Carrera GTS
#61
Thats funny - so you've decided what does or doent "belong" in a certain car. Thank goodness you don't get to decide.
You didn't answer the question on whether you've actually owned one or more GT3's.
The Gt3 is a street car that should be taken to the track. In my humble opinion, they should offer it in both 6 speed and PDK. Unlike Ferrari. People who want to row and believe its "sacrilege" to have PDK and are not interested in wringing the absolute best lap time, can buy it. Others will have the choice to buy a PDK equipped car with a state of the art gear box.
You didn't answer the question on whether you've actually owned one or more GT3's.
The Gt3 is a street car that should be taken to the track. In my humble opinion, they should offer it in both 6 speed and PDK. Unlike Ferrari. People who want to row and believe its "sacrilege" to have PDK and are not interested in wringing the absolute best lap time, can buy it. Others will have the choice to buy a PDK equipped car with a state of the art gear box.
Assuming there is a major point to be gained here, what do the car(s) in my garage have to do with anything with my vocalizing my opinion?
#63
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
This thread was started to discuss a new model and ends up with a senseless PDK rant fueled by the stick fanatic PDK haters. Give me a brake. Choice is good.
To the PDK haters: you need therapy.
To the PDK haters: you need therapy.
#65
No one was hating on PDK or the choice of buying one. Hell, I'd buy one.
#66
Nordschleife Master
I would be pretty peeved if I owned a 997 GT3.1 now. No wonder the prices are dropping so quickly.
#67
Nordschleife Master
#68
Rennlist Member
However, wider rear only means wider rear track and more grip in the rear only, increasing what is already too much understeer in the 997 chassis. Wider also means less aerodynamic. So wider is slower in the turns, and slower in a straight line.
#69
Race Director
#70
Nordschleife Master
Aerodynamically the width difference is so marginal that a 1 or 2 mile decrease in top speed is all that you would ever see but on the track carrying through a higher speed and having a faster exit speed and getting grip to put the power down earlier means a way faster speed down the straight. Top speed doesn't really matter since on 99% of tracks you'll never get to top speed anyways.
If you think there is too much understeer in the 997 chassis, then your wrong. The suspension is setup to understeer from the factory. The 911 chassis with the engine in the rear is an oversteering car by nature and Porsche has went to great extents to make it as stable as it is now.
#71
Rennlist Member
Wider rear on a Carrera is for looks only. It is already nearly impossible to get the back end to step out, and, yes, it has too much understeer. It does not need more rear grip.
(But, hey, don't take my word for it...note that the GT2RS and GT3RS have wider rear AND front track for optimal balance.)
(But, hey, don't take my word for it...note that the GT2RS and GT3RS have wider rear AND front track for optimal balance.)
#73
Rennlist Member
How many factoy backed Porsche race cars are ringing those "absolute best lap times" with PDK? Additionally, can you point me to the checkbox where PDK is an option when buying a factory prepared race car? Perfect shifting comes at a cost, complexity and weight; two things you try to avoid in racing.
Assuming there is a major point to be gained here, what do the car(s) in my garage have to do with anything with my vocalizing my opinion?
Assuming there is a major point to be gained here, what do the car(s) in my garage have to do with anything with my vocalizing my opinion?
I just came back from Nurburing, attending Porsche Sports Cup event. I asked the EXACT same question from the race drivers of both Sports Cup and Super Sports Cup... they all said PDK is fast, but not proven in race conditions, and not adopted by anyone in those series.
The biggest issues are:
- Unknown reliability under race conditions
- Added Weight
- Computer Glitches that can cause unexpected failures
- Cost of Maintenance
- Inflexibility to modify transmission for various purposes (endurance vs. short race)
Basically, unless we're talking F1 funding and resources, a complex gearbox is not ideal for smaller racing series, and this particular transmission is NOT proven reliable under race conditions... and we're NOT talking DE days folks! Having PDK in TT doesn't mean anything, as TT is more of a GT car than race-car (look how many more Cabriolets are ordered vs. Coupe).
Having said that... I believe there IS a market for PDK GT3, as I am sure there are folks who like to own a GT3 for bragging rights, who really don't race it heavily (I know a couple of those folks), and if Porsche marketing research finds there's a market, they will make it available maybe in GT3, and not in GT3 RS. This is all a guess!
Cheers!
#74
Having said that... I believe there IS a market for PDK GT3, as I am sure there are folks who like to own a GT3 for bragging rights, who really don't race it heavily (I know a couple of those folks), and if Porsche marketing research finds there's a market, they will make it available maybe in GT3, and not in GT3 RS. This is all a guess!
Cheers!
Cheers!
If the GT3 R/RSRs/Cups etc were built with PDK, then perhaps I could see that as an option in the street variant. But until then and much to my earlier posted opinion, the GT3/RS should continue to mirror the race version as much as it is feasibly possible.
So that I'm clear, the above is only my opinon and I'm not hating on the PDK or the convertible. I like them both and it is not my intnent to offend owners of cars equiped with either or both.
Now back to the GTS - has anyone seen any spy photos floating around or more specific details?
#75
Race Director
Clifton, GT3 RSR's ect do not not have a standard 6 speed either.....seqeuntial shift....no clutch on up shifting.
It will be intersting to see what Porsche does with the GT1 engine and if they use the 9A1 engines that accepts PDK in the GT3.
It will be intersting to see what Porsche does with the GT1 engine and if they use the 9A1 engines that accepts PDK in the GT3.