Notices
997 Forum 2005-2012
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

What did you guys decide on Break in?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 07-23-2009, 02:27 AM
  #31  
PogueMoHone
Addict
Rennlist Member

 
PogueMoHone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,802
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

^
Don't worry, my son after two tours in Iraq decided to finish his education. I never gave up on him and I was right!

The apple never falls far from the tree!
Old 07-23-2009, 03:54 AM
  #32  
Macster
Race Director
 
Macster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Centerton, AR
Posts: 19,034
Likes: 0
Received 253 Likes on 223 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by stevepow
My objective is a measurable exercise in patience, since I tend to be very impatient - I need the practice. Beyond that...a "leap of faith" following closely by a "what can it hurt"?

I'm pretty sure my manual says to expect to possibly add oil regularly and I don't think it mentions the break-in process affecting this.

But I'm new to Porsche ownership - is a break-in process taboo and just for geeks?
Following the break-in guidelines sign of intelligence, not geekiness.

Let's ignore new cast surfaces for now.

Newly machined surfaces of whiich there many in a new engine shed metal. I was employed as a machinist for nearly 10 years. Very common to run one's hand over a newly machined surface and have one's hand come away discolored with the tiny metal particles the machining operation left loose.

What you have inside a new engine are a lot of machined surfaces. Sure, some are treated to help remove the loose metal particles but still the friction of the oil will remove more.

As the engine runs, as the sliding/rotating/reciprocating parts work this works free more metal debris. Sure, most of this is debris is small in size, but take for instance the camshaft lobe valve lifter face interface. The contact line of a valve lobe is very thin. The pressure per square inch is very high, in some street engines nearly 300,000psi. The Porsche engines generate around 170,000psi, still very high.

What happens if metal debris breaks loose? It can pass between the lobe/lifter face contained in the oil film. However, if engine speed high, the oil temperature high and new engines run hot due to increased friction, the oil film may not be as thick as it would be otherwise. Thus this metal particle makes contact with both the cam lobe and valve lifter interface. This contact can be great enough the particle temporarily welds itself to one or both of the two metal surfaces. When it breaks free it pulls some of the base metal away. This is wear. Accelerated wear. And it creates a tiny spot that will over time have its walls/edges shed metal since the surface is no longer intact and no longer as good at resisting this shedding, which is again wear.

By following break in guidelines the engine's temperature is kept lower than it would be otherwise. Mechanical friction and hydraulic oil friction is at a lower level than it would be otherwise, so these metal particles are shed in a more benign fashion. Oil films between metal parts remain at their maximum.

The same applies to the piston/ring and cylinder wall interface, the crank and rod bearing interfaces and any and all sliding or rolling bearing interfaces.

Back to castings: A fresh casting sheds metal too. The majority of metal surfaces in the interior of an engine are aluminum. Alumimun when exposed to air generates an oxide of aluminum. Cause the outer layer of the casting is not tightly bonded to the base metal the interior surfaces of the engine casting shed aluminum oxide. This is an industrial abasive used to grind/finish ferrous metals.

Now the oil picks up this alum. oxide. The larger particles are filltered out, until the oil filter becomes full. Then the oil laden with this alum. oxide and whatever other metal particles it has picked up is circulated throughout the engine.

This is now the oil that must keep the camshaft lobe and lifter faces from coming together from making metal to metal contact. If engine speed and oil temperature are below a certain threshold as is the case if break in guidelines are followed there is sufficient oil film to prevent metal to metal contact and keep the metal particles in the oil from acting as an abrasive.

To make matters worse, new engines leak, suffer from blowby. This puts water and unburned gas in the oil. In some cases with our cars the oil -- 8 to 9 or so quarts -- can contain mixed with the oil nearly a half a quart of water and unburned gasoline.

This works to lower the viscosity of the oil making it less able to resist high temperature break down.

A break in is intended to keep the engine loads down, the oil temperature down, and this means not only total oil temperature but localized oil temperatures which can be quite a bit higher.

With lower oil temperature the instances of metal to metal contact is lessened.

