disgusted 997.2 owner
10-10-2011, 01:51 PM
#46
Race Director
The dealership is then taking a risk. There are very limited occasions when a customer should be allowed on the shop floor (i.e. major issues that need to be seen to be believed). Its no secret that a shop floor is a dangerous place, and no dealer with a worthwhile management staff would let a customer look over a tech's shoulders as he or she performed a service.
You're right; I've never been to a dealership's service area that was not posted to prevent non-service personel from entering the area. To do otherwise would be a huge liability that no dealer in their right mind should allow. That said, it is possible to watch from a distance depending on the layout of the shop (my dealer has a big window in their waiting area) and on occasion I've come in for a closer inspection. But to allow customers to look over the mechanic's shoulder as a matter of course is bad business practice and simply unsafe, IMO.
10-10-2011, 03:21 PM
#47
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
1. How are you determining the "rank" of your dealership? What evidence do you have to support these conclusions?
2. The dealership is then taking a risk. There are very limited occasions when a customer should be allowed on the shop floor (i.e. major issues that need to be seen to be believed). Its no secret that a shop floor is a dangerous place, and no dealer with a worthwhile management staff would let a customer look over a tech's shoulders as he or she performed a service.
Lets say, for whatever reason, a lift fails or a tire bead explodes. The customer who was standing there looking for scratches
and then he ends up owning the dealership after the massive lawsuit.
Not to mention, I have heard from techs that having someone watching over their shoulder asking endless questions or giving them dirty looks every time a wrench clanks on something is the most annoying and unproductive thing possible.
2. The dealership is then taking a risk. There are very limited occasions when a customer should be allowed on the shop floor (i.e. major issues that need to be seen to be believed). Its no secret that a shop floor is a dangerous place, and no dealer with a worthwhile management staff would let a customer look over a tech's shoulders as he or she performed a service.
Lets say, for whatever reason, a lift fails or a tire bead explodes. The customer who was standing there looking for scratches
and then he ends up owning the dealership after the massive lawsuit.Not to mention, I have heard from techs that having someone watching over their shoulder asking endless questions or giving them dirty looks every time a wrench clanks on something is the most annoying and unproductive thing possible.
Using this approach I've found that the service guys will actually call me over to look at something or show me something when its convenient. This has been my experience, YMMV.
10-11-2011, 11:06 AM
#48
Rennlist Member
it will be dy when you`ll get a real dent. or a crazy kid will bump into your car with his bycicle. or shopping cart will hit it. or you`ll drop a wrench yourself on a hood. stuff happens and it is just a car. it is not worth to waste your nerves all over it.
also, oil change at a dealer? if you want your car to be perfect - no one can any job better than you as no one will ever care about your property more than yourself. it would be silly to expect otherwise, it just not going to happen. dealerships hire cheap labor, that is how all world runs now. and cheap labor does not give a crap about your values.
10-11-2011, 12:08 PM
#49
My story about the OKC dealer is this. When I was shopping for a car about 9 to 10 months ago, I talked to a sales guy about a '09 C2S they had for sale with less than 5K miles on it. In discussions, the guy proudly informed me that it was lightly used by the owner's wife and a "really nice car" akin to the proverbial car driven by the little old lady to church. When I started asking him about maintenance records, he let slip that the clutch had to be replaced, apparently because that wife did not know how to drive with a clutch. I asked if they would give me a dme scan, and the answer was "No" with the excuse that it cost too much. I asked if they would CPO the car, and again the answer was "No." Too many red flags for me, so I walked.
10-11-2011, 01:43 PM
#50
Rennlist Member
1. How are you determining the "rank" of your dealership? What evidence do you have to support these conclusions?
2. The dealership is then taking a risk. There are very limited occasions when a customer should be allowed on the shop floor (i.e. major issues that need to be seen to be believed). Its no secret that a shop floor is a dangerous place, and no dealer with a worthwhile management staff would let a customer look over a tech's shoulders as he or she performed a service.
Lets say, for whatever reason, a lift fails or a tire bead explodes. The customer who was standing there looking for scratches and then he ends up owning the dealership after the massive lawsuit.
Not to mention, I have heard from techs that having someone watching over their shoulder asking endless questions or giving them dirty looks every time a wrench clanks on something is the most annoying and unproductive thing possible.
