Asking too much from dealership service?
05-17-2013, 09:05 AM
#16
Trying to give the dealer a fair shake- perhaps there is a some insurance or warranty protocol about this? But even in this case it seems like a good opportunity to slightly break protocol in order to earn a loyal customer. Did you ask the service manager why it's not possible to pick you up? Some people need that prompt to get thier brain juices flowing well. I usually give about 3 calm and collected "why"s before I cross over into irritation.
05-17-2013, 02:41 PM
#17
Drifting
I think a lot of Rennlist members are thrifty little buggers who like to get their money's worth and don't like being taken advantage of. I count myself in that group.
However, I'm sure that there is a large portion of Porsche owners who just drop their car off at the dealer every-so-often and say "do what needs to be done" and don't worry about the price. We need them around to subsidize our goodwill repairs and loaner vehicles.
I wonder if the OP made everything crystal clear to the dealer - that he was a mere 2 blocks away, that he wanted an estimate before any work was done, etc.
And yes, some dealers are better than others. That's just the way of the world.
Lexus is a different animal entirely - they are geared toward servicing women owners, and so they put more of an emphasis on the stress-free service, the nice lounges, the cleaning of the cars, etc. Don't fool yourself though, you paid for that, and paid dearly for it, when you bought the car. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's a different target market. I'll wager that most of us here tell the Porsche dealer not to wash the car after a service. I know I do.
However, I'm sure that there is a large portion of Porsche owners who just drop their car off at the dealer every-so-often and say "do what needs to be done" and don't worry about the price. We need them around to subsidize our goodwill repairs and loaner vehicles.
I wonder if the OP made everything crystal clear to the dealer - that he was a mere 2 blocks away, that he wanted an estimate before any work was done, etc.
And yes, some dealers are better than others. That's just the way of the world.
Lexus is a different animal entirely - they are geared toward servicing women owners, and so they put more of an emphasis on the stress-free service, the nice lounges, the cleaning of the cars, etc. Don't fool yourself though, you paid for that, and paid dearly for it, when you bought the car. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's a different target market. I'll wager that most of us here tell the Porsche dealer not to wash the car after a service. I know I do.
05-17-2013, 03:24 PM
#18
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Happy to say the service manager appealed the battery decision to the warranty folks and got it covered, and said they should have run somebody by there to jump me. Thanks for the input.
05-21-2013, 03:16 AM
#20
Drifting
I think a lot of Rennlist members are thrifty little buggers who like to get their money's worth and don't like being taken advantage of. I count myself in that group.
However, I'm sure that there is a large portion of Porsche owners who just drop their car off at the dealer every-so-often and say "do what needs to be done" and don't worry about the price. We need them around to subsidize our goodwill repairs and loaner vehicles.
I wonder if the OP made everything crystal clear to the dealer - that he was a mere 2 blocks away, that he wanted an estimate before any work was done, etc.
And yes, some dealers are better than others. That's just the way of the world.
Lexus is a different animal entirely - they are geared toward servicing women owners, and so they put more of an emphasis on the stress-free service, the nice lounges, the cleaning of the cars, etc. Don't fool yourself though, you paid for that, and paid dearly for it, when you bought the car. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's a different target market. I'll wager that most of us here tell the Porsche dealer not to wash the car after a service. I know I do.
However, I'm sure that there is a large portion of Porsche owners who just drop their car off at the dealer every-so-often and say "do what needs to be done" and don't worry about the price. We need them around to subsidize our goodwill repairs and loaner vehicles.
I wonder if the OP made everything crystal clear to the dealer - that he was a mere 2 blocks away, that he wanted an estimate before any work was done, etc.
And yes, some dealers are better than others. That's just the way of the world.
Lexus is a different animal entirely - they are geared toward servicing women owners, and so they put more of an emphasis on the stress-free service, the nice lounges, the cleaning of the cars, etc. Don't fool yourself though, you paid for that, and paid dearly for it, when you bought the car. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's a different target market. I'll wager that most of us here tell the Porsche dealer not to wash the car after a service. I know I do.