The engine's internal surfaces still shed metal but this metal is nearly harmless.

It helps of course to change the oil early along with the filter to remove the oil that is laden with the metal particles and a filter that may no longer be acting as a filter.

Following a break in procedure is just engine common sense.

An engine treated to a by the book break in may still burn oil. Engines vary and some are just naturally "oil burners". Some oil consumption is a factor of how the car is driven too so heavier oil consumption may not be all the engine's fault.

Now sure an engine treated more, well harshly, during the break in period will develop max. power sooner. Peak power may not be as high as it would have been had the engine been broken in by the book. And the engine will almost certainly not sustain its max. power output for as long a period of time.

There are exceptions of course, but these just prove the rule. A large population of engines will overall be better off than they would be otherwise by being properly broken in.

If this were not the case Porsche and other makers would not have any break in guidelines.

Sincerely,

Macster.
Old 07-23-2009, 07:22 AM
  #33  
f4 plt
Rennlist Member

 
f4 plt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,136
Received 160 Likes on 79 Posts
Default

Paul:

I did the break-in on my 2009 C2S close to the manual instructions to even include letting the PDK do most of the shifting ( at least until 1000 miles) in the auto mode. Once I got well over 1000 miles on the car and it was at operating temp i would run the revs up higher from time to time and shift more in the manual mode. Big thing is to vary the revs as well as the speed in the early portion of the break-in. I was also gentle on the brakes until the pads were set. I now have over 6000 miles on her and have used a total of about 1 qrt of oil. Next thing is to get it re-aligned at about 1500 miles after the suspension has settled. If you do it at less than 2000 miles and 6 months Porsche will pay for it. Mine was just barely out of factory specs. Other than that I throughly enjoy the car and plan to keep it a long time. I am also very happy with the Sharkwerks center muffler by-pass pipe. Easy to install, great sound yet quiet in the cabin at cruise, saves 10 lbs of weight at the rear and adds some hp. Now my focus is looking for a 365 not as a replacement but as an addition ----- oh how I am enjoying retirement. Jack
Old 07-23-2009, 08:33 AM
  #34  
No HTwo O
Banned
 
No HTwo O's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Arlington Heights, IL
Posts: 7,299
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes on 9 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by OldGuy
Like you guys said with the modern ECU they probably know everything you did or do
I request a print-out of the DME (ECU old terminology) from the dealership each year my cars are in for oil changes. The report is several pages long. Lists a ton of info for the newer cars (997 and 987). Also shows the 6 over-rev ranges and number of ignitions in those ranges. I keep this with my maintenance records.

I also followed the proper break-in procedure outlined in the Owner's Manual.
Old 07-23-2009, 08:36 AM
  #35  
No HTwo O
Banned
 
No HTwo O's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Arlington Heights, IL
Posts: 7,299
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes on 9 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by OldGuy
I test drove the one I bought and I didnt really take it easy on it. We even did one launch under
launch control.
One of the reasons I like to custom order my cars. No "test drives".
Old 07-23-2009, 10:46 AM
  #36  
Quadcammer
Race Director
 
Quadcammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Clifton, NJ
Posts: 15,676
Received 1,416 Likes on 818 Posts
Default

drive it hard but methodically. Don't necessarily take it to the track, but load the throttle, let it do some engine braking. You will not be greatly affecting oil temperature by giving it the beans a few times.

My strategy:

Load the throttle a lot, lots of engine braking. Engine oil change after 30 miles, 200 miles, 1000 miles, and 5,000 miles.

