Maurier

Hi all,
I only drove my Carrera S three timkes since I got it because of the weather here in Canada. The car only has 250 km at the moment.
When I first drove it I noticed that when ever I shift gear from 1st to 2nd there was a light notchiness/grinding feeling ( not sure how to explain it english not my first language =/) like there was a small obstacle going from 1st to 2nd.
Now since it is a new car I always take it easy and never pull any gears , especially 1st ,2nd and third past 2000 rpm's. I usually like to shift 1st and 2ndg gear around 1500 rpm's on a new car or until I hit 10000 kmh.
It just kept doing it over and over it was pissing me off. I decided to rev up the rpm's a bit up to 2000 and it stopped doing it.
If I shift 1st to 2nd at around 2000 rpm's no problems. I am starting to think that the Carrera doesn't like to work at low rpm's even on a break in period.
The gear box is always smooth , don't have any problems with reverse or 1st gear except this one time and the only issue is changing 1st to 2nd but I think that the 911 engine and gear box just don't like to work at low rpm's.
Today had another small problem was in second gear approaching a stop sign , I usually dont fully stop at stop signs lol , I slow down look btoh way and roll out in second gear to avoid reinserting 1st gear. But today I had to stop =/ I came to it in second or thinrd ( honestly can't remeber wich) I pressed down the clutch wile braking and I believe I heard a soft clunching sound and then the first gear wouldn't go in. I had to let go the clutch press it again and it went in.
Maybe I am being paranoid as usual and I just need to give time to the gearbox to break in a bit since it's a new car and the cold weather at -10 probably not helping either.
I am very meticulous wiht new cars I am the type of guy who does 1st 2nd then 4th gear , or if I am coming down the a highway ramp in 4th gear I will directly go to 6th gear from 4th. I just don't like pressing that cluth over and over and over =)
Other then that the gear box is smooth.

Jim 'n' SC

This is normal. The gearbox has steel syncro's in 1st and 2nd gears and are not as smooth when the transmission is cold. Not sure why it is better when shifting at higher rpms but mine does the same thing as well. It won't hurt the car to shift at 3,000 rpm when cold.

winkingchef

Shifting at 1500 from 1=>2 will lug your engine.
Take it easy, but you're overdoing it.

Tcc1999

^This is a very kind (and appropriate) reply. Others might not wear such kid gloves.

utkinpol

just a rule of thumb - never upshift before 3k rpm and never run below 2k rpm on any gear other than 1st.

during break in try not to run above 4.5K -5K rpm. after break-in your sweet spot is from 4K to 6K rpm in any gear.

RollingArt

Kid gloves taken off version:

You're trying to be kind to your car and break it in as loving as possible. However, the way you're driving it now is the worst possible abuse you could be subjecting the car to.

Utkinpol above gives good shifting advise for break-in. NEVER drive around with RPM's below 2k. At low rpm the explosive force of combustion is hammering on the crankshaft, while at the same time the motor is experiencing low oil pressure and can't help to protect itself from said hammering.

If you want to baby the motor keep the rev's between 2.5 - 4k rpm. If you think we're all full of it, stop by your dealer and tell them the way you've been driving. See what their reaction is! Of course they may void out your warranty when they here what you've been doing!

The shifting you're experiecing is normal for the way you've been abusing your car. The super cold weather makes it worse. Rev that puppy a little and she'll be happier.

One more thing. I bet you like to let your car idle for 10 min. on those cold mornings to let it warm up before you drive it? STOP doing that as well. Idling is not a heathy way to warm an engine. The oil pressure is low, the crank is being hammered, and the torture of it all goes on for an unnecessarily long time. Let it warm for 30 seconds at 2k rpm, then drive it, ABOVE 2k rpm.! The engine will warm up much sooner when driven.

That poor car.

GL



Phil

cbzzoom

1st and 2nd need very good rev matching to be smooth. In general this car rewards good rev matching so you'll want to practice that.



don't do that.


You're lugging the heck out of your car by going to such low revs in 2nd. Use your gears!

1st gear has to be lined up just right. There are some other threads on this if you care to search. Never force it. Just double-clutch and try again. Once you get better with the car you can usually pick first smoothly without missing it.

This is not good for the car. Use your clutch, get your revs up. Better to replace a clutch at 60k miles than to replace an engine!

petee1997

Read your owner's manual. They specify to never, never lug the engine. This will damage the engine. They also specify to never have rpm below 1500. This not a truck engine. They love to rev.

axhoaxho

Breaking-in the car does not mean to baby-ing it. Lugging the engine at low rpm actually does more harm than driving it normally (read the owner's manual, and google 'The dangers of lugging your engine'.)

Frankly, you are shifting at rpm that is too low. The 3.8L engine is torque-y but it is designed to rev, shifting between 3,000rpm and 4,000rpm is more appropiate even at break-in period.

And like any cars -- when in rare situation that must need to downshift from 2nd to 1st, blip the throttle to match the rpm before shifting into 1st (and in your case that you need to brake and downshift from 2nd-to-1st, that would be a form of heel-toe-downshifting.)

