Rear Foglight=improper equipment ticket?
03-13-2009, 12:21 PM
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Rear Foglight=improper equipment ticket?
Hello everyone.
I am not sure if this is off-topic, but a customer of mine is in need. He was driving with the rear fog light on, and was pulled over. The officer (back country sheriff) gave him a ticket for improper equipment b/c of it.
I did some research, and could not find where the rear fog is required by law in Europe. Has anyone here had this issue before? Any idea on a good defense? He happened to be carrying a firearm (did have concealed permit), and they confiscated it. He is of course going to fight this whole situation so he can get his gun back, and have the ticket dropped. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
- John
I am not sure if this is off-topic, but a customer of mine is in need. He was driving with the rear fog light on, and was pulled over. The officer (back country sheriff) gave him a ticket for improper equipment b/c of it.
I did some research, and could not find where the rear fog is required by law in Europe. Has anyone here had this issue before? Any idea on a good defense? He happened to be carrying a firearm (did have concealed permit), and they confiscated it. He is of course going to fight this whole situation so he can get his gun back, and have the ticket dropped. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
- John
03-13-2009, 12:43 PM
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Euro cars must have one rear fog light on the driver's side of the car. Porsche sends the cars to North America that way. The right rear fog light does not illuminate, because it is not wired to do so.
What was the specific reason for the "improper equipment?" Was it because only one fog light was illuminated? Since all cars sole in the USA have to meet DOT regs, I believe he should not have an issue with getting the ticket dismissed.
BTW, if the ticket was because of only one rear fog light, your friend can avoid future citations by running a jumper wire from the left rear fog light to the right rear fog light. Then both will illuminate. I did this on my 996 C2 and it took about 30 minutes to complete.
What was the specific reason for the "improper equipment?" Was it because only one fog light was illuminated? Since all cars sole in the USA have to meet DOT regs, I believe he should not have an issue with getting the ticket dismissed.
BTW, if the ticket was because of only one rear fog light, your friend can avoid future citations by running a jumper wire from the left rear fog light to the right rear fog light. Then both will illuminate. I did this on my 996 C2 and it took about 30 minutes to complete.
03-13-2009, 12:47 PM
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1) Was it foggy/rainy or was he doing as too many seem to do and running with his fogs on under clear conditions? Cops have given tickets for misuse of fog lights and frankly I wish they'd do more of it.
2) The reason the car has only one rear fog light is to avoid confusion between the rear fog light and the brake lights.
2) The reason the car has only one rear fog light is to avoid confusion between the rear fog light and the brake lights.
03-13-2009, 01:56 PM
#4
if it is not raining or foggy, he should not have them on. I was following a audi the other day with one blaring in my face and it was a clear night. My old audi S4 required that you turn it on each time you start the car, to eliminate anyone just leaving it on.....
03-13-2009, 03:06 PM
#5
I am not sure what "improper equipment" means..... Improper use is something I would understand (like driving with one's high beams on constantly). If the claim is that the rear fog lamp is "improper equipment", I would fight that as local and state governments are not authorized to determine that. The US Gov. decides how manufacturers equip cars for the US market.
03-13-2009, 03:42 PM
#6
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Here's what several states' rules state. Typically, this is a problem for small states that just don't see this sort of stuff.
First of all, DOT and the EPA determine what is permitted on vehicles sold in America. If rear fogs were illegal they would not be provided.
States routinely state that fog lights may be used in lieu of headlights during periods of inclement weather. (Routinely, they are supplemental).
On the 997.1 the rear fog light is switched separately from the fog lights. You can elect to only put the front fogs on, or have them on with the rear on, as well. But, putting the rear fog on should only be done when visibility is so impacted by fog that someone can easily run up behind you and rear end you when driving beyond their visibility. They are highly distracting when used under normal weather conditions. You can often spot a novice European car driver on the roads in America with their rear fog light(s) on when conditions do not warrant it. It is typically a lack of knowledge that they even HAVE a rear fog light. It's essentially a lack of knowing the equipment on their car, and they accidently have turned it on.
I received a warning ticket many years ago in Oklahoma by a state trooper for "illegal use of fowl (sic) weather lights." In those days, I had a 911SC which came with factory fog lights and they were factory wired to only come on when the headlights were on and the lights were on low beam, and I had pulled out the fog light switch. The trooper believed (incorrectly) that having the fog lights on at ALL was illegal, yet they were on with the low beam headlights. I researched it in their state equipment laws and found that I was right, and he was wrong. Porsche built these things in such a way that you couldn't violate any equipment laws. BUT, the problem here, is that the user of the rear fog lights had to exercise judgement in whether the weather conditions warranted the use of a supplemental rear fog light. He apparently did not, and thus he was ticketed. He probably just didn't know he had it on.
