340Elise

C.J.,

What is the weight savings gained by switching to the GT3 cup rotors/ system?

I imagine it is a superior system for the track, but I am not a track hound (I wish I had the time and near proximity to good tracks to allow me to become one). Besides, you seem to love your ceramics from all of your PCCB defending posts that I have read. I use my car mainly on the street and I am trying to shave as much weight as possible . It seems to me that the ceramics are a good choice for me because of mostly street use, ocassional track use, and my strict GT3 diet that I am on.

If anyone is wondering why I am trying to lose so much weight on my GT3 for street use, I can tell you that I do not need a track to feel the benefits on a daily basis. Go take a used Lotus for a spirited test drive on the street sometime and tell me that you could not feel the light weight of the car on every single movement of the steering wheel and every corner whether it was taken at 4/10's or 8/10's on the street.

I just shaved 85 lbs from my GT3 by getting the CLOTH 996 GT3 seats and leaving the passenger side out (I always drive my myself anyway, no need for the passenger seat). This was static weight and I could immediately tell the difference. It made a great car even better, and only cost me $2,000.00. Btw, the cloth are 2 lbs lighter each than their leather counterparts and look sooo much more sporty/racey to me. I love the full color crest on the headrest and the cloth feels great. I am glad to get rid of some more leather in my car; I will save that for my Cadillac or other luxury show boat.

I am now searching for some of the lightest wheels that $6,000 will buy. From my research and weighing my OEM wheels, I can save as much as 33 lbs on a full set of wheels. This combined with the PCCB's will shave almost 70 lbs of unsprung weight from my car, most of it being rotational mass. I don't think I need to tell anybody that this is HUGE!!!

I can't wait to see what the car feels like with the new brakes and wheels! And then I will complete my next phase of weight reduction and get my 3 to 2,880 lbs with 1/4 tank of gas. That is 300 lbs less than my stock weight. ooo, I can pick up a 275 lb woman and still have the same performance as the day I bought this car! See the advantages of weight reduction?

roberga

I would expect that with street use you will never replace the rotors. I track mine a lot and with 56,000 miles the rear rotors are like glass. The fronts are newer(GennII) with about 30K on them and they smooth as well. Of course as some suggest my lap times are measured with a watch without a second hand

acf

hey 340, Ive read the pccbs save 47lbs from the stock steelies. That was for the 996 turbo.

C.J. Ichiban

stephen, the reason why I suggested the cup rotors is for cost effectiveness...but cup floating rotors work better as a replacement for the pccb rotors (same diameter so you can reuse caliper) and have semi-reusable aluminum hats.

but just to warn you- if you don't get the ABS computer software you risk melting your whole system as the lockup point for steels is going to be much different than PCCB and god knows the computer could do some wacky **** under threshold braking.

I think your gt3 diet is a fantastic idea, I'd like to take all the weight out of mine as well but I need the extra few lbs to keep me planted on the road.

Derik Royal

I will second the recommendation on making sure you have the appropriate ABS program. I added PCCBs to my 05 C2S that was originally equipped with the steel rotors and four piston front calipers. I (I use this term loosely) didn't have the ABS program adjusted accordingly and I ruined the front set of rotors in roughly 500 track miles. Unfortunately, it took a significant amount of time and front pads (four sets) to figure out that the ABS was the culprit. Most dealers are not aware of the programming issue. I suppose few if any have sold a set of new PCCB's after the car has been delivered. I replaced the ruined ceramic rotors with 350mm steel rotors off of a 997 GT3. The ABS programming seems to be fine when going from ceramic to steel. Good luck$$$.

derik

340Elise

I appreciate that guys; I will definetely look into it; this is why I love Rennlist. Thank you so much, you may have just saved me a whole lot of money!

Have a great weekend!

Carrera GT

For what it's worth, there's nothing in the PIWIS indicating any differences for settings on cars with steel or ceramics. This would suggest that the ABS programming is "one size fits all" and during production, the car is built without differences other than the rotor and caliper.

As for weight savings, I hope some finds a decent price on Titanium lug bolts -- I have a weakness for Ti.

Derik Royal

A follow up on the ABS programming:
Suncoast Porsche performed the programming change on my car. They were not aware of it until they researched the issue for a few days. The service manager at Champion Porsche recommended the change when I contacted him for suggestions on why I was going through front pads every 100 track miles and why the ceramic rotors were starting to flake. I had to carefully explain that my car was not originally built with the PCCBs before he offered the ABS programming suggestion.
FWIW: I borrowed a set of front ceramic rotors for three track days at VIR in March and had no issues after the programming change. It was an expensive character building experience that I assume others wouldn't want to duplicate. Just my $12k.
derik

Carrera GT

I was checking specifically for the 997 GT3.

340Elise

Thank you!

GMG said the same. They claim they have done this now on 5 997's and it is a piece of cake to do the swap. They never had a problem with premature pad wear or anything else.

Btw, where is a source for titanimum lug bolts, even the expensive ones? I just want to look.

Carrera GT

Alex at Sharkwerks.com can get them. Pricy but. I've been procrastinating on that one. I rationlize it as being something you buy once and carry forward from car to car or resell for 80% of the purchase price.

Yargk

yeah, also why?

If I've read correctly you're looking at a 32 vs. 36 pound weight savings. So for 4 pounds you get the tried and true steel for the track. Even if you get a screaming deal now, what happens when you need to replace the ceramic discs?

340Elise

OEM, that is why. I sell my cars often and with the PCCB's I can actually sell my OEM steel brakes and really get a SCREAMING deal. Then, I can still get the GTR's if I want in the future and save my PCCB's until I sell the car. I just did a little test with selling my car (remember, I wanted an RS?) and I found the if I had the ceramics it would have been a done deal. Like it or not (know it or not), the ceramics are more popular. And in my case, if it all works out on the conversion (I have 3 reliable sources saying that it will, and the seller I know for a fact is reliable), and I do sell my red stockers, then my PCCB "factory" option will end up costing me about $6K vs. almost $9K for those who checked it on the order sheet. AND, if I get them and change my mind for some reason (because I am loving my Elise and want to stick money into that car instead as a dedicated track car), then I am willing to bet a pretty good sum of money that I can get exactly what I paid for these PCCB's if I resell them, or at the very least, come very, very close to what I paid. Seems like a no-brainer to me.

Also, I have only seen the GTR's listed at $19,995 and $22K thus far. I have heard that $13K is possible, but I want to know if it is the real ones; the "bad boys." The ones that GMG uses on their WC car is a special set of the GTR's and is supposedly only one of two sets in the world. Not only that, but they are actually 1.5 lbs lighter per corner than the PCCB's! That would mean they have an unspung savings about 42 instead of the 36 for the PCCB's.

But I am not going to spend $22K on a set of brakes for my GT3. That is almost what I paid for my 2005 Elise with less than 4K miles on the clock. Besides, a $22K set of GTR brakes would be totally wasted on me and my driving abilities..

Stephen