Another coolant pipe story...
10-14-2015, 11:09 AM
#46
New to the GT3 world; .1 GT3 purchased 6 months ago/now 9000miles; use exclusively for cars and coffees, shows, and some spirited drives with Philly Porche Club.
Is is necessary to pin coolent pipes for non track use? I read threads and viewed SW video on their product and process.
I owned an 2003 C4s and did the IMS (LN double ceramic bearing) replacement preventively so not opposed to taking sound advice.
Thanks for any comments.
Is is necessary to pin coolent pipes for non track use? I read threads and viewed SW video on their product and process.
I owned an 2003 C4s and did the IMS (LN double ceramic bearing) replacement preventively so not opposed to taking sound advice.
Thanks for any comments.
10-14-2015, 12:19 PM
#47
Rennlist Member
I can't believe the amount and lack of understanding of this. Yes it affects all mezger blocks. Yes it happens on track and street. No it doesn't affect only cars that are tracked. Yes we have documented cases here for 100% street driven cars. No your car isn't special because you have 40k miles and no issues. No this does not affect 991 cars. They have their own issues.
And water wetter helps because it is not slick. The only thing it helps is when your car does dump coolant cars behind you won't start spinning. Coolant is slicker in the road and track than oil and there is a lot of it in these cars. I've seen it first hand a couple times on track.
Not pretty.
And water wetter helps because it is not slick. The only thing it helps is when your car does dump coolant cars behind you won't start spinning. Coolant is slicker in the road and track than oil and there is a lot of it in these cars. I've seen it first hand a couple times on track.
Not pretty.
Maybe the sticky is just a bit too long for people.
New to the GT3 world; .1 GT3 purchased 6 months ago/now 9000miles; use exclusively for cars and coffees, shows, and some spirited drives with Philly Porche Club.
Is is necessary to pin coolent pipes for non track use? I read threads and viewed SW video on their product and process.
I owned an 2003 C4s and did the IMS (LN double ceramic bearing) replacement preventively so not opposed to taking sound advice.
Thanks for any comments.
Is is necessary to pin coolent pipes for non track use? I read threads and viewed SW video on their product and process.
I owned an 2003 C4s and did the IMS (LN double ceramic bearing) replacement preventively so not opposed to taking sound advice.
Thanks for any comments.
10-14-2015, 12:57 PM
#48
Rennlist Member
The question remains...why does Porsche not address this known problem. Might make one think that they have taken a cue from General Motors. Wait until enough people die to finally admit there's a problem that has been known for nearly a decade now...With the problems that VAG has had with the whole Dieselgate, the could ill afford major problems in the media due to this. If I was an ambulance chaser, I'd immediately start a Class Action lawsuit and start contacting every single news outlet possible with a video showing the dangers as I'm sure there are plenty of videos that show the aftermath of this. It's time for Porsche to stop hiding their heads in the sand about this VERY serious matter. Simply issue a recall and pin or weld them. It's really quite simple and can save people's lives.
https://rennlist.com/forums/996-gt2-...res-nhtsa.html
10-15-2015, 01:44 PM
#50
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Like SPY said.. this has been discussed for years on this forum.. It is even listed as a registry at the top of the forum. Like 5 hours of reading... Not sure why anyone would not be aware of this... Even if you were some crazy corvette guy that decided to come over and buy a Porsche gt3... the first thing you see when you google GT3 and issues.... Is Catastrophic Coolant Failure...
I always talk to the other GT3 guys.. I ask them if they are pinned or welded.. Have ran across a few that were not.. I take extra care and consider myself warned when navigating them on track... But just like any car.. Doesn't mean you won't put your car in a wall when someone has a death shift and puts a rod through there engine block and dumps oil... That risk is there every track day. The dumping coolant is avoidable.
It really erks me that anyone that can afford to buy a GT3, bring it out on a track.... but won't spend the money to guarantee you don't dump water on the entrance to a turn.. Glad no damage happened to they guys behind you. I recognize how easy it is to know you need to do something and just put it off... I do it all the time... On this one I didn't. WELD in BBI's pipes (what I did) or PIN and put the Sharky Pipes on.. it's really that simple. If you want to cut corner... stay off the track and just hit the Cars and Coffee or maybe SCCA parking lot trials... IMO... I'll shut up now...
I always talk to the other GT3 guys.. I ask them if they are pinned or welded.. Have ran across a few that were not.. I take extra care and consider myself warned when navigating them on track... But just like any car.. Doesn't mean you won't put your car in a wall when someone has a death shift and puts a rod through there engine block and dumps oil... That risk is there every track day. The dumping coolant is avoidable.
It really erks me that anyone that can afford to buy a GT3, bring it out on a track.... but won't spend the money to guarantee you don't dump water on the entrance to a turn.. Glad no damage happened to they guys behind you. I recognize how easy it is to know you need to do something and just put it off... I do it all the time... On this one I didn't. WELD in BBI's pipes (what I did) or PIN and put the Sharky Pipes on.. it's really that simple. If you want to cut corner... stay off the track and just hit the Cars and Coffee or maybe SCCA parking lot trials... IMO... I'll shut up now...
