X51 Package
07-04-2008, 09:56 AM
#46
I'm keeping my Club Coupe until it dies or I do.
07-04-2008, 09:59 AM
#47
Three Wheelin'
07-04-2008, 11:57 AM
#49
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Never said I didn't like it and never said I wouldn't pay for it-just wouldn't pay more than $5K.
Spend more time running your "state of the art" engineering company employing hundreds of high paid engineers and someday you'll be able to afford that 997 RS. FYI I do think the $17K is easily justified in the GT3 cars but when I look at the two side by side I can tell I've got something different-not just a piece of buttered corn on the cob ready to take a run at me.
Spend more time running your "state of the art" engineering company employing hundreds of high paid engineers and someday you'll be able to afford that 997 RS.
FYI I do think the $17K is easily justified in the GT3 cars but when I look at the two side by side I can tell I've got something different-not just a piece of buttered corn on the cob ready to take a run at me.I understand that from a value standpoint you've got to cap what you'd be willing to spend, that's good use of your money.
nice visual of the corn on the cob.
bottom line is- if you can get an x51 coupe for a marginally increased price over standard, it's a great "option". The 997 x51 would be a great daily driver, especially given the extra road clearance it's got over the gt3. given the current release of DI and PDK in the facelift, it might not be a great idea to order the current 997 as is in any configuration, better to wait for the next model year. If you can sweep up a relatively cheap x51, you'll be happy.
we all should realize at this point that cars with heavily checked options sheets don't necessarily return anything near retail when selling over the "suggested value".
to each his own- I track the crap out of my cars and don't plan on selling them at all. some people lease, some people drive concours quality garage queens. it's all good! at least by driving a porsche you're proving to have better taste than the goofball viper guys
07-04-2008, 12:06 PM
#50
Three Wheelin'
bottom line is- if you can get an x51 coupe for a marginally increased price over standard, it's a great "option". The 997 x51 would be a great daily driver, especially given the extra road clearance it's got over the gt3. given the current release of DI and PDK in the facelift, it might not be a great idea to order the current 997 as is in any configuration, better to wait for the next model year. If you can sweep up a relatively cheap x51, you'll be happy.
we all should realize at this point that cars with heavily checked options sheets don't necessarily return anything near retail when selling over the "suggested value".
to each his own- I track the crap out of my cars and don't plan on selling them at all. some people lease, some people drive concours quality garage queens. it's all good! at least by driving a porsche you're proving to have better taste than the goofball viper guys
I agree with the assessment of the new car versus X51. There is much more to the new car than just the added horsepower that makes me want to make the change once the car has been out for a year and prices have moderated.
BTW-love the RS.
07-04-2008, 05:31 PM
#52
Video means nothing... measuring time to distance with instrumentation is what it's all about... the X-51 out accelerated the 420 HP Audi V8... case closed...
and why would X51 overcome driver skill? I got to the track and see 944 turbos with excellent drivers beating the snot out of guys with 997's..!! it wouldn't overcome driver skill.. its meant to be used by a *skilled* driver...
Road and Track March 2005 - Carrera S did the 1/4 in
12.3 sec @ 114.8 mph... your are correct that it is in turbo territory... and the X-51 option gets you to 125 mph in 1 second quicker!... do not go extrapolating 1/4 mile times on this statement either...
secondly... your ring time of 7:50 is one with PDK vs the time of a Carrera S.... I don't think we have a ring time of an option x51 Carrera S... in any case its irrelevant cause the cars are different... different brakes... different tranny... possibly even different gear ratios... but I don't know that for sure... we'll see..
the X-51 is not overstated... go drive one... observe the bottom end torque and the smoothness beyond 5000 rpm... you just have more punch and drivability...
an X-51 Carrera S is a ROCKET SLED and on the track it *is* a match for a 996 turbo... the turbo is a pig in the corners and is heavy... tough deficit to overcome at the racetrack...
I'd really like to see the torque and hp graphs from the new 385 hp Carrera S motor to put and end to this debate.
and why would X51 overcome driver skill? I got to the track and see 944 turbos with excellent drivers beating the snot out of guys with 997's..!! it wouldn't overcome driver skill.. its meant to be used by a *skilled* driver...