Regards,

Maurier

I can assure you I am not lugging the engine. I would feel the engine if it was lugging.
Approachign a stop sign in third gear around 70 or 80 kmh i slow down to around 40 kmh put second in and then roll out the engine is not lugging. A lugging engine is pretty easy to notice just by ears.
About skip shifting I dont lug the engine if I am in 4th gear at 100 kmh reved up to 3.8 or even 4000 rpm I usually don't bother going into 5th gear I just directly go into 6th.
Only time gear skipping should be bad , at least I tought , is when down shifting and not matching the revs. Other then that in up shifting I honestly can't see a problem with it.
About warming up the engine I knwo they say on modern cars with fuel injection is not good. On my old 1999 Jetta it said the same thing on the manual not to let it sit and warm up but drive instead. I use to let my 335xi cool-down idle for a minute before turning the engine off. Turning the engine off while the turbo is hot will cause the oil in the bearing to char and cause wear when it next spools up. I guess idling is not enviromental friendly but not letting a car idle for at leats a few minutes and let the oil warm up on an engine that is dependant on oil. Also I never rev up a cold engine. On my winter car , a 2009 jetta, I never let it idle I just get in and drive. And on this cold morning I swear I can ear that engine cry.
I never let it idle for 10 minutes I just let it idle up a bit then I start driving and I don't get on the highway untill the oit temp is normal. Usually idles anywhere from 3 to 5 min.
Anyways I will make a short video tonight, if I can figure out how to hold my camera in position, so you can hear the engine and show you what I am doing.
I am not trying to start an argument and I am probably 99% wrong lol but sometimes just because one says it is not the correct way doesn't necessarily mean is the wrong way. I remeber when they said cell phoens cause cancer..........right.
I use to have a Lancia delta integrale in 1994 it was a 2.o liter turbo. The turbo on it was nothing like my 335 there was quite a bit of lag to it and a pretty long wait for it to kick back in when going below a certain amount of rpm's. So usually when I use to corner I use to keep compulsivly give small pushes on the gas pedal not to let the rpm's go down and then have turbo lag when coming off the corner.
One time wile doing this I was with a friend of mine who use to race in the alfa cup in Italy and told me what I was doing was extremely dangerous and could unbalance the car and cause me to crush. He told me just keep the pedal steady and only accelerate coming off the corner. I did my own research on it and he was right the majority of people and professional drivers never do thsi. I told my self " what an idiot I am and so much to learn'. An embarassing moment until I saw this many years later.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8By2AEsGAhU one of my favorite F1 pilot and imho one of the best was doing the same thing.

Ucube

Not sure how it's not lugging the engine if you're up-shifting at 1,500 rpm.
You're rolling through stop signs at 40 kmh (25 mph)?!

GTgears

I've never understood posting a request for guidance on the internet and then arguing with the answers. Utkinpol put it very clearly. Run your revs up another 2000rpms or so before you shift and the problem is gone, and it's better for your car.

Maurier

It's back streets around where I live especially late at night there is no one there. If I have to completely stop for every stop sign I would rather commit suicide.
Here in Toronto there is a stop sign every 100 ft. Just a quick look left and right and I go. Hell in Italy we even run red lights late at night

alexb76

Please do not compare yourself to Senna! Not even the best F1 drivers compare themselves... what you were doing WAS WRONG, and Senna is changing the direction of the car and battling understeer/oversteer with the throttle at such rate that none of us can replicate successfully. He's basically balancing the car by modulating at that rate.

Maurier

Sorry but I find this amusing. Where exactly did I compare myself to Senna? I would have to be crazy to even think that

Most people believe Senna did that because he drove a lot of cars in the Turbo era, one way of keeping the Turbo spooled for maximum boost on corner exit is to rapidly blip the throttle. Others say "Senna's technique was to keep the velocity up in the diffuser by " blipping" the throttle. Thus he could keep the diffuser velocity up without exceeding the lateral grip of the tires"

Thanks for the laugh about me comparing my self to Senna although it was at my expense.
I spoke to the dealer and was told for the break in period to keep it anywhere from 2000 rpm to 3500 rpm's ( first gear no more then 2000~2500) and not to go past 140 kmh, then he added I should not be going past 120 KMH anyhow unless I plan to loose my license.
In sixth gear at 2400 rpm this car does exactly 106 kmh (speed limit) if I had to push allt he way past 3000 rpm's I would be well over the speed limit.
In theory if driving in 6th gear at 2500 rpm's would be consider slugging the car I would have to drive around in 5th gear at all time
The engine in 6th gear at those rpm's is very elastic and responsive not slugging coming from it.
Third gear at 2500 rpm same thing very responsive and not sluggish at all.
Porsche also told me to just let the car idle for no longer then a few minutes top then just drive slowly till the oil temp goes up. Well I did it for 5 min I guess I broke the engine.

Manual says : 1) 1) Don't lug the engine (don't drive it in low revs - say under 1500rpm) probably why the car was not lugging in 2nd gear at those rpm's. I am defenetly not going to rev second gear at 4000rpm. Some do but I prefer to keep it way below that.
Don't mean to sound rude but I was accused of car abuse rofl. And after talking to the dealer and checking the manual ( don't go below 1500 rpm) I can't see the abuse. My 335xi had the same break in and the engine was perfect no problem with the clutch or anything at close to 25000 km. I must of done something right there.

Jee I have been accused of car abuse =) , warming up my car for 10 minutes at idle ( I have never even mentioned anything about warming up any car) and of comparing myself to Ayrton Senna.
Taking things out of context a little ? Or maybe my spelling is so bad that I mean one thing and type another?