I'm aware that there are people with enough money that they pay their dealer whatever he bills them and don't ask questions. Let's call a spade a spade here. Getting raped by your dealer isn't noble, it's pitiful. Having a lot of money doesn't make getting raped any less pitiful. I guess if a customer inherited his money and doesn't understand its value, I can understand that attitude but if you work for your money, as most of us do, accepting that kind of treatment just doesn't make sense to me.
My Lexus example was timely and a very similar battery issue, but Lexus isn't the only expensive car line that provides exemplary service. Locally, I have had great service at the Mercedes and Infiniti dealerships, too--and I am well aware that I paid for that service upfront.
The fact is, though, that I also paid for it with my Porsche but I'm not getting it, and neither is the OP. He paid a premium for a "certified" car. It seems to be S.O.P. for some dealers to say no and then if pressed, offer fixing the car as some kind of carrot that they dangle in front of the customer as a "goodwill" gesture. That certainly seems to be the case in this situation. I must be in the minority in that I consider honoring the warranty as the dealer's job--not something that he can honor or not honor at his own discretion. In spite of the OP's "resolution", he should never have had to deal with this frustration in the first place.
05-21-2013, 08:41 AM
#21
I think a lot of Rennlist members are thrifty little buggers who like to get their money's worth and don't like being taken advantage of. I count myself in that group.
However, I'm sure that there is a large portion of Porsche owners who just drop their car off at the dealer every-so-often and say "do what needs to be done" and don't worry about the price. We need them around to subsidize our goodwill repairs and loaner vehicles.
I wonder if the OP made everything crystal clear to the dealer - that he was a mere 2 blocks away, that he wanted an estimate before any work was done, etc.
And yes, some dealers are better than others. That's just the way of the world.
Lexus is a different animal entirely - they are geared toward servicing women owners, and so they put more of an emphasis on the stress-free service, the nice lounges, the cleaning of the cars, etc. Don't fool yourself though, you paid for that, and paid dearly for it, when you bought the car. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's a different target market. I'll wager that most of us here tell the Porsche dealer not to wash the car after a service. I know I do.
However, I'm sure that there is a large portion of Porsche owners who just drop their car off at the dealer every-so-often and say "do what needs to be done" and don't worry about the price. We need them around to subsidize our goodwill repairs and loaner vehicles.
I wonder if the OP made everything crystal clear to the dealer - that he was a mere 2 blocks away, that he wanted an estimate before any work was done, etc.
And yes, some dealers are better than others. That's just the way of the world.
Lexus is a different animal entirely - they are geared toward servicing women owners, and so they put more of an emphasis on the stress-free service, the nice lounges, the cleaning of the cars, etc. Don't fool yourself though, you paid for that, and paid dearly for it, when you bought the car. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's a different target market. I'll wager that most of us here tell the Porsche dealer not to wash the car after a service. I know I do.
Tom
05-21-2013, 11:09 AM
#22
Drifting
Gee, I'm sorry, it seems that I struck a nerve and/or you took my reply personally. I didn't intend it that was and I apologize if you or anyone else took offense.
I have not read the CPO contract, so I don't know for a fact, but it does have a lot of exclusions and a battery may be one of those.
I have not read the CPO contract, so I don't know for a fact, but it does have a lot of exclusions and a battery may be one of those.
05-21-2013, 12:30 PM
#23
Drifting
Gee, I'm sorry, it seems that I struck a nerve and/or you took my reply personally. I didn't intend it that was and I apologize if you or anyone else took offense.
I have not read the CPO contract, so I don't know for a fact, but it does have a lot of exclusions and a battery may be one of those.
I have not read the CPO contract, so I don't know for a fact, but it does have a lot of exclusions and a battery may be one of those.
None of my animosity was directed at you, so I'm sorry if I came off that way. I was really just venting, wondering why anyone would tolerate terrible service like the OP got.
In my limited time here I just have noticed that there is a fairly large group of P-car owners that are so smitten with the idea of owning a Porsche that they accept really terrible service from their dealers as a cost of ownership. Considering the amount of money that they spent on their cars, the fact that they put up with this kind of treatment from the dealer just astonishes me.
I have owned some nice cars in my lifetime and will (God-willing) continue to do so. If the next dealership that I send my car to treats me like the first one, I won't buy another Porsche just on principle. The mother ship in Zuffenhausen should take that very seriously.