2. The dealership is then taking a risk. There are very limited occasions when a customer should be allowed on the shop floor (i.e. major issues that need to be seen to be believed). Its no secret that a shop floor is a dangerous place, and no dealer with a worthwhile management staff would let a customer look over a tech's shoulders as he or she performed a service.
Lets say, for whatever reason, a lift fails or a tire bead explodes. The customer who was standing there looking for scratches
and then he ends up owning the dealership after the massive lawsuit.Not to mention, I have heard from techs that having someone watching over their shoulder asking endless questions or giving them dirty looks every time a wrench clanks on something is the most annoying and unproductive thing possible.
2) You are correct, they are accepting the risk. I never said that clients look over the shoulder of the tech as he does his work - and neither did you in your first post. At the last customer party, we spent 20-30 minutes with a rep crawling under a lift looking at the Carrera GT getting some surgery. Granted, I'm not there often but its very common to poke around the service area discussing cars or showing a needed service item. It is an accepted risk, and does not automatically make a dealership a poor or stupid one.
10-11-2011, 02:20 PM
#51
Rennlist Member
10-11-2011, 02:28 PM
#52
Rennlist Member
10-11-2011, 04:33 PM
#53
The dealership I now use has no problem with me viewing the shop floor. Also on my first visit I was introduced to the tech who was going to be working on my car. Every member of their staff has been willing to take time to explain some feature of the car or give me advice on running it at the track. They also book me in within a couple of days and give me a Mercedes loan car if I need it. I've spent a lot of money with this business.
I had a conversation with a gentleman who owns a car dealership and he advised to always be clear and specific about the kind of service you want to receive. I wouldn't expect to have to tell a service manager to return my car without scratches and dents, but it seems like that's what the OP has to do in his case.
I had a conversation with a gentleman who owns a car dealership and he advised to always be clear and specific about the kind of service you want to receive. I wouldn't expect to have to tell a service manager to return my car without scratches and dents, but it seems like that's what the OP has to do in his case.
10-13-2011, 10:29 PM
#54
Burning Brakes
The last time I took my car to the stealership they washed it without asking me. When I got the car back they had cracked off the upper part of the "C" of the Carrera script on the back. I noticed it with in 10 seconds of them driving up the car. I had to hound them for a month with weekly phone calls. They finally gave me a new one. I definitely did not let them put it on the car. I can guarantee they would put it off center and crooked.
10-14-2011, 12:21 AM
#55
Rennlist Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
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Incidentally, for the skeptics: they stop work to show me what's going on with my car. They don't operate power tools around a customer and they keep their attention on the visiting customer who might back into the lift in an adjacent service bay or any of several other mistakes. I don't know if they've worked out these procedures particularly for Porsche customers with their insurance carrier or if it's standard practice. But I do remember going into the service area with all our other cars as well.
Gary
10-14-2011, 02:26 AM
#56
Nordschleife Master
Same with mine. Pretty much an open door policy in the service area. As with any other courtesy extended, I'm sure some ****** abuse it and hang around bugging the techs no end but I never saw it. I have seen owners doing what I do though......quick visit - often at the advice of the service manager - to talk directly with the tech working on the car, explaining an issue face to face and maybe a little shop talk. Works for everyone. As long as they have signs posted, how do they lose in court should something happen? "Well......he just wandered in there, ignoring the posted signs".
10-14-2011, 09:17 AM
#57
Three Wheelin'
Domer
I agree with you 100% there is absolutely no reason for your car to be returned with ANY DAMAGE at all.
Obsessive? Ha,...I keep our cars as perfect as possible, and if it were to be returned damaged I'd be PISSED.
But, sell it ...no way. (let me make you an offer......................)
I agree with you 100% there is absolutely no reason for your car to be returned with ANY DAMAGE at all.
Obsessive? Ha,...I keep our cars as perfect as possible, and if it were to be returned damaged I'd be PISSED.
But, sell it ...no way. (let me make you an offer......................)
10-14-2011, 11:55 AM
#59
Race Car
Just do what I do when I bring my car into dealer service. I use painter's tape on the door sills and speaker grill. One time on my 997 S, some dufus service guy totally scuffed up both areas. Can't they get in and out of cars without dragging their, what seemed like baseball cleats, when they work on our cars? I try and avoid service as much as possible for this reason.