10-16-2015, 06:56 PM
#51
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I found out about this by accident via Sharkwerks website and their great write up on the 997 GT3.
Most of guys here who own GT3s are older and quite wealthy fellas, they have track support guys from Indy shops attend with them to do tyre pressures and clean the wind screen!
Ive asked these Indy guys about the coolant leak and they nod and say yeah seen one, but you know these guys don't get out of third gear..
I'd agree in the US you might have more chance of finding out based on the sheer numbers of GT3 owners / cars and cost difference.
The cost of a 997 GT3 here means it's very seldom you see them on the track and even at car meets they are rare..
Just sayin..
10-16-2015, 08:51 PM
#52
Rennlist Member
Aus prices are crazy. Here in NZ we have a relatively high number of GT3's in our group. Definitely not wealthy enough to have teams of people checking our tyre pressures and cleaning our windscreens!! And while most don't drive 10/10ths all the time, the cars do get a decent work out.
When I asked the local OPC to pin mine as a preventative measure they told me not to, as it would never happen. Three weeks later...
If you can I would get them pinned. It's worth the investment.
When I asked the local OPC to pin mine as a preventative measure they told me not to, as it would never happen. Three weeks later...
If you can I would get them pinned. It's worth the investment.
10-17-2015, 09:40 PM
#53
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10-19-2015, 05:02 PM
#55
I appreciate the posts. I put off the IMS bearing fix until I took it to my first PCA DE day, then got my head handed to me (in a nice way) for being short sighted.
I got it done (along with new clutch and RMS) and drove it for several more DE events and another 2 years without holding my breath that the $20k engine would give way.
Thanks for the reinforcement and honestly, especially to us newer guys.
I came from a 2003 C4S so I should know better.
I got it done (along with new clutch and RMS) and drove it for several more DE events and another 2 years without holding my breath that the $20k engine would give way.
Thanks for the reinforcement and honestly, especially to us newer guys.
I came from a 2003 C4S so I should know better.
10-19-2015, 05:57 PM
#56
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Points taken on the assumption that you should know about this... You are right.. If you are the kind of bloke that has a driver pick you up at your compound, take you to airport for awaiting G4 to fly 25 min to motorsport park and run 20 laps on your fully prepared and maintained GT3RSR or GT3.. you probably do not give 2 winks about welded or pinned pipes.... There are a few here that may roll like that.. 
The question about recognizing if it has been done.. If you can't get records from previous owner you can see from top of engine one of the fittings... If it is welded or pinned you will know. However... That does not mean they did them all.. Not sure why you would only do one but I suppose it could happen. Most that PIN or WELD also replace the pipes with the sharkworks ones.. I did mine when engine was out replacing Front and RMS...
The question about recognizing if it has been done.. If you can't get records from previous owner you can see from top of engine one of the fittings... If it is welded or pinned you will know. However... That does not mean they did them all.. Not sure why you would only do one but I suppose it could happen. Most that PIN or WELD also replace the pipes with the sharkworks ones.. I did mine when engine was out replacing Front and RMS...
10-19-2015, 07:04 PM
#57
Rennlist Member
As for some people not replacing the small pipes with Sharkwerks ones, some people get their pipes pinned while the engine is still in the car. Can be done and saves a considerable amount on labor.
I had the engine dropped and changed the pipes so my car would be closer to bulletproof, but according to those with much more know-how than I, those small pipes crack at the thinnest portion (where the o-rings go) and that leads to a leak rather than a catastrophic coolant dump thanks to AWOL fittings, so some people choose to prevent the bigger issue and just roll the dice on the significantly smaller issue.
Different strokes, different folks. I won't get into a debate regarding whether or not to do the Sharkwerks pipes, but as far as the fittings go, please pin or weld them (won't get into a discussion on whether to pin or weld either, but get it done).
If it's been pinned, you'll see these screws locking in the fittings in the housing.
Welding is pretty obvious. You will see the weld.
There's a total of 6 fittings, you probably won't be able to see them all, but if you spot most of them pinned or welded you're likely good to go.
Keep service records of everything. I am. Nice to have proof of everything.
10-20-2015, 01:33 PM
#58
And water wetter helps because it is not slick. The only thing it helps is when your car does dump coolant cars behind you won't start spinning. Coolant is slicker in the road and track than oil and there is a lot of it in these cars. I've seen it first hand a couple times on track.
Not pretty.
Not pretty.
My pipe blew, i had water water and 2 cars behind me still spun (luckily no contact).
Have said it in the past and will say it again... The only benefit of using water wetter is that once all the cars that have spun (potentially crashed) the track crew does not have to use kitty litter to clean up the coolant/glycerol... Track goes green sooner... The Water + WW will just evaporates.
Yes, glycol is slicker, but water alone is slick enough to cause cars to spin, even on a straight under the right conditions.
10-20-2015, 02:52 PM
#60
