Low dust brake pads
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8th Gear
Joined: Oct 2015
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Low dust brake pads
Reading past posts on this topic leaves me unclear as to a consensus on brake pad recommendations. I thought it might be time to solicit an updated opinion from the forum readers on the question of the best replacement brake pads for street use looking to maintain adequate brake performance while reducing dust and keeping noise low.
Race Car
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,072
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From: Austin, TX
Another confident vote for Hawk Ceramics. Performance is fine even under autocrossing conditions with repeated heavy braking. Dusting is absolutely minimal and what little is there matches silver wheels pretty nicely. I've used them on two Porsches and a prior BMW with great results. They also come with the proper harmonic dampers (the two silver discs at the top edge) and mounting points/holes for wear sensors.
Pro
Joined: Feb 2015
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From: NoVA
I have these on my 997.1
I would not recommend them. Yes they have very low dusting but they also have very low initial bite and when driving in rain they are scary the way they lose initial stopping power. The description lists them as "Ferro-Carbon".
I would not recommend them. Yes they have very low dusting but they also have very low initial bite and when driving in rain they are scary the way they lose initial stopping power. The description lists them as "Ferro-Carbon".
Race Car
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,072
Likes: 692
From: Austin, TX
It depends upon the year, submodel, and type of rotor (iron vs ceramic) of your particular car. For my 2009 2S, the correct pads where HB667Z.622 for front and HB664Z.634 for rear. They were different for my 997.1 C4. I know the non-S models are different, I'm not sure about the C4 and C4S. I also know there are differences between 997.1 and 997.2 models.
Regrettably, many of the parts websites do not list the correct ones so you need to be careful. The safest thing to do is to use Hawk's website's search here: http://www.hawkperformance.com/parts-search. They have them correctly listed for my car, Stillen's site (for example) did not. However, Stillen had better prices than anywhere else at the time, so once I was certain I had the right part number I ordered it from them despite it being a mismatch on their page. Be sure to shop around since the price variations can be significant.
BTW, once you have the presumed correct pad shown on the Hawk website, you can press "More Details" and it will show you the shape of the pad and mounting plate (they don't show the harmonic balancers although they are there). You can use this as a double check to see if it looks like what you can see of your pads. Especially telling is the mounting point for the wear sensors and hole for the retaining bolt along the top edges. You can usually see these through the wheels on your car without removing anything.
Regrettably, many of the parts websites do not list the correct ones so you need to be careful. The safest thing to do is to use Hawk's website's search here: http://www.hawkperformance.com/parts-search. They have them correctly listed for my car, Stillen's site (for example) did not. However, Stillen had better prices than anywhere else at the time, so once I was certain I had the right part number I ordered it from them despite it being a mismatch on their page. Be sure to shop around since the price variations can be significant.
BTW, once you have the presumed correct pad shown on the Hawk website, you can press "More Details" and it will show you the shape of the pad and mounting plate (they don't show the harmonic balancers although they are there). You can use this as a double check to see if it looks like what you can see of your pads. Especially telling is the mounting point for the wear sensors and hole for the retaining bolt along the top edges. You can usually see these through the wheels on your car without removing anything.
Pro
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 665
Likes: 7
From: Canada, GTA
Here is a review of someone who also doesn't think Hawk Ceramics have good stopping power.
I really liked the non-ceramic Hawk HPS and HP pads on some of my cars. Then tried some Akebono ceramic pads several years ago on my X Sport Jag, which has always had really good brakes. I went to bed them properly, and found that from moderate speeds they simply would not completely stop the car even with two feet on the brake pedal. I promptly returned them to Tirerack, and put on my favorite Ferodo pads. I posted my experience on the reviews for the pads on the TR sale site, said they were flat out dangerous, my comment was immediately deleted.
No ceramic for me, in any of my cars.
No ceramic for me, in any of my cars.
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Race Car
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,072
Likes: 692
From: Austin, TX
I have these on my 997.1
Amazon.com: Hawk Performance HB667F.622 HPS Brake Pad: Automotive
I would not recommend them. Yes they have very low dusting but they also have very low initial bite and when driving in rain they are scary the way they lose initial stopping power. The description lists them as "Ferro-Carbon".
Amazon.com: Hawk Performance HB667F.622 HPS Brake Pad: Automotive
I would not recommend them. Yes they have very low dusting but they also have very low initial bite and when driving in rain they are scary the way they lose initial stopping power. The description lists them as "Ferro-Carbon".
Interestingly, some cars will now lightly engage the brakes automatically every so often when the windshield wipers are on. My BMW 335i did this. This is only non-driver intervention solution I know of.
