Yes to GTS no to Cayman R
08-16-2011, 09:27 PM
#46
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I would also be on board with a GTS over a Cayman R, except for the very disappointing road test Car and Driver just had on a new GTS coupe. First, it was heavy: 3430 lbs without driver. That is not much less than the Turbo S they tested, only 61 lbs more. Very surprising for a car without 4WD. The Cayman R they tested was 3076 lbs by comparison. Despite the chunky weight, this was little of the story why the GTS test was disappointing. It is simply all the numbers across the board were lower than the Cayman R they tested:
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.
08-16-2011, 10:59 PM
#47
I would also be on board with a GTS over a Cayman R, except for the very disappointing road test Car and Driver just had on a new GTS coupe. First, it was heavy: 3430 lbs without driver. That is not much less than the Turbo S they tested, only 61 lbs more. Very surprising for a car without 4WD. The Cayman R they tested was 3076 lbs by comparison. Despite the chunky weight, this was little of the story why the GTS test was disappointing. It is simply all the numbers across the board were lower than the Cayman R they tested:
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
And this C&D test of the base C2 PDK did 0-60 in 4.1 secs and the 1/4 mile in 12.5 secs.
http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezfl...17c1b67d91.pdf
So something seems a little off with the C&D results for the GTS Coupe.
08-17-2011, 12:35 AM
#48
Nordschleife Master
Those C&D results for the GTS PDK Coupe look a bit off, could be a bad sample. This C&D test of the GTS PDK Cab did 0-60 in 4.0 secs and 1/4 mile in 12.5 secs. The Cab weighed in even heavier than the Coupe at 3521 lbs, but still beat it by .3 secs to 60 and 1/4 mile.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
And this C&D test of the base C2 PDK did 0-60 in 4.1 secs and the 1/4 mile in 12.5 secs.
http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezfl...17c1b67d91.pdf
So something seems a little off with the C&D results for the GTS Coupe.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
And this C&D test of the base C2 PDK did 0-60 in 4.1 secs and the 1/4 mile in 12.5 secs.
http://www.caranddriver.com/var/ezfl...17c1b67d91.pdf
So something seems a little off with the C&D results for the GTS Coupe.
Let's see what Excellence says in their upcoming comparison.
BTW I'd be willing to bet that there are more GT3s that have been produced over the last few years than GTSs when production of 997s end soon.
08-17-2011, 02:31 AM
#49
In terms of handling, Cayman has a better balance than the 911, period. RUF built the CTR3 off a Cayman instead of a 911 for a good reason. Even up the power and Cayman will easily destroy the 911 in lap times. But there are a number of capable mid-engined cars out there - there's nothing else out there that handles like a rear engine 911.
Cayman = Point and Shoot
911 = Dance, Point, then Shoot
Cayman = Point and Shoot
911 = Dance, Point, then Shoot
08-17-2011, 06:43 AM
#50
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
[QUOTE=10 GT3;8795143]I would also be on board with a GTS over a Cayman R, except for the very disappointing road test Car and Driver just had on a new GTS coupe. First, it was heavy: 3430 lbs without driver. That is not much less than the Turbo S they tested, only 61 lbs more. Very surprising for a car without 4WD. The Cayman R they tested was 3076 lbs by comparison. Despite the chunky weight, this was little of the story why the GTS test was disappointing. It is simply all the numbers across the board were lower than the Cayman R they tested:
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.[/Q
Kudos to the Cayman R, but something doesn't make sense with those numbers.
Like others have posted, several magazines have vastly different performance figures. Road and track has the GTS at 9 sec to 100 mph, 0-60 in 3.8 sec, at quarter in 12.1 @ 115.4 mph. The figures quoted above for the CR belies even Porsche's own numbers for the respective cars.
The physics don't add up either. Even with 400 pounds difference in weight and given the old rule of thumb that every 100 pounds = 10 hp, the Cayman R would have an equivalent of 370 hp versus 408. Handling aside, straight line performance figures would give the GTS the nod.
Something was wrong with the GTS in that test, or else all of the other magazines have it wrong. Can't give credit to one without giving credit to others.
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.[/Q
Kudos to the Cayman R, but something doesn't make sense with those numbers.
Like others have posted, several magazines have vastly different performance figures. Road and track has the GTS at 9 sec to 100 mph, 0-60 in 3.8 sec, at quarter in 12.1 @ 115.4 mph. The figures quoted above for the CR belies even Porsche's own numbers for the respective cars.