In Europe, the usual configuration is dual rear fogs on cars going to the UK and a single fog on the driver's side of the car for all others. The latter configuration is the one coming to the USA.
A normal police officer would have stopped the driver, and simply inquired as to why their rear fog light was on. The driver would have pled no knowledge of how the light switch was turned, corrected it, and been on his way.
There are few opportunities that require the use of the rear fog light. Once, early one morning, I was going through the Netherlands and the low lying fog was so thick NOT HAVING a rear fog light would have endangered me.
Note that on the 997.2 cars they do not come with a front fog light any longer. They are essentially useless on the 997s as the Bi-Zenons work so well. BUT, on the 997.2 cars the "fog light" switch will only turn on the rear fog.
First of all, DOT and the EPA determine what is permitted on vehicles sold in America. If rear fogs were illegal they would not be provided.
States routinely state that fog lights may be used in lieu of headlights during periods of inclement weather. (Routinely, they are supplemental).
On the 997.1 the rear fog light is switched separately from the fog lights. You can elect to only put the front fogs on, or have them on with the rear on, as well. But, putting the rear fog on should only be done when visibility is so impacted by fog that someone can easily run up behind you and rear end you when driving beyond their visibility. They are highly distracting when used under normal weather conditions. You can often spot a novice European car driver on the roads in America with their rear fog light(s) on when conditions do not warrant it. It is typically a lack of knowledge that they even HAVE a rear fog light. It's essentially a lack of knowing the equipment on their car, and they accidently have turned it on.
I received a warning ticket many years ago in Oklahoma by a state trooper for "illegal use of fowl (sic) weather lights." In those days, I had a 911SC which came with factory fog lights and they were factory wired to only come on when the headlights were on and the lights were on low beam, and I had pulled out the fog light switch. The trooper believed (incorrectly) that having the fog lights on at ALL was illegal, yet they were on with the low beam headlights. I researched it in their state equipment laws and found that I was right, and he was wrong. Porsche built these things in such a way that you couldn't violate any equipment laws. BUT, the problem here, is that the user of the rear fog lights had to exercise judgement in whether the weather conditions warranted the use of a supplemental rear fog light. He apparently did not, and thus he was ticketed. He probably just didn't know he had it on.
In Europe, the usual configuration is dual rear fogs on cars going to the UK and a single fog on the driver's side of the car for all others. The latter configuration is the one coming to the USA.
A normal police officer would have stopped the driver, and simply inquired as to why their rear fog light was on. The driver would have pled no knowledge of how the light switch was turned, corrected it, and been on his way.
There are few opportunities that require the use of the rear fog light. Once, early one morning, I was going through the Netherlands and the low lying fog was so thick NOT HAVING a rear fog light would have endangered me.
Note that on the 997.2 cars they do not come with a front fog light any longer. They are essentially useless on the 997s as the Bi-Zenons work so well. BUT, on the 997.2 cars the "fog light" switch will only turn on the rear fog.
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03-13-2009, 05:42 PM
#9
Nordschleife Master
Here's what several states' rules state. Typically, this is a problem for small states that just don't see this sort of stuff.
First of all, DOT and the EPA determine what is permitted on vehicles sold in America. If rear fogs were illegal they would not be provided.
States routinely state that fog lights may be used in lieu of headlights during periods of inclement weather. (Routinely, they are supplemental).
On the 997.1 the rear fog light is switched separately from the fog lights. You can elect to only put the front fogs on, or have them on with the rear on, as well. But, putting the rear fog on should only be done when visibility is so impacted by fog that someone can easily run up behind you and rear end you when driving beyond their visibility. They are highly distracting when used under normal weather conditions. You can often spot a novice European car driver on the roads in America with their rear fog light(s) on when conditions do not warrant it. It is typically a lack of knowledge that they even HAVE a rear fog light. It's essentially a lack of knowing the equipment on their car, and they accidently have turned it on.
I received a warning ticket many years ago in Oklahoma by a state trooper for "illegal use of fowl (sic) weather lights." In those days, I had a 911SC which came with factory fog lights and they were factory wired to only come on when the headlights were on and the lights were on low beam, and I had pulled out the fog light switch. The trooper believed (incorrectly) that having the fog lights on at ALL was illegal, yet they were on with the low beam headlights. I researched it in their state equipment laws and found that I was right, and he was wrong. Porsche built these things in such a way that you couldn't violate any equipment laws. BUT, the problem here, is that the user of the rear fog lights had to exercise judgement in whether the weather conditions warranted the use of a supplemental rear fog light. He apparently did not, and thus he was ticketed. He probably just didn't know he had it on.
In Europe, the usual configuration is dual rear fogs on cars going to the UK and a single fog on the driver's side of the car for all others. The latter configuration is the one coming to the USA.
A normal police officer would have stopped the driver, and simply inquired as to why their rear fog light was on. The driver would have pled no knowledge of how the light switch was turned, corrected it, and been on his way.
