Who is running PCCB for DE on an RS?
07-01-2010, 05:32 PM
#46
I'm with you Carrera GT about learning to drive so the nannies don't intervene. I don't recall seeing the TC-SC warning lights come on but I was looking at the track mostly and don't know if the indicators were flashing. Just know the rear pads are wearing more quickly than the fronts. I just ordered a replacement set of rear stock PCCB ($315 discount pricing) pads and they aren't that bad relative to the Pagid race pads some are using on steel rotors.
I did notice the TC/SM lights flashing when I drove 2 days at NJMP (Lightning) at turn 1 which is a blind uphill apex which unweighs the suspension at the top of the turn (so that may be when I'm getting the most wear to the rear pads).
I did notice the TC/SM lights flashing when I drove 2 days at NJMP (Lightning) at turn 1 which is a blind uphill apex which unweighs the suspension at the top of the turn (so that may be when I'm getting the most wear to the rear pads).
07-01-2010, 06:12 PM
#47
I also read recently in Panorama's news section that Porsche and the company that subcontracts the PCCB rotors are trying to expand production from current 35,000 sets to 250,000 sets each year. When the numbers and process for making them gets improved, the costs should come way down. Just like large screen LCD TV's. The early adopters always pay the price for being first to have advance technology.
07-02-2010, 05:23 AM
#48
Platinum Dealership
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I think the better alternative is to learn to drive so the "nannies" don't intervene. : )
I've heard rumors the pro drivers testing the car reported they can't put down faster laps with the 2010 RS safeties turned off. It would be interesting to get some factual attributions, interviews, quotes. For the time being, in my experience, there's no advantage in turning off the SC/TC in the 2010 RS and no change in rear brake temps. This is entirely unlike the 2007-8 meddlesome junk.
I've heard rumors the pro drivers testing the car reported they can't put down faster laps with the 2010 RS safeties turned off. It would be interesting to get some factual attributions, interviews, quotes. For the time being, in my experience, there's no advantage in turning off the SC/TC in the 2010 RS and no change in rear brake temps. This is entirely unlike the 2007-8 meddlesome junk.
bottom line is- drifting is really really fun but also not the fastest way around the track. therefore- the really really fast lap times are not going to have a lot of wheelspin...the fastest laps are generally the ones with the least mistakes and the smoothest transitions between inputs rather than the "holy $#@^" factor of sliding around, mashing pedals and yanking the wheel all over like most track day people experience
anyway- there won't be a need for TC or SC on the "mistake free lap"
07-02-2010, 12:41 PM
#49
Race Director
rumors indeed- wonder if the 'ring time is SC+TC off?
bottom line is- drifting is really really fun but also not the fastest way around the track. therefore- the really really fast lap times are not going to have a lot of wheelspin...the fastest laps are generally the ones with the least mistakes and the smoothest transitions between inputs rather than the "holy $#@^" factor of sliding around, mashing pedals and yanking the wheel all over like most track day people experience
anyway- there won't be a need for TC or SC on the "mistake free lap"
bottom line is- drifting is really really fun but also not the fastest way around the track. therefore- the really really fast lap times are not going to have a lot of wheelspin...the fastest laps are generally the ones with the least mistakes and the smoothest transitions between inputs rather than the "holy $#@^" factor of sliding around, mashing pedals and yanking the wheel all over like most track day people experience
anyway- there won't be a need for TC or SC on the "mistake free lap"
07-02-2010, 03:00 PM
#50
Nordschleife Master
...bottom line is- drifting is really really fun but also not the fastest way around the track. therefore- the really really fast lap times are not going to have a lot of wheelspin...the fastest laps are generally the ones with the least mistakes and the smoothest transitions between inputs rather than the "holy $#@^" factor of sliding around, mashing pedals and yanking the wheel all over like most track day people experience
anyway- there won't be a need for TC or SC on the "mistake free lap"
anyway- there won't be a need for TC or SC on the "mistake free lap"
...Sir Jackie about the benefits of driving smoothly and having a "great relationship with your car"
@ 0:48 "you look the slowest" talking to JS
@ 2:32 "every corner is an adventure" JS talking about some of the guys out there
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OgSiK_VarK8
07-02-2010, 03:28 PM
#51
Rennlist Member
jackie s - very cool indeed thanks for posting ... checkout some of the other vids there especially of his in-car laps of the ring in '73 ... the man has ***** of steel!
