TRAKCAR

Hello everyone,

I have been reading Rennlist for a while, but never posted something before.

I am looking for my next track car and right now an 08 Z06, 08 Viper ACR and 997 GT3 are really my only choices, although a Viper might be to small. I do not fit in Caymans, S2000's or Exiges.

I agree with the posts on the Z06, but one thing that is not mentioned is safety.

Maybe it is just me, but the Z06 and Viper with just a 4 point roll bar in the back seems not very safe so I have to add about 10-15K for a cage, especially in the aluminum / plastic Z06 and I am not even sue if i still fit in them being 6'4".

Now too I run with a 8 point cage, Kirkey seat, Hans device and 5 point belts and it is my daily driver as my next car will be. I run on the limit at the track, as that is the fun part. I have not spun it yet, but sooner or later we all do, so dafety is big for me....

I am not a "porsche guy" but for the money a 997 GT3 seems safest as it is steel and screwed together more solid and I would trust it with just a roll bar in the back and so not having to destroying the car as I did mine. (Throw-away Mustang.)

Never mind the driving "feel" that I think is more important than ultimate laptimes.

Look at wrecked exotics, the only ones that crash and are still in one piece are the Porsches, the rest "scatters" often.

NJ-GT

Trakcar,

You bring a very valid point, and one of the reasons I bought a Porsche 911. When I looked at wrecked Vettes, Vipers, Ferraris, they really take a beat. Porsches, they stay in good shape, they are definitely safer.

TraqGear

Since you are not "spoiled" by driving any of these cars for any great lenght of time, I would be very interested in you impression of each. And, if you get a chance, drive a Lotus 240 as well.

allegretto

Had a Cup 255 last year.

At 6' 205 lbs it was barely big enough. Sort of felt as though I was pre-loaded into my coffin however.

TRACKCAR states he's 6'4", so neither him nor you (as I recall you're fairly tall and in very good shape) will fit easily, if at all.

And, FWIW it's no match for a GT-3 or TT unless it's a very short and technical track.

171mph

The Viper is supposedly a track car and yet it has no dry sump? Plus the aero downforce will be pretty marginal at most twisty tracks since downforce decreases exponentially with speed. I think a modded z06 would be a better track car - dry sump (i have a cayman and now appreciate that lacking feature), plus the mods mentioned above would be schaweeeet!

mooty

you got PM

TRAKCAR

Anything drives better than a Mustang, and not so sure it is that safe, even with a roll cage.
It is kind of fun to have to drive around the cars problems and not care about the car.
I expect to have a bit more carefull inthe beginning and have to learn to drive all over again with a GT3.

Lotus Europa would be a possibility and I hear a new Esprit is coming up...

I have been a passenger on the track in a Z06 and GT3 (Actually yours, zbb0730 Roger? I think when I was at Roebling road.) Neither drivers were going all out, maybe 7/10th. I am uncomfortable driving someone else's car close to 10/10th. anyway. I did rent a Viper GTS for a few days, but did not take it on the track.

At 7/10th in the passenger seat and on the street does not let you see all, but I think I have enough of an impression to know that the GT3 is by far the nicest to drive, more precise, less crude although the Z06 came a long way.

The kick in the *** when you throttle out of a corner with 500+ lb of torque is nice, but it is more about wringing out the car than the ultimate laptime for me. A Z06 with the right mods is faster than a GT3.

The initial cost is about the same if you pay MSRP for a non RS and in the end I guess cheaper as the Porsche will hold together better on the track and residual value if you sell it later. And I fit.

My plan is to keep it simple, add seat belts roll bar,drive the snot out of it and keep it for a long time, drive is about 8K miles a year, about half of them on the track.

I would be happy just replacing the fuids, rotors, tires and brake pads.

TRAKCAR

http://www.wreckedexotics.com/

TraqGear

When were you at Roebling? If it was 7/10ths, then it probably was me. But, I'm better now, at least 7.5/10ths! Kidding aside, you really need to drive them to really feel the handling IMO.

Another consideration might be the GTR Nissan. If it measures up to the hype, would be a great track car.

TRAKCAR

I was at Roebling road in October I think. brought my Ford Dually and 44ft 5th. wheel, Sodi trailer.

Indeed I forgot about the upcoming Nissan. Very impressive articles, and I think the GT-R will be easy to go very, very fast in, but more like the Turbo.

For me it is not the car, 4 wheel drive, even heavier 3800lbs!! and even more nanny tronics with super all wheel drive.

I go to the track to drive the car, not to let the car drive me.
That is the charm of the GT3 and it makes the GT2 less exciting to me.

Peter

TRAKCAR

See www.bekkersracing.com for some youtube lapping of ths southeast tracks.

mooty

trackcar, it will take some time to learn how to drive *** backward 911's well, if iyou haven't had much experience in rear engine cars. i got a lot of mileage in those but am still learning every time i am out on track.

i have had a lot of cars for track, elise, exige, m3 of sorts, cayman s, boxster, 993, 996c2, c4s, GT3, 997.... i like rear engined 911's best for ONE very simple reason. you buy them and just drive drive drive.

ALL others cars NEED help. brakes, dry sumps, oil starvation, fuel starvation, useless factory suspension, things literally falling off the car you name it. they were all initially cheaper than GT3, but after modding them to track and taking HUGE loss (60k lotus i sold for 35 in 12 months granged i put 15k miles on it), the GT3 is possibly the cheapest car you can possibly track, well maybe SM is cheaper.

and at times it's not so much about the money, it's the time for me to get the car to/from mechanic. each round trip could easily take up 4 hours in traffic, involving someone to drive me home blah blah...

if you want a car that you just track the **** out of it in stock form (you do need seats, harness, tires/wheels roll bar, but all other cars need them too.) without actual hardware modification, i challenge you to find a production car regardless of price that can beat the dry sump 911's. i tried for the last 5 years, and wasted a huge amount of money and guess what, i am back to GT3 again again and again. this is GT3 number five and hopefully the last one.

roberga

The last one//// who are you kidding :-)

TRAKCAR

Mooty,

My thoughts exactly. It is nice to hear my thoughts confirmed by someone who has been there and done that! Thank you for the post.


I bought the 2 Mustangs (1 for my brother) just to learn to drive a car after karting and I wanted cheap to see if I really like the track days like I thought I would. I pretty much made them work, as there is a lot of knowledge and parts out there for the Mustangs, but it will never handle as good, or be as dependable and I am ready for some more HP.

Now I am addicted, go at LEAST once a month there is no way to stop, I already booked my available weekends from 4 days at Sebring this month to all the way through Road Atlanta in March.

I do not like to race, or tinker/work on cars, even have the trailer so I do not have to change rims at the track, if we go out of state.

You are 100% correct; With a GT3, first of all I fit in it comfortably, go and buy Seats, Seat belts, roll bar, corner weighing, track alignment, set of rims and off I go. All other cars need a lot of work and in most cases if done right they exceed the price of a GT3.

At first I was a bit concerned about the *** backwards part, as I drive on the limit of the car and my ability and the Mustang is so easy to catch, I am starting to think I know how to drive. Surely the GT3 will bring me back to earth. After going for a ride in one, I am not so worried anymore though.

Once in a while I look at a M3, Z06, Exice Forcefed etc. but as soon as I am instructing a student (I am PCA instructor) I hear what they spend and need to spend to make them work, I am back to the GT3.

I just do not at all like the 996's look and depreciation, but the 997 seems right to me and I think they will do better than the 997's. Not like the 993's maybe but better.

Peter

VB997

Great job at VIR Peter! I was out there with you on Dec 8...