05-21-2013, 02:04 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
Unfortunately, the almighty dollar motivates some dealerships to make stupid short term decisions that adversely affect long term relationships. But some dealerships got it right.
Many years ago I read a book authored by Carl Sewell, a well respected dealer in the Dallas community called Customers for Life. It all about how you treat your customers and the small things that add up to a life long relationhip.
Read the synopsis from Amazon.
This should be required reading for all dealerships. In fact, for all customer facing businesses.
Many years ago I read a book authored by Carl Sewell, a well respected dealer in the Dallas community called Customers for Life. It all about how you treat your customers and the small things that add up to a life long relationhip.
Read the synopsis from Amazon.
This should be required reading for all dealerships. In fact, for all customer facing businesses.
05-22-2013, 01:46 AM
#25
Drifting
Ironically we're seeing **** poor service from our local Lexus dealership and great service from the Porsche dealer... to the extent that I'm contemplating a switch: my wife's Lexus GX-470 over to a Cayenne when her warranty expires in 2005. Of course, we only have one Lexus, Porsche, and BMW dealer here in Austin so this is likely the root of our ailments - no competition. In contrast we've found awesome sales/service in Dallas with Sewell Lexus... I also find that my bias towards the local p-dealer lately has been due in large part to finding an SA that is technical and is someone I could trust... Whereas the local L-dealer doesn't seem to care much for technical/informed customers and would rather just have my wife show up for a latte and pay whatever they demand. For example, last month we brought my wife's Lexus in for service on several items. For the warped front rotors they wanted $600 to resurface the pair and put them back on... no thanks. I purchased rotors and new pads for l~$300+ and installed everything myself within an hour. To top it off we filed the service request for three issues on their website to make the appointment but the SA claimed to only notice one issue - an irritating squeak which they couldn't recreate/address so they just wanted to give me the car back. I showed the SA the printout of all three issues but the SA insisted that it doesn't matter and that he doesn't have access to their website service system where the write-up still had our three request and that it wasn't his fault their web system is faulty... even though he somehow had capture one of the three issues we filed. BS, high cost, rude, and more BS... net net after complaining to their service manager they eventually fixed one item under warranty(faulty side mirror control unit), could not recreate/service an irritating squeak, and I declined their offer to resurface our rotors for $600(ridiculous)... but it was the rude and incompetent actions of their SA that put off both my wife and I. We did complain to the service manager and he gave us his business card for future reference. Oddly we never rec'd a customer satisfaction survey. I suppose the complaint letter I'm sending to Lexus Corporate will have to suffice as their satisfaction survey.
We originally purchased my wife a Lexus b/c I travel every other week for work and I wanted the comfort of knowing that she would get excellent service whether I'm here or not... and Lexus is known for their service right? Well it depends on where you live. I know that not all L-dealers are bad but when I have to drive out of town(180 miles) to find a good L-dealer(Sewell Lexus in Dallas)... well it's time to consider an alternative brand and this time it happens to be Porsche again.
We originally purchased my wife a Lexus b/c I travel every other week for work and I wanted the comfort of knowing that she would get excellent service whether I'm here or not... and Lexus is known for their service right? Well it depends on where you live. I know that not all L-dealers are bad but when I have to drive out of town(180 miles) to find a good L-dealer(Sewell Lexus in Dallas)... well it's time to consider an alternative brand and this time it happens to be Porsche again.
05-22-2013, 01:54 AM
#26
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Just to be clear, replacing a battery on a CPO car that leaves you stranded shouldn't be a "goodwill" repair. The fact that someone would consider it so is frustrating. None of us should accept that and I'm surprised that anyone who can afford a car in this price range would consider the dealer's behavior in this situation to be normal ,acceptable or justifiable. I wouldn't accept that kind of treatment from a Chevrolet dealer, why would anyone accept it from a store that sells six-figure cars?
I'm aware that there are people with enough money that they pay their dealer whatever he bills them and don't ask questions. Let's call a spade a spade here. Getting raped by your dealer isn't noble, it's pitiful. Having a lot of money doesn't make getting raped any less pitiful. I guess if a customer inherited his money and doesn't understand its value, I can understand that attitude but if you work for your money, as most of us do, accepting that kind of treatment just doesn't make sense to me.