The physics don't add up either. Even with 400 pounds difference in weight and given the old rule of thumb that every 100 pounds = 10 hp, the Cayman R would have an equivalent of 370 hp versus 408. Handling aside, straight line performance figures would give the GTS the nod.
Something was wrong with the GTS in that test, or else all of the other magazines have it wrong. Can't give credit to one without giving credit to others.
08-17-2011, 09:17 AM
#51
Nordschleife Master
Again I'm more interested in what Excellence has to say.
Btw even though the GT3 took 4 of 5 wins the narrator said it was close. So I wouldn't use the term " cleaned up" . Seems over reaching.
Btw even though the GT3 took 4 of 5 wins the narrator said it was close. So I wouldn't use the term " cleaned up" . Seems over reaching.
08-17-2011, 10:39 AM
#52
Rennlist Member
I would also be on board with a GTS over a Cayman R, except for the very disappointing road test Car and Driver just had on a new GTS coupe. First, it was heavy: 3430 lbs without driver. That is not much less than the Turbo S they tested, only 61 lbs more. Very surprising for a car without 4WD. The Cayman R they tested was 3076 lbs by comparison. Despite the chunky weight, this was little of the story why the GTS test was disappointing. It is simply all the numbers across the board were lower than the Cayman R they tested:
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.
0-60 Cayman R 4.2 GTS 4.3
0-100 Cayman R 10.2 GTS 10.3
1/4 mile Cayman R 12.7@111 GTS 12.8@110
braking 70-0 Cayman R 149 GTS 158
skidpad Cayman R 1.00g GTS 0.96g
While the GT3 cleaned up against the Cayman R in the comparison test, with this recent test the Cayman R would clean up against a GTS. Maybe it is just this one test car that is a dud, but with 2200 miles it should have been broken in.
08-17-2011, 02:46 PM
#53
Nordschleife Master
Gravedigger: Good point.
I was wondering where that extra weight came from over the C2S. I couldn't understand why there would be that much of a weight difference coupe to coupe. Didn't make sense. But if they were using the Cab weight, now its making sense.
Again, lets see what Excellence says in their comparison of the GTS coupe with the Cayman R. From Blakt Out's comments "its a wonderful WONDERFUL car" it seems Excellence likes the GTS alot. Wild guess but just say'n.
I was wondering where that extra weight came from over the C2S. I couldn't understand why there would be that much of a weight difference coupe to coupe. Didn't make sense. But if they were using the Cab weight, now its making sense.
Again, lets see what Excellence says in their comparison of the GTS coupe with the Cayman R. From Blakt Out's comments "its a wonderful WONDERFUL car" it seems Excellence likes the GTS alot. Wild guess but just say'n.
08-18-2011, 12:00 AM
#54
Advanced
I had to dig around a bit, but finally located the ONLINE "Short Take" test results that 10 GT3 found so disappointing for the 2011 GTS Coupe. Perhaps the review will be available in print in 1-3 months.
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
The test was conducted 7/25/11 as evidenced by the Test Sheet download. Curiously they did five braking tests, but only one acceleration test. And the drivetrain description calls out a 6 spd "M" DSG. Everything in the report says PDK, but WTH is that description? The Test Sheet mentions launch control, so the tester was evidently PDK equipped.
My GTS OM Supplement shows a PDK empty weight range of 3197-3439 lbs "depending on equipment". Can you really option 242 lbs of dead weight?
Anyway, my GTS with sports suspension is every bit as comfortable a DD in Normal mode as was my Boxster RS 60. Though I have not driven a Cayman R, its non-adjustable stiffer and lowered suspension (compared to an "S") has to be less comfortable than was my Boxster. So if you plan a lot of track time, go for the Cayman R; if you want a fairly comfortable DD that you can take to the track, the GTS is hard to beat (though with a $30K premium).
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...take_road_test
The test was conducted 7/25/11 as evidenced by the Test Sheet download. Curiously they did five braking tests, but only one acceleration test. And the drivetrain description calls out a 6 spd "M" DSG. Everything in the report says PDK, but WTH is that description? The Test Sheet mentions launch control, so the tester was evidently PDK equipped.
My GTS OM Supplement shows a PDK empty weight range of 3197-3439 lbs "depending on equipment". Can you really option 242 lbs of dead weight?
Anyway, my GTS with sports suspension is every bit as comfortable a DD in Normal mode as was my Boxster RS 60. Though I have not driven a Cayman R, its non-adjustable stiffer and lowered suspension (compared to an "S") has to be less comfortable than was my Boxster. So if you plan a lot of track time, go for the Cayman R; if you want a fairly comfortable DD that you can take to the track, the GTS is hard to beat (though with a $30K premium).