07-03-2010, 09:37 AM
#53
Rennlist Member
If that happens, it would be great news.. I think many people would be happy to pay $1,000 a rotor for PCCB replacement.. (same price as high quality irons such as Alcon / Brembo / etc.) That would also be close to the replacement cost of Chevy's ZR-1 CCB.. (I think?)
I also read recently in Panorama's news section that Porsche and the company that subcontracts the PCCB rotors are trying to expand production from current 35,000 sets to 250,000 sets each year. When the numbers and process for making them gets improved, the costs should come way down. Just like large screen LCD TV's. The early adopters always pay the price for being first to have advance technology.
07-10-2010, 01:03 AM
#56
Poseur
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I also read recently in Panorama's news section that Porsche and the company that subcontracts the PCCB rotors are trying to expand production from current 35,000 sets to 250,000 sets each year. When the numbers and process for making them gets improved, the costs should come way down. Just like large screen LCD TV's. The early adopters always pay the price for being first to have advance technology.
07-12-2010, 06:27 PM
#57
I have just done 8 track days (3 at NJMP Thunderbolt) and found that the rears stock pads were only worn down about 1-2 mm from the original 11 mm thickness. I also feel that I'm overbraking and need to use them less in the future. I guess I'm not pushing hard enough to be wearing them down too soon.
08-22-2010, 12:16 PM
#58
Track Day
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I am new to track driving. I have had my 2007 GT3 RS since May, 2010. The first time I drove the car and used the brakes I just had an OMG experience. I have had some decent cars, 2006 BMW 330i, 2008 BMW 535xi, 2008 Porsche Turbo, but the ceramic brakes on the GT3 RS were incredible. To describe the experience, it was like I said, okay, time to start braking, and the next thing I knew, I was stopped, he he, very cool feeling. So, I drove the car with the ceramics at maybe two HPDE events but I was too new to track driving to have anything to compare to. The Porsche technicians that maintain my car highly recommended I switch to steel rotors and Pagid yellow pads, mainly to save on cost of replacement. They cited some people saying the rotors wear out fast, that a rock can fly up and chip the ceramic rotors, and that they simply are not the best for the track. So, I went with their advice, AP Endurance steel rotors in the front, stock steel rotors in the rear, stock yellow calipers, Pagid yellow brake pads. I have been to around 10 HPDE events with the steel and I am not happy at all. Just about every event I have been to, there has been one or two cases where I can't get the car stopped, and I am standing on the pedal with about 70-80% of my leg strength, the ABS never kicks in, or at least I don't feel any pulsating on the pedal, just firm pedal resistance and poor braking. I flush the brake fluid before every event and use Castrol SRF. I'm told the problem I am experiencing is on account of over braking (i.e. operator error). Being a new driver I am sure I am not braking optimally, but seriously, not being able to slow the car down, going off track, or nearly so, when I am standing on the pedal for a good 1-2 seconds? I guess if the pads heat up too much they can release a gas that forms a pocket between the pads and the rotor. So, the point is, ever since I switched to steel, I have been contemplating going back to the PCCB. The Porsche technicians discourage it, but this thread has given me new confidence in making the decision to switch back to PCCB. If nothing else, it will give me a direct comparison. Now that I have a bit of track experience with the steel rotors and Pagid yellows, I can do a direct comparison to the PCCB's. I'll report back once I have switched.
08-22-2010, 12:22 PM
#59
You are experiencing exactly what a lot of beginners suffer on track. You probably do not brake hard enough and brake too long which leads to overheating of the brakes. The reason you don't have this with PCCB is because those brakes are nearly impossible to overheat. A decent (stock or aftermarket) steel brake setup on a GT3 should never overheat on track if used correctly. I suggest you get some tuïtion and I presume your instructor will tell you to brake later and harder. Switching back to PCCB will NOT fix driver error 