tshih

Having been extremely lucky to buy my 2010 GT3 with 350 miles optioned with PCCBs I wanted to track it and report on my real world experience with how those rotors have held up after 12 years of combined street and track driving. During the first 3 years I was extremely mindful of the potential of damage to these expensive to replace rotors ($7000-8000 each retail) and would change and flip the front pads after 5 track days or when the pad wear sensors indicate the pads have been worn below the 40% mark. After being diligent and seeing no problems I became complacent until a couple of times I actually came close to running the pads all the way down to the metal backing plate. To my credit I have always used the OEM PCCB brake pads that were developed for use with the PCCB rotors at costs of around $350-400 a set (fronts or rears) and they lasts about 10 track days per set. The rears actually last about 12-15 days but the rears wear more on the inner side due to traction /stability management PSM kicking in from poor driving.The fact that the centerlock wheels were such a pain in the *** to remove and mount did not help my due diligence in keeping on top of checking for wear. So between years 5-8 I had accidentally wore down the inner front pads about 2-3 mm off the backing plates since the outside pads still show plenty of pad left! It was these negligent instances that led to accelerated wear and damage to to the rotors. At the 10 year mark (around 50,000 miles) I was driving down the front straight of Thunderbolt and my brake pedal suddenly went down to the floor causing me to pit immediately. I removed the driver side rear wheel which was leaking brake fluid because the inside brake pad backing plate had been worn down to a sliver and the pistons were about to pop out of the calipers. That caused me to order a replacement rear rotor from Sunset Porsche (2019, $6000). The front rotors were starting to look pretty rough and at the 57000 miles mark were replaced with a new pair from Suncoast Porsche ($14,000 a pair + new front pads and mounting pins kits). Finally I committed another act of stupidity by going to Watkins Glen last year with only 50% rear pads for a 3 day DE. After the 1st day of open track, my wear sensor light came on and I stupidly did not bring a set of new pads. I decided to try to drive the remaining 2 days at a reduced pace but wound up scoring the rear rotors to the point where they needed replacement as well. When I ordered the new passenger side rear rotor ($7000 from Porsche of Delaware) I discovered to my horror that the one purchased earlier in 2019 from Sunset was not the correct rotor for a GT3 (was for a 991 Carrera S or GTS). This forced me to reuse the hat and mounting hardware from the old rotor to make use of the new rotor. It is my belief that had I been more careful to always change out pads that are worn below 40% these rotors would still be usable after 57000 miles of which about 15000 miles were track miles as I drive to all the tracks and back using street tires. Those stories of 1st generation PCCBs being severely worn are most likely due to user abuse (by using other brake pads that were meant to be used with iron rotors (i.e motorsports green pagid pads) or abuse like mine where the backing plates have been accidentally worn/ground down by the rotors. Attached are photos of the worn front rotors and rear rotors where you can notice the severe pitting of the surface which feels very rough to the touch versus the smooth new rotors.The worn pitted rotors chew down a set of new pads after only 2-3 25 min track sessions. The 3rd gen PCCBs found on 991GT3's and 718GT4's are event more robust than my 2nd gen PCCB's as they last over 26 track days a set (only 40% worn). I have them as the $8000 option on my 2020 GT4.

Notice inside pad worn down to backing plate while outside pad still have 20% pad material left.



New driver side rear PCCB rotor for 991 Carrera not GT3 notice shiny aluminum hat which weighs 900g more than GT3's gray

old rotor with mounting hat removed for transfer to new rotor.

KNSBrakes

Good topic

An iron conversion runs about $4500 or so. I'd suggest that provides a predictable solution with enough pad options to fine tune your setup.

You would probably struggle to even come close cost wise, but what we generally hear is that iron brakes work better overall. We serve a decent market of Porsche and other makes that face the same question.

So actually hmm,
-Get the iron brake car
-Get the CCm car and convert
-Get the CCm car and use it

?

Elliotw44

Surface Transform is another option worth calling out for those who want to retain Ceramics

ilko

Great info, thank you for sharing! What is your cool down procedure at the track?

With an extra lap at a slow pace or driving around the paddock for a bit without using the brakes so they can cool down helps a lot with longevity of the rotors. If the brakes are too hot the pads practically glue themselves to the rotor surface once the car is stopped and when you start moving they literally take chunks off the rotor.

8Lug

so @tshih , You're saying you went 57k miles including 15k track miles before replacing the front rotors? That seems great, and certainly flies in the face of all the typical comments that PCCBs won't last long for track use.

996TS

100%, Surface Transforms are very good and wear even slower than the early PCCBs (not sure how they compare to the latest gen).

There is also https://www.rebrake.de/en/prices/ which reconstructs PCCBs and other carbon ceramic rotors. I have heard very good things but yet to use them. A full set is ~7,500 (all 4).

There are many options for PCCB rotors today other than going to the dealer, or going to steel rotors. There is no reason to fear using them, performance and value are > steel

LOVE seeing those PCCBs get used!! Fun track days I am sure

tshih

No cool down needed as the silicon carbide rotors are impervious to heat and doesn't behave like iron rotors which can warp and stick to the pads when hot (i.e. glowing red hot ) I am a chemist (PhD Caltech 1984) and PCCBs are superior in every way compared to traditional iron rotors. The Surface transform ones requires spacers and other adapters to work with the Porsche calipers, etc and not a direct bolt on. As I have indicated these rotors were prematurely worn by my negligence of allowing the pads metal backing plate to be ground down on several occasions. Had I been more careful to never allow anything other than the associated PCCB brake pads to touch the rotors I believe that those rotors would lasts another 40000 miles. The current gen PCCBs are superior to my generation's and the pads last 3-4 times as long >26days vs only 10.

tshih

Yes they are great and when properly used MUST used the OEM brake pads that are designed for PCCB rotors and certainly not any of the other brake pads out there that fits into the red calipers) they can lasts and go the distance. If those that track their GT3 on steel rotors (Porsche iron ones) change out a new set each season/year at a costs of $2000 for all 4 rotors then factored 12 years on iron rotors would costs $24k which is only $2000 less than my replacement costs using OEM PCCB rotors.

fayraree

Thanks for the great write up! Are you sure about this? I know the kit from Movit back in the day required different calipers but @Hinz Motorsport sent me actual rotor hat measurements for the ST kit made for 997.2 GT3 and I was told they are a direct bolt on.

JS

Great info.
Thank you for sharing.

Hinz Motorsport

We are reviving a bit of an old thread here but yes and no. We offer a few kits for the 997.2 GT3/RS with iron or PCCB. 380mm or 392mm front, your choice. 380 clears 18" wheels. 392 needs 19" wheels. 380 is direct swap, 392 uses a 6mm spacer on the front caliper bolts (with supplied longer bolts) to push the calipers out 6mm radially. It is nearly a direct swap, as nothing else has to be changed and the calipers and bolts have to be removed anyway to install the discs and/or new pads. The rears for both kits are 362mm. Again, just need 6mm caliper spacers with longer supplied bolts.

997.1 GT3 models with iron use the 996 GT3 kits, which are 350mm front and rear. These are direct swap.

fayraree

Got it, thanks for clarifying Rick! Didn’t realize I needed longer bolts. Expecting braking performance and durability to improve so it’s an easily acceptable adjustment!