Depending upon your use case, like all-out track use, I have no doubt there are better solutions in those use cases. But I'm a pretty aggressive and demanding driver... I've never had any discomfort with the Hawks except during the first second of stop time after a drenching of the rotors.
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Pro
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 665
Likes: 7
From: Canada, GTA
Depending upon your use case, like all-out track use, I have no doubt there are better solutions in those use cases. But I'm a pretty aggressive and demanding driver... I've never had any discomfort with the Hawks except during the first second of stop time after a drenching of the rotors.
Thanks for posting.
I'm pretty sure I want the Hawk Ceramics.
Pro
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 627
Likes: 4
From: NoVA
And thus the lack of consensus begins! Of course any brake pad I'm familiar with has a low initial bite when wet. That's why you heat your breaks with a gentle squeeze occasionally when you have a suspicion the rotors have gotten wet. I feel this lack of initial bite when I go out after a thorough car wash to dry the rotors to keep them from rusting. It passes in about 3 or 4 rotations of the wheel.
Interestingly, some cars will now lightly engage the brakes automatically every so often when the windshield wipers are on. My BMW 335i did this. This is only non-driver intervention solution I know of.
Interestingly, some cars will now lightly engage the brakes automatically every so often when the windshield wipers are on. My BMW 335i did this. This is only non-driver intervention solution I know of.
I think my car came with some sort of Padgid(sp?) track pad they didn't have a problem with initial bite or wet performance. They were worn out though and I wanted something more street oriented (less dust, no squeal, easier on the rotors and a I assumed street-oriented wouldn't need as much heat in them to work).
The Hawks I listed are sold as street pads so I wouldn't expect needing heat in the pads to be an issue but it seems that is the case. On looking at the Hawk app chart I can see they are F rated not Z rated as others have posted.
Race Car
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,072
Likes: 692
From: Austin, TX
Never had this problem on any other car whether they had track or street-oriented pads (have used Hawk, Portfield and another I can't remember at the moment, Axxis maybe).
I think my car came with some sort of Padgid(sp?) track pad they didn't have a problem with initial bite or wet performance. They were worn out though and I wanted something more street oriented (less dust, no squeal, easier on the rotors and a I assumed street-oriented wouldn't need as much heat in them to work).
The Hawks I listed are sold as street pads so I wouldn't expect needing heat in the pads to be an issue but it seems that is the case. On looking at the Hawk app chart I can see they are F rated not Z rated as others have posted.
I think my car came with some sort of Padgid(sp?) track pad they didn't have a problem with initial bite or wet performance. They were worn out though and I wanted something more street oriented (less dust, no squeal, easier on the rotors and a I assumed street-oriented wouldn't need as much heat in them to work).
The Hawks I listed are sold as street pads so I wouldn't expect needing heat in the pads to be an issue but it seems that is the case. On looking at the Hawk app chart I can see they are F rated not Z rated as others have posted.
Pro
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 627
Likes: 4
From: NoVA
Yeah, amazon also shows the F pad I listed as not working on a 2006S but Hawk's app a chart says it does (and I can verify).
I did butt into this thread thinking my "F" pads were ceramic vs. the Ferro-Ceramic that they are.
Carry on.
I did butt into this thread thinking my "F" pads were ceramic vs. the Ferro-Ceramic that they are.
Carry on.
Pro
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 665
Likes: 7
From: Canada, GTA
These ?
http://www.autoanything.com/brakes/61A3072A0A0.aspx
Are they less dust producing vs. stock pads?
Rennlist Member
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 1,029
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From: SF Bay Area
Just to muck up the discussion a bit more, I have switched to Cool Carbon combo street / track pads, front and rear for my street use. I find them excellent, but with a caveat. If you are using them strictly for street, you will want to do a serious bedding after install. Once bedded for street use, they are excellent in all conditions. They are also quite rotor friendly.
If you use them on the track you will find they need some heat before they get a superior bite. But once they have heated up to track temps (track braking temps), and you return to street driving they are not as effective on the street until you re-bed them (again). The dust level is minimal, which for a track use pad is very nice. If you are serious about running on the track these will work well, but you will burn through them in a couple sessions, so I'd suggested a real dedicated track pad. For the street use / spirited driving, they are quite good.
If you use them on the track you will find they need some heat before they get a superior bite. But once they have heated up to track temps (track braking temps), and you return to street driving they are not as effective on the street until you re-bed them (again). The dust level is minimal, which for a track use pad is very nice. If you are serious about running on the track these will work well, but you will burn through them in a couple sessions, so I'd suggested a real dedicated track pad. For the street use / spirited driving, they are quite good.