My Lexus example was timely and a very similar battery issue, but Lexus isn't the only expensive car line that provides exemplary service. Locally, I have had great service at the Mercedes and Infiniti dealerships, too--and I am well aware that I paid for that service upfront.
The fact is, though, that I also paid for it with my Porsche but I'm not getting it, and neither is the OP. He paid a premium for a "certified" car. It seems to be S.O.P. for some dealers to say no and then if pressed, offer fixing the car as some kind of carrot that they dangle in front of the customer as a "goodwill" gesture. That certainly seems to be the case in this situation. I must be in the minority in that I consider honoring the warranty as the dealer's job--not something that he can honor or not honor at his own discretion. In spite of the OP's "resolution", he should never have had to deal with this frustration in the first place.
I'm aware that there are people with enough money that they pay their dealer whatever he bills them and don't ask questions. Let's call a spade a spade here. Getting raped by your dealer isn't noble, it's pitiful. Having a lot of money doesn't make getting raped any less pitiful. I guess if a customer inherited his money and doesn't understand its value, I can understand that attitude but if you work for your money, as most of us do, accepting that kind of treatment just doesn't make sense to me.
My Lexus example was timely and a very similar battery issue, but Lexus isn't the only expensive car line that provides exemplary service. Locally, I have had great service at the Mercedes and Infiniti dealerships, too--and I am well aware that I paid for that service upfront.
The fact is, though, that I also paid for it with my Porsche but I'm not getting it, and neither is the OP. He paid a premium for a "certified" car. It seems to be S.O.P. for some dealers to say no and then if pressed, offer fixing the car as some kind of carrot that they dangle in front of the customer as a "goodwill" gesture. That certainly seems to be the case in this situation. I must be in the minority in that I consider honoring the warranty as the dealer's job--not something that he can honor or not honor at his own discretion. In spite of the OP's "resolution", he should never have had to deal with this frustration in the first place.
05-22-2013, 02:51 AM
#27
Nordschleife Master
Unfortunately, the almighty dollar motivates some dealerships to make stupid short term decisions that adversely affect long term relationships. But some dealerships got it right.
Many years ago I read a book authored by Carl Sewell, a well respected dealer in the Dallas community called Customers for Life. It all about how you treat your customers and the small things that add up to a life long relationhip.
Read the synopsis from Amazon.
Amazon.com: Customers for Life: How to Turn That One-Time Buyer Into a Lifetime Customer (9780385504454): Carl Sewell, Paul B. Brown: Books
This should be required reading for all dealerships. In fact, for all customer facing businesses.
Many years ago I read a book authored by Carl Sewell, a well respected dealer in the Dallas community called Customers for Life. It all about how you treat your customers and the small things that add up to a life long relationhip.
Read the synopsis from Amazon.
Amazon.com: Customers for Life: How to Turn That One-Time Buyer Into a Lifetime Customer (9780385504454): Carl Sewell, Paul B. Brown: Books
This should be required reading for all dealerships. In fact, for all customer facing businesses.
Ugly stuff going on here:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/7487...gine-fire.html
05-22-2013, 12:30 PM
#28
Drifting
USMC_DS1, you're absolutely right. Competition is good. Obviously, good or bad service is a function of each individual dealership. Porsche customers just seem to bend over more easily than others. The more owners I talk to locally, the more I see this phenomenon. Maybe they just develop this attitude because they don't have another competing dealership as an alternative. It's just weird to me.
It's ironic that your experience is exactly opposite mine. If it's any consolation, with most non-warranty issues, your GX can be fixed by any Toyota dealership and you'll pay much less. I used to buy my GX470 brake pads from the Toyota store and I paid about 2/3 of what Lexus wanted to charge. The GX470 was built on a HiLux platform but much of the running gear is shared with other Toyota products. Also, I had the rotors turned on my GX twice. My dealer charged me $90 for that service (for all four rotors).
Also funny that you mention Sewell in Dallas. I live in NC but have bought parts at Sewell because they have great prices and they are nationally known as a great place to deal with for purchase, service and parts.
