't come close to 'yawning' once in my Turbo since I bought it in Dec 07. It blows my socks off every time I take it out at the weekend.
Now the GT3 is a huge yawn when you floor the accelerator out of a bend - you think there is something wrong with the car it's so slow...
Now the GT3 is a huge yawn when you floor the accelerator out of a bend - you think there is something wrong with the car it's so slow...
02-19-2011, 02:56 PM
#26
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Thread Starter
It was a tough decision. My heart said GT3 all the way. I had to take into consideration the state of the roads around where I live as well as the possibility of doing some long distance cruising and possibly taking the little one with us at times.
If I had the means I would most certainly get both. My wife, of course, would wonder why I bought "two of the same car."
If I had the means I would most certainly get both. My wife, of course, would wonder why I bought "two of the same car."
02-20-2011, 12:28 PM
#27
I came to the same set of conclusions doc. I've had a GT3RS and really prefer the turbo for driving on the street. If you live in California where the roads are smooth, a stiffer GT3 is great. But in climates where the weather tears up our roads, even the turbo is a little too stiff for comfort on a long trip. Plus it's great to have the ability to have both my wife and child in the car . A back seat is one of the practicalities that really sets the turbo apart from other supercars.
02-20-2011, 12:54 PM
#28
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And you are basing this on all the time you have behind the wheel of MY car?
As I say, I may have forgotten what a stock Turbo feels like to drive but I have 800 Nm torque in my car and a GT3 has HALF that. So after a few years of driving a car with this much torque, you get use to it and you end up wanting more. So yes, the acceleration of a GT3 is most certainly a yawn!
This may or may not be important to some, but to me, this feeling of raw thrust DEFINES fun-factor on public roads where you can't safely take corners at 100mph.
Tomorrow I will be driving the new 997 GTS at Silverstone's Porsche Experience Center. Another kind freebe from my dealer. Now I know I will have a fun day, but what I am most looking forward to is the 2 hour drive there and back in my Turbo!
As I say, I may have forgotten what a stock Turbo feels like to drive but I have 800 Nm torque in my car and a GT3 has HALF that. So after a few years of driving a car with this much torque, you get use to it and you end up wanting more. So yes, the acceleration of a GT3 is most certainly a yawn!
This may or may not be important to some, but to me, this feeling of raw thrust DEFINES fun-factor on public roads where you can't safely take corners at 100mph.
Tomorrow I will be driving the new 997 GTS at Silverstone's Porsche Experience Center. Another kind freebe from my dealer. Now I know I will have a fun day, but what I am most looking forward to is the 2 hour drive there and back in my Turbo!
02-20-2011, 06:22 PM
#29
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You can't even compare the thrust of a modded Turbo, my RUF is ridiculous in sport mode, it will break the tires loose at anything more than a slight application of throttle. I don't know about a 997.2 GT3 but the last time I played with a 997.1 GT3 on the way home from the track it was about 15 car lengths and counting...They're both great street cars, the GT3 is better at the track but the Turbo is far and away the better DD. Now having said that I was next to a 997.2 GT3 yesterday driven by a mom with her kid in a child seat, so I may be wrong...
02-21-2011, 05:38 PM
#30
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when i took delivery of my .2 gt3, i had a 997.1 turbo in the garage at home. after driving the gt3, the turbo sat basically unused. i was so furious with the turbo lag and having to plan so far ahead for it vs the gt3's instantaneous response. driving the mountain roads here, by the time the turbos kicked in, i was almost at the next turn.
as for power, even with a GIAC 5 program ecu, straight exhaust (only had 200 cell sport cats) running 100 octane race program, my gt3 would stay with it.
and for the sound of the exhaust, oh my!!!!!!
as for power, even with a GIAC 5 program ecu, straight exhaust (only had 200 cell sport cats) running 100 octane race program, my gt3 would stay with it.
and for the sound of the exhaust, oh my!!!!!!