There are few opportunities that require the use of the rear fog light. Once, early one morning, I was going through the Netherlands and the low lying fog was so thick NOT HAVING a rear fog light would have endangered me.
Note that on the 997.2 cars they do not come with a front fog light any longer. They are essentially useless on the 997s as the Bi-Zenons work so well. BUT, on the 997.2 cars the "fog light" switch will only turn on the rear fog.
First of all, DOT and the EPA determine what is permitted on vehicles sold in America. If rear fogs were illegal they would not be provided.
States routinely state that fog lights may be used in lieu of headlights during periods of inclement weather. (Routinely, they are supplemental).
On the 997.1 the rear fog light is switched separately from the fog lights. You can elect to only put the front fogs on, or have them on with the rear on, as well. But, putting the rear fog on should only be done when visibility is so impacted by fog that someone can easily run up behind you and rear end you when driving beyond their visibility. They are highly distracting when used under normal weather conditions. You can often spot a novice European car driver on the roads in America with their rear fog light(s) on when conditions do not warrant it. It is typically a lack of knowledge that they even HAVE a rear fog light. It's essentially a lack of knowing the equipment on their car, and they accidently have turned it on.
I received a warning ticket many years ago in Oklahoma by a state trooper for "illegal use of fowl (sic) weather lights." In those days, I had a 911SC which came with factory fog lights and they were factory wired to only come on when the headlights were on and the lights were on low beam, and I had pulled out the fog light switch. The trooper believed (incorrectly) that having the fog lights on at ALL was illegal, yet they were on with the low beam headlights. I researched it in their state equipment laws and found that I was right, and he was wrong. Porsche built these things in such a way that you couldn't violate any equipment laws. BUT, the problem here, is that the user of the rear fog lights had to exercise judgement in whether the weather conditions warranted the use of a supplemental rear fog light. He apparently did not, and thus he was ticketed. He probably just didn't know he had it on.
In Europe, the usual configuration is dual rear fogs on cars going to the UK and a single fog on the driver's side of the car for all others. The latter configuration is the one coming to the USA.
A normal police officer would have stopped the driver, and simply inquired as to why their rear fog light was on. The driver would have pled no knowledge of how the light switch was turned, corrected it, and been on his way.
There are few opportunities that require the use of the rear fog light. Once, early one morning, I was going through the Netherlands and the low lying fog was so thick NOT HAVING a rear fog light would have endangered me.
Note that on the 997.2 cars they do not come with a front fog light any longer. They are essentially useless on the 997s as the Bi-Zenons work so well. BUT, on the 997.2 cars the "fog light" switch will only turn on the rear fog.
03-14-2009, 02:19 PM
#10
03-14-2009, 03:22 PM
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not very cop has a brain.
and the fact that the fog light is on only one side of the car really FREAKS them out. i got pulled over and got a warning that i only have one light. that's in my 19e 2.3-16. i was so fed up i pull the lens off and showed himt that there actually not even a socket on the right side. then they believed me....
and the fact that the fog light is on only one side of the car really FREAKS them out. i got pulled over and got a warning that i only have one light. that's in my 19e 2.3-16. i was so fed up i pull the lens off and showed himt that there actually not even a socket on the right side. then they believed me....
03-14-2009, 06:34 PM
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Light controls, click all the way to the R right and pull OUT!
The little light on the left side of the control means your rear fog is ON.
Go to the back side of the car; and it's the bright light on the drivers side tail light.
I ALWAYS point it out b/c you never know if a cop will pull you over. Can you say potential DUI?
I learned that the hard way wayyy back when I first started with Benz. We had a sales rep who forgot to point it out; guy got a DUI b/c they pulled him over due to his rear fog being on.
Poor bastard blew .001 over the limit. They fired the sales rep.
03-14-2009, 06:36 PM
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Yes you do!
Light controls, click all the way to the R right and pull OUT!
The little light on the left side of the control means your rear fog is ON.
Go to the back side of the car; and it's the bright light on the drivers side tail light.
I ALWAYS point it out b/c you never know if a cop will pull you over. Can you say potential DUI?
I learned that the hard way wayyy back when I first started with Benz. We had a sales rep who forgot to point it out; guy got a DUI b/c they pulled him over due to his rear fog being on.
Poor bastard blew .001 over the limit. They fired the sales rep.
Light controls, click all the way to the R right and pull OUT!
The little light on the left side of the control means your rear fog is ON.
Go to the back side of the car; and it's the bright light on the drivers side tail light.
I ALWAYS point it out b/c you never know if a cop will pull you over. Can you say potential DUI?
I learned that the hard way wayyy back when I first started with Benz. We had a sales rep who forgot to point it out; guy got a DUI b/c they pulled him over due to his rear fog being on.
Poor bastard blew .001 over the limit. They fired the sales rep.