24Chromium

Last time I was in Stevens Creek Porsche for service, my rep told me about how they just took a trade in on a customers nearly new 2010 GT3 for an '11 RS. Of course, the customer was Henri Richard, pro racer and multi-zillionaire CFO here in silicon valley. Wish I had that kind of cash to chase my dreams!

Mr Michael B

Slow is right on the money. Meissen a great Gulf substitute (if Porsche wont spray the original Gulf hue). It may be a just a tad washed out in comparison but its a fantastic vintage color - and I think it looks very good. On that particular RS I would have just stuck with silver wheels to accent the Meissen perfectly.

911SLOW

: )

With permission from the owner..

Carrera GT

$30K off sticker for a new RS? Even if you found one car with a boatload of options and a $180K sticker, $30K+ off?

Carrera GT

I imagine the buyer was smart to order the wheels painted to sample (now being far, far cheaper than later and a set of silver or black wheels is probably less than he spent on cabin leather ...)

I think "vintage" color is right -- on a period correct classic, it's a podium finish.

P.J.S.

CGT,

I meant the prices would firm up on USED cars when you can no longer get them new...

However, a NEW mid 150s sticker .2RS sold for 130 -- 2010 grey black, cash sale, McKenna, as reported to me by a friend in the know... is this an exageration? could be I suppose in the way that these types of stories are relayed... but say it was $135 then... still a chunk off MSRP...

Carrera GT

That sounds a little too hearsay and revisionist, but okay, you wrote "NOS" or "new old stock" and that means a new title sale. Facts will show the way when we see real, completed sales at public auction. In any case, I'll tip my cards by saying I own a 3.8 RS, so I can't deny my own bias that I want to see stronger primary and secondary market buyers, but the real game is on the seller -- if there are sellers and few buyers, then the sellers control the price. That might sound counter-intuitive, but it proves our time and time again every split second in the financial markets. Either the sellers hold their position or acquiesce to the cutthroat buyers or compelling individual circumstances. Volatility in price might seem unhealthy and unpleasant, but it's part of the process. We all enjoy volatility to the upside and tend to fear and loathe prices to the downside (perhaps because those prices rarely recover.) We'll see what the new year brings in the financial markets. I expect the US Dollar has to deal with a reality check -- the "Fed" (aka cloak and dagger central bankers in a private company above the law, answerable to no-one and printing US$3.3 trillion dollars of debt without so much as a by your leave from the US government, let alone the people...) That trillion dollar debt and inevitable inflation will remove buyers (for lack of liquidity and buying power.) I wonder if Porsche will have to absorb some of their secondary market weakness and carry it forward so that typical new buyers can roll into the new models for 2011 and 2012 -- Porsche certainly has some tricky cards to play in order to attract full subscription to the limited production "end of model" special editions like the GT2 RS and the rumored 4.0 GT3 RS. Where does Porsche look to find a buyer? I think this new mid-engined GT1 sort of thing is evidence of an embattled Porsche under new (and still somewhat novice management -- for all the niche brands VW has absorbed, they're yet to really make one work or even sustain itself) concerned with attacks from the flank by McLaren and from above by Ferrari. The handling of the 911 GT cars feels more like a mothballing retirement than an end of model run-out. With the Carrera GT a half decade stale, the halo needs to have all the bulbs replaced with green technology LEDs. Does Porsche wait for the 918? Should we mothball RL for three or four years and check back circa 2015?

SDGT3

The Porsche Exchange in Highland Park Illinois. 847.266.7000 Ask for Farris.

P.J.S.

CGT,

my bad... I was not clear in my original post

IMHO used pricing will firm up once the NEW and NOS (NOS cars being 2010 models since we are now basically in 2011) cars are gone... and until then I think a slow decline in used pricing is inevitable as is the case with most cars that are not difficult to locate.

I believe that NOS cars (2010s) on dealer lots can be had a significant savings over MSRP in certain instances... like an aging 2010 in your showroom that has not had any credible offers... you may jump on a "real" offer in order to get out of it... as every day your new 2010 grey black sits, is another day it is less attractive to the new buyer as it is "getting older" and another day for used low mile cars to be listed at $125 asking prices (see ZBB's beauty for sale)... So I can buy a used low mile car from an enthusiast at an asking price of $125 or buy a new one in the low/mid $150s... might motivate me if I am sitting on the "new" 2010.

My example posted:
new 2010 grey black msrp: low/mid 150s... say $153
He offered $130 cash
They countered at $139
He says he got it at $130 that day

what he actually paid... only he and the dealer know but a $139 counter on a low/mid $150s car in my mind is a signigicant discount off of msrp...

10 blue ones on dealer lots leads me to believe that there are at least 25-30 .2RS sitting on dealer showroom floors... If one is not picky about color/specs, I bet one could cut a fat hog so to speak. My example above is likely not the norm (yet).

what will a limited edition 500hp 4 liter rs do to the market... I thik they should hold off on that as IMHO it will not help move exisiting inventory.

Z356

McKenna (Porsche dealer in Norwalk, CA, in LA area) has been particularly aggressive in their pricing of .2 RS's. Back in early October, they offered in Ebay a Carrara White/Red .2 RS with a MSRP of $161K for a Buy Now of $146K! http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Porsc...fCarsQ5fTrucks
A fellow Rennlister I know told me his friend got offered this car for $141K, or $20K off its MSRP by McKenna. And this was three months ago! So the '10 Black Grey RS with mid-$150k MSRP that McKenna sold for $130K doesn't surprise me. In fact, nothing in this market is surprising to me anymore.

There appears to be (from my own observations in Autotrader, Cars and eBay) greater weakness in the market for $100K to $140K used .2 gt3 & RS than in the mostly sub $100K for used .1 gt3 and RS. z356

Carrera GT

Funnily enough, when I see the plethora of black-grey and aqua-blue cars still unsold, I attribute it to the (lack of) demand for the color.

I think that artful deal making in these last few days before year-end and month-end could well land enough of a discount to take the sting out of loss on resale. This depression in prices on newer GT cars is seasonal -- that's not to guarantee a recovery cycle (hence) my comments on the dollar, but I'd take this to be a rare situation when I'd encourage a seller to hold fast rather than take a deal and be done. As with the financial markets -- it's bad timing to sell when there are no buyers. : )