Tacet-Conundrum

We all know about the cost and value of our cars. The Porsche Tax is very apparent. It is all something we accept blindly as for being faithful to Porsche.

Now as for adding value. Where does all the money go? I understand that a new engine for the GT3/RS, GT2 and Turbo models cost over $20K! Beyond research and development, which I know can cost a substantial amount of money, where is the value added? Due to the cost and reliability I cannot believe that these engines are not 100% hand made. Is this true? I can see the Boxster, Cayman and six cylinder Cayanne engines being partially machine built.

Which is it?

malmasri

Ultimate factories showed the engine asembly for the GT3 among other 911's, and it is partially hand assembled. Not hand made for sure.

MJones

Hand made...not What engine is?
Hand assembled....yes

At least thru MY10, the engines were still Hot dyno tested
The new DFI engines are only Cold tested

Macster

Where does the money go? Mainly profit. If that $20K cost of a new engine represented labor it would mean the engine took several weeks to assemble by hand. I've come across Porsche master techs at various dealerships that can assemble an engine in just a day or so and get the engine into the car in under another day's time.

Sincerely,

Macster.

Edgy01

Porsche claims their Carrera engines take 125 hours to assemble. Do the math.

C.J. Ichiban

it's not just the time involved but the skill/pay scale is higher at the gt2/gt3/turbo line then it is on the cayman/boxster line. Their engines are dyno tested and graded. if you're always coming in at lower HP numbers than the guy next to you, he gets promoted and you do not.

also, the parts are much more expensive on the gt2/gt3 engines. all that press material about titanium this and that etc is legit...the alloys are stronger and more expensive, and the tolerances are pretty intense. That's why the engines produce so many HP/L.

if you have a problem with the cost or "where does the money go"- check out corvettes. A z06 is still the worst interior ever...it's basically a chevy s-10 interior.

At the factory when I visited the first time back in Oct 07, I got to see the line and people assembling RS and GT3 and GT2 engines- it's pretty simple: they crank out between 2 and 4 per day, per technician.

Tacet-Conundrum

I don't have a problem of the cost. Like I said above I think we all are resolved to paying the Porsche Tax. Otherwise we wouldn't be posting here... We would be posting at 6speed about how rad the Nissan GTR is and how it cost half as much as the 911 Turbo. But then I sure as hell wouldn't want to do a 0 to 60 run in a GTR with launch turned off, or what ever the name of that nanny system is that watches the revs that makes sure you don't drop your tranny. Because we all know Nissan won't warranty the tranny if it's turned off. Which makes going up against a 911 Turbo with Sport Chrono + just about futile!

125 hours eh? At $50 an hour that's about $6250! Then you add materials and processing and forming.

I wonder what the exact cost to the consumer is for each engine? Twin Turbo, GT2, GT3, GT3RS?

k4site

125 hours seems high, I know that when they went to the water cooled engines that they saved time.

Larry Cable

h'mmm ... perhaps I mis-recall the factory tour of the engine assy in Stutgart (june '07) but I thought they said it took around 2hrs to assemble the engine
on the line ...

YMMV

GT3

FWIW, an E9x M3 engine, which is an integrated dry sump motor (really wet sump), runs about $30K. I'd expect GT1 dry sump motors to cost more...

Larry Cable

I haven't seen the numbers, but via hearsay I have heard that if you want to buy a GT3 engine in a crate (retail) it's in the range of $40k off the shelf.

PNUT

remember, some of the money goes directly to the race programs, r&d etc. as well. we help fund these programs with the dollars spent.

roberga

and if you buy it over there another 25% for VAT

Tacet-Conundrum

VAT, don't understand how there is Value being Added on top for Tax? Seems silly.

If I called my local dealer's part depot would they be able to quote the price?

C.J. Ichiban

VAT is sales tax at 17%