mkaresh

I run many checks that can be done using the supplied information. I do not externally verify the data. No contradiction.

If we required the information you'd like us to require, far fewer real people with real cars would participate. Simple as that.

Why are you so intent on making a mountain out of a molehill?

Tone

"Because the devil is in the details"

As others have rightly posted: too many violations of Stats 101 for the results to be sound. A friendly tip: join RL, you may find more support

mkaresh

Insist on perfection, and you'll often end up with nothing. There is a definite point of diminishing returns and many of these suggestions, though valid, go well beyond that point.

I have the permission of the owner and the active support of the admin. I am referring anyone who researches Porsches on my site to this forum.

swajames

Tough crowd... Anyway, I've signed up.

leneuromancer

GEEZ, How is this better/worse than any other [b.s.] survey/poll/whateva out there? I'll give it a go, and if it sucks or is a PITA/boring/? over time I will just quit responding, relegating the emails to the SPAM folder (if I cannot successfully "cancel" that is)

I don't know how much time this will require, but I know I [we] spend [waste] plenty of time reading posts on this and many other forums - 5 minutes, once a month, by a majority of legit, honest owners really may garner some interesting info ...it sure can't hurt

mkaresh

It's better than others that exist, not as good as some ideal survey that does not exist. It is a much more carefully designed process than the typical online survey.

You might or might not find it boring. It is a "just the facts" kind of thing, so the entertainment value might be limited.

The time required will depend on how much you have to report. If it turns out you have no repairs to report, it's little more than clicking a link and entering an approximate odometer reading. Takes many people well under a minute, and this would be four times a year.

If you do have a repair to report, this might take a few extra minutes. The form is a single page with 14 quick questions. The first time you should read the directions, after that (if there is a second time) it'll be quicker.

Chris from Cali

No kidding - bunch of StrekStrekStrekStreking NASA engineers or something. I think it's interesting to see what people are reporting, whether it's scientifically accurate or not.

Ever heard of the census? That's BS too for the same reasons.

abe

Ever heard of a course called "statistics"...btw the census is supose to be a headcount so that we know how many representatives should represent us is in congress.
abe

Body Roll

If there is a large sample size, and there's reason to believe that most of people responding aren't lying, then the error from a few bogus entries won't spoil the whole project. Mkaresh, as you mentioned, the data you get from this will be biased, but bogus replies wouldn't be the biggest problem IMHO.

The results will still be interesting, despite the bias from where you're collecting the data.

Chris from Cali

Yes, abe - no need to be pedantic. My point was that the census can be easily skewed as well.

Canyon56

That is a question you need to ask yourself. Why might that be?

I would think that you would appreciate the criticism here as it might inform you as to why this phenomenon exists.

Aside from that, I do find the methodology flawed. And when a car has to make a trip to the dealer, there is sometimes no qualitative explanation. Some people go to the dealer because their windscreen washing fluid is low. In addition, many people who will be reporting data want to make the effort because they are angry that they have issues in the first place and may very well add cars that they don't own, as has been implied here. The "scream loud enough and somebody might hear you" sort of thing. Plus there are so many owners that don't use car forums; the other market research companies do mass mailings, etc., to all new owners.

Anyway, despite the methodology issues, I find the website to be so convoluted, too difficult to easily navigate, and an eyesore. I stopped looking at it (yes I did sign up one of my cars and reported the data.) And I'm sorry, but those details do matter. A lot.

mkaresh

Why doesn't everyone participate? The same reason everyone doesn't participate in every other survey out there--time. Even if it takes just a minute.

No market research firm emails every owner, not even the ones getting paid the big bucks by the manufacturers. And certainly no one trying to serve car owners.

I can't recall a single instance in over 40,000 repairs reported where someone reported low windshield washer fluid. And if they did we'd exclude it. We read every response to check for such things.

Much the same applies to other things that "might happen." In virtually all cases they either don't happen nearly as often as people seem to think, or at all. The process has been carefully designed to avoid many likely problems.

I'm always open to feedback that is detailed enough to act upon and that it is possible to act upon. But I receive nearly no feedback of this sort. If you were me and read your post, what could you do with it? "Eyesore" (which I've never heard before) and "convoluted" (which I have) don't get me very far.

I'd love to fix both. I have been steadily improving the usability of the site. But with almost no detailed feedback I'm flying blind with this.

Canyon56

Sorry Michael, but you've been advertising your website on car forums for free for a while now. No sponsorship anywhere, not even a Rennlist membership. And we both know that you're building this to pay off eventually, so spare me that.

Again, if you want criticism, then listen to it whether you think it's constructive or not. We are your customers. And stop with the rubs, like the one you just posted: "And certainly no one trying to serve car owners--you know, the people who don't want to pay anything."

I support your endeavor. But you gotta take the heat and go forward with a positive business plan, etc..

Sorry, but I can't respond to anything when you keep editing your post every minute.......

Canyon56

Michael, to respond to your edits:
I'll pm you with some specifics later this week after the holiday. You have to make the online experience fun and enjoyable whether it's a free service, or a blog, or you have the hottest product on the market.

It needs to be navigable, simple, and quick and easy to access. Layout needs to be clean. Not tons of scrolling, searching, and page hopping, either. Otherwise they will click off your web page and on to something else. Remember, we're in the "attention deficit brave new world" of media

I'm in media and design, but sorry I can't offer any specific services to you (way too busy and it's expensive) but I will point you to info/sources and some detailed tips.

Have a good weekend and drive safe.

mkaresh

Sorry for the edits, but I immediately realized that some of what I wrote was poorly chosen.

I certainly read the criticism. But criticism that is not actionable gets very frustrating if taken seriously. I'm often told that I take it too seriously.

The business case that involves real money always involves focusing on manufacturers not car owners. I've opted to serve the latter anyway, so it is necessary to keep costs low.

For forums like this one I do two things:

1. Post results when I have them. This takes a considerable amount of my time.

2. Refer people here from all of the results pages on my site. Not just from a buried links page.

Your second post is the sort I gladly read, thanks for posting it. I totally get the design philosophy you outline. The incredibly hard part is translating this into practice. Anyone who thinks they can do this well, I'd love to talk to them. Seriously. I know it won't be free.

Making it more fun is also excellent advice. For various reasons--stress, workload, skill set--I might not be personally capable of this. Another area where I might have to get help.