WantA997

Perfectly stated.

pissedpuppy

the forum has spoken!

get the GT3 and thank us all later

You'll likely never own a different variant 911

dawgcatching

Thanks for all of the help. The GT3 sounds like what best suits my wife and I. The only issue is the lack of rear seats, so the kids no longer get to be cool kids getting dropped off at school in the 911. There tends to be a glut of SAHM's driving minivans and Range Rovers in that parking lot. Not a single 911 to be found, which is quite lame.

silviaks

I had the same dilemma, with around the same amount of money, I was also considering the 911T. I ended up with the 997.2 GT3 after all. It is mainly because I was coming from a track prepped m3. I needed something more raw and able to track, and I also think that GT3 will retain the value better. The shop I purchased from was a porsche indy shop / consignment center, they had quite a collection - .2 GT3, 991 RS, GT4, 996 GT3. Everyone at the shop said to go with GT3.

agdamis

GT3 made by Preuninger and GT division. GTS made by Porsche road cars division no comparison

If you see a 997.2 GT3 for under $100k let me know I will buy it

hillsdonsmith

thxbuff2001

If you want a special car to drive on a special day(whatever day it is), get a 997.2 GT3.

If you want a daily, get a 991 GTS.

shotor

Agreed. Combined with a much smaller glass house, its getting to the point where the joy of driving is being diminished. Its not a big deal on the track, but driving around town or on twisty road, visibility is huge part of the experience. The 992 is going to get even worst I assume.

991.2 GTS is faster car than a 997.2 GT3 around a track. The way it puts down power/torque out of slow corners is simply amazing. Combined with PDK and the latest TC software, in the hands of the "average" driver, the lap times can be very different.

dawgcatching

Hey, we have a 997 too! Garage space may be an issue however.

mgwally

I sold my 991.1 GTS w/ a 7-speed manual and acquired a 997 GT3. The GT3 is far from perfect, but it's a much more visceral car to drive. Hard to explain but it just feels raw. The 991 GTS was cool, but I felt a little disconnected. Hope this helps.

voodoo

We should post this in the 991 forum and compare the results. haha

golfnutintib

the generational shift from 997 to 991 is very substantial... 991 platform much bigger, more stable, much more comfortable and easier to drive fast than 997

some people new to porsche may find 991 much more user friendly and still extremely exciting

to be sure, one needs to be on the porsche sport car learning / experience curve for a good while to really appreciate and extract what the 997 gt3 offers... it is very special indeed but like all things that are edgy and visceral and built for a 'niche; market, depending on where the person is coming from and has experienced, it may just be too much of a good thing -- the special qualities offered are just not able to be valued by the noob owner

for example if you are coming from a sporty bmw or jaguar or something like that, a 991 carrera or gts would in itself be quite a revelation

dawgcatching

I ended up passing on the 997.2 I planned to buy, due to an undisclosed FAL issue (detailed in the FAL malfunction thread here). I loved the car though. Honestly, I don't think it felt any faster than our 991 with PDCC in the corners (and probably isn't) but the engine, transmission, road feel, steering, and overall connection between the car, the driver, and the road felt more substantial than the 991, or any other car I have recently driven, for that matter. Sure, a 991 is more comfortable and just as fast at the track, but the .2 GT3 just feels special; it has a fun factor that can't be easily replicated.

So yes, I am a believer.

golfnutintib

it is counter-intuitive that newer cars are more advanced and effortlessly faster yet feel less special (at least at sane, road-going speeds), but it is the reality, and it applies in spades as one moves further back in time in the porsche lineage...older cars have much more connected feel and a more visceral nature, but they definitely have more modest performance envelopes

it is a terrific discussion to have with folks who have experienced many generations of 911's and variants to discuss where the 'sweet spot' is (great driving feel AND absolute performance)... for modern water cooled cars it seems to me the 997 is it... and among air cooled cars it's probably the 964

nice to have a car model that has been continuously refined, developed, and modernized over some 50-60 years... we are all lucky kids in the porsche candy store!!!

jackb911

I've owned 22 Porsches since 1972 and you are so right about the "fun factor" that the earlier Porsches provide. 356's feel woefully underpowered compared to even the slowest of today's econoboxes but 356's are a total blast to drive on a curvy road if tracking isn't your thing,

The early pre-964 911's felt decently quick at the time and were/are also very engaging as road cars. But the '74-later impact bumper cars felt (and were) heavier and lost a bit of "Porsche-ness" as they became heavier and more comfortable as time went on. Plus the owner demographic changed markedly as the MSRP's started increasing rapidly starting in the late '70's.

My humble opinion is that the 964 RS America is sweet spot of the enthusiast's USA-available Porsche 911. Classic looks (aside from the bulbous bumpers), still air-cooled, a 3.6 twin plug Mezger, good transmission gearing (unlike US-spec 993's) no power steering (not needed) great street seats and great handling. I had two of them back in the day and wish I had kept one of them. The fact that a clean, well-kept one will bring over $100K now speaks volumes. As much as I love my 1.GT3 which is technically the far superior and considerably faster Porsche with air conditioning that actually works, I would still much rather have my 964 RSA back.