95% of ring seal is determined in the first 30 minutes of run time.
Old 07-23-2009, 12:27 PM
  #37  
Edgy01
Poseur
Rennlist Member
 
Edgy01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 17,703
Received 238 Likes on 129 Posts
Default

I changed my oil after about 6000 miles I think the first time around. There was absolutely no metal inside the filter, or suspended within the oil,--at least not of a visible size to the naked eye. I only found a very small bit of gasket material (reddish) on the filter. There was an article in Automobile magazine some time back suggested that the break in period for the Porsche was more for the driver to get used to the vehicle, and not so much for the engine's benefit. Also, it is a good idea for all the suspension parts to get used to working with each other,--slowly built up through a modest break in. The factory told me to keep "it under 5000 rpms for the first 2000 miles" and keep the rpms and speeds all over the place. I followed that routine and then after hitting that magic number, started to run it up to redline on the autostradas. Once back in Germany I found myself on a no limit section with little traffic and pushed it up to 180 mph. The break in was for me, as I hadn't driven over 130 in several years. The highest I had been before was 162, but that was several years before. I was confident in the car's ability to handle those speeds once the break in period was well passed. That, along with outstanding road conditions, and cooperative traffic made for a great time!
Old 07-23-2009, 01:05 PM
  #38  
MJones
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
 
MJones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 5,569
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes on 7 Posts
Default Cold Test Explanation

As all new engines are "Cold" tested, here is an explanation:

Engines are spun by an electric motor and tested for
oil and compression by roational osolation. The engine is not fired or
run. It is spun at a speed to start seating the rings due to friction.


Last edited by MJones; 07-23-2009 at 01:31 PM.
Old 07-23-2009, 01:07 PM
  #39  
OldGuy
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Thread Starter
 
OldGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Southwest Idaho
Posts: 10,474
Likes: 0
Received 51 Likes on 11 Posts
Default

I think I was the only one to drive it I aint worried aobut it. I had less than 80 mils on it
Old 07-23-2009, 02:03 PM
  #40  
texas911
Race Car
 
texas911's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 4,053
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

RTFM, I think is the proper terminology.
Old 07-23-2009, 02:12 PM
  #41  
rijowysock
Nordschleife Master
 
rijowysock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: The Arctic Cold
Posts: 5,718
Likes: 0
Received 10 Likes on 5 Posts
Default

so if someone were picking a car up 1000 miles away, bad to keep same speed on highway.. or i should just throttle it up occasionally while driving to keep rev's moving around and speed? and engine brake for corners and such?
Old 07-23-2009, 05:43 PM
  #42  
No HTwo O
Banned
 
No HTwo O's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Arlington Heights, IL
Posts: 7,299
Likes: 0
Received 11 Likes on 9 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by rijowysock
so if someone were picking a car up 1000 miles away, bad to keep same speed on highway.. or i should just throttle it up occasionally while driving to keep rev's moving around and speed? and engine brake for corners and such?
No, you should change gears too, and keep the RPM's below the 4,200 mark.

Don't sit in 5th or 6th gear for hundreds of miles. Downsift into 3rd and 4th, adjust your speed, monitor your RPM's and sit there for a few miles, up-shift into the next gear, do the same until you get back to 6th gear. Do this again every hour or 100 miles.
Old 07-23-2009, 05:49 PM
  #43  
Mussl Kar
Rennlist Member
 
Mussl Kar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: SE Mass
Posts: 4,238
Received 423 Likes on 292 Posts
Default

I took it at normal legal highway speeds all the way home. All 45 miles of it. Put slicks on it and ran the next day, and the following weekend. I was told by Porsche that this method will make the engine a bit looser and more powerful in the process. I was also told that any detrimental effects, if any, of this type of break in would not be noticed until well after 100,000 miles.
Old 07-23-2009, 06:59 PM
  #44  
texas911
Race Car
 
texas911's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 4,053
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Mussl Kar
I took it at normal legal highway speeds all the way home. All 45 miles of it. Put slicks on it and ran the next day, and the following weekend. I was told by Porsche that this method will make the engine a bit looser and more powerful in the process. I was also told that any detrimental effects, if any, of this type of break in would not be noticed until well after 100,000 miles.
Porsche told you this. Porsche. An actual engineer from the Porsche factory.
Old 07-23-2009, 07:36 PM
  #45  
DRJMK
Burning Brakes
 
DRJMK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: SC
Posts: 815
Received 3 Likes on 1 Post
Default

the only thing I had to worry about for a test drive was Stoppie driving my car, FAST!


Quick Reply: What did you guys decide on Break in?



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 09:01 AM.