It's ironic that your experience is exactly opposite mine. If it's any consolation, with most non-warranty issues, your GX can be fixed by any Toyota dealership and you'll pay much less. I used to buy my GX470 brake pads from the Toyota store and I paid about 2/3 of what Lexus wanted to charge. The GX470 was built on a HiLux platform but much of the running gear is shared with other Toyota products. Also, I had the rotors turned on my GX twice. My dealer charged me $90 for that service (for all four rotors).
Also funny that you mention Sewell in Dallas. I live in NC but have bought parts at Sewell because they have great prices and they are nationally known as a great place to deal with for purchase, service and parts.
05-22-2013, 12:53 PM
#29
Drifting
As bad as the initial response was to the OP's request, it pales in comparison to what a member with a factory new 991 is going through. Apparently, a shop rag was left in the engine compartment after an oil change at the dealership which caused a fire. He's without his car going on two months now with little or no communication from either the dealership, PCNA or the insurance companies involved. After way more unacceptable treatment than I would have put up with he finally hired an attorney.
Ugly stuff going on here:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/7487...gine-fire.html
Ugly stuff going on here:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/7487...gine-fire.html
Much like the "Beware delRey Customs" thread, this is a situation where the dealer and PCNA should have bent over backwards to accommodate the OP while they did their legal wrangling. The OP should have been given a Porsche replacement while the insurance companies fought it out. For the cost of the depreciation on the 991 loaner, both the dealer and PCNA could have turned this situation 180 degrees and we'd be reading about how well the OP had been treated. They probably spent more than that depreciation on experts, chemical analyses and air fare. It's all very shortsighted.
The internet has made this community too small to treat people this way. How much business will the two dealerships involved lose because thousands of us are reading that thread? I just don't get it.
05-22-2013, 01:38 PM
#30
Drifting
USMC_DS1, you're absolutely right. Competition is good. Obviously, good or bad service is a function of each individual dealership. Porsche customers just seem to bend over more easily than others. The more owners I talk to locally, the more I see this phenomenon. Maybe they just develop this attitude because they don't have another competing dealership as an alternative. It's just weird to me.
It's ironic that your experience is exactly opposite mine. If it's any consolation, with most non-warranty issues, your GX can be fixed by any Toyota dealership and you'll pay much less. I used to buy my GX470 brake pads from the Toyota store and I paid about 2/3 of what Lexus wanted to charge. The GX470 was built on a HiLux platform but much of the running gear is shared with other Toyota products. Also, I had the rotors turned on my GX twice. My dealer charged me $90 for that service (for all four rotors).
Also funny that you mention Sewell in Dallas. I live in NC but have bought parts at Sewell because they have great prices and they are nationally known as a great place to deal with for purchase, service and parts.
It's ironic that your experience is exactly opposite mine. If it's any consolation, with most non-warranty issues, your GX can be fixed by any Toyota dealership and you'll pay much less. I used to buy my GX470 brake pads from the Toyota store and I paid about 2/3 of what Lexus wanted to charge. The GX470 was built on a HiLux platform but much of the running gear is shared with other Toyota products. Also, I had the rotors turned on my GX twice. My dealer charged me $90 for that service (for all four rotors).
Also funny that you mention Sewell in Dallas. I live in NC but have bought parts at Sewell because they have great prices and they are nationally known as a great place to deal with for purchase, service and parts.
BTW, my 1st experience at the local P-dealer was not stellar... the initial SA I encountered there was pushing a wheel alignment which had nothing to do with the real issue - a lose steering column. Every time I explained to him that I had a 1/2" or more of free play in the steering wheel while parked even... the broken record SA would repeat "you need a wheel alignment". I insisted on speaking to a tech... after a short test drive with the tech in the passenger seat he recognized it for what it was and resolved the issue by torquing a few adjustments on the steering column. Overtime I've tried working with different SA's until I found one a bit more technical and in fact was a former tech at the dealership. No more BS upselling and now I'm a happy p-car owner. Will likely need to go thru the same process with my L-dealer. At the end it's really the people working at any dealership that cut the line between a satisfied vs. pissed off customer. As customers we have to IFF - identify friend or foe.