Road and Track March 2005 - Carrera S did the 1/4 in
12.3 sec @ 114.8 mph... your are correct that it is in turbo territory... and the X-51 option gets you to 125 mph in 1 second quicker!... do not go extrapolating 1/4 mile times on this statement either...
secondly... your ring time of 7:50 is one with PDK vs the time of a Carrera S.... I don't think we have a ring time of an option x51 Carrera S... in any case its irrelevant cause the cars are different... different brakes... different tranny... possibly even different gear ratios... but I don't know that for sure... we'll see..
the X-51 is not overstated... go drive one... observe the bottom end torque and the smoothness beyond 5000 rpm... you just have more punch and drivability...
an X-51 Carrera S is a ROCKET SLED and on the track it *is* a match for a 996 turbo... the turbo is a pig in the corners and is heavy... tough deficit to overcome at the racetrack...
I'd really like to see the torque and hp graphs from the new 385 hp Carrera S motor to put and end to this debate.
Do you really think the new car is going to be slower than the X51? Porsche just gave it higher hp and torque ratings to trick us? They also gave lower numbers when using PDK just to spur internet debate? The gear ratios for PDK were released, pretty much identical with 7th gear being for fuel mileage.
I may even be interested in X51 in the facelift once it becomes available. That does not mean I actually believe it makes the car into a GT3 equivelant or a rocket sled. I also won't be so naive as to think greater power gains are not avaible in the aftermarket. It is an overpriced factory option that delivers slightly more bang, nothing more.
07-04-2008, 07:32 PM
#53
Three Wheelin'
Not that many X51's out there if you check ebay, autotrader or cars.com. The only thing more rare than the X51 is somebody who owns it who thinks it was a bad idea. There seems to be more conviction about the X51 than there is experience with it. I bought mine used and was glad to get it. It is a blast to drive every day. I would have felt the same way about the new one but would have been more out of pocket.
07-06-2008, 01:53 AM
#55
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I think this means we agree. I'd get it in a heartbeat for a relatively cheap (reasonable) price.
I agree with the assessment of the new car versus X51. There is much more to the new car than just the added horsepower that makes me want to make the change once the car has been out for a year and prices have moderated.
BTW-love the RS.
I agree with the assessment of the new car versus X51. There is much more to the new car than just the added horsepower that makes me want to make the change once the car has been out for a year and prices have moderated.
BTW-love the RS.
a used x51 997 with some suspension work is a great road/DE car.
I personally have little price targets in my head for various specific models and various brands which I'm interested in (F360 challenge stradale, CLK black series, 997 club coupe, 964 Turbo 3.6, Carrera GT, acura NSX, VW R32, etc)...mostly because I think at some point I'd like to do PCA racing, or other club racing and wouldn't mind having a few different cars to run whatever everyone else is running. sooner or later spec 997 will be en vouge, as maybe spec CLK black series will also. this is obviously 5-10 years away, but sooner or later it will happen.
07-06-2008, 01:28 PM
#56
Three Wheelin'
Ah, the infamous 12.3 road and track time. I assume you get road and track? Check the back and see what time they use now for the carrera S in the performance index. They threw that ridiculous time out as no one has ever matched it again.
Do you really think the new car is going to be slower than the X51? Porsche just gave it higher hp and torque ratings to trick us? They also gave lower numbers when using PDK just to spur internet debate? The gear ratios for PDK were released, pretty much identical with 7th gear being for fuel mileage.
I may even be interested in X51 in the facelift once it becomes available. That does not mean I actually believe it makes the car into a GT3 equivelant or a rocket sled. I also won't be so naive as to think greater power gains are not avaible in the aftermarket. It is an overpriced factory option that delivers slightly more bang, nothing more.
Do you really think the new car is going to be slower than the X51? Porsche just gave it higher hp and torque ratings to trick us? They also gave lower numbers when using PDK just to spur internet debate? The gear ratios for PDK were released, pretty much identical with 7th gear being for fuel mileage.
I may even be interested in X51 in the facelift once it becomes available. That does not mean I actually believe it makes the car into a GT3 equivelant or a rocket sled. I also won't be so naive as to think greater power gains are not avaible in the aftermarket. It is an overpriced factory option that delivers slightly more bang, nothing more.
... 9 SECONDS !!!
its all about break in.... the "12.3" car was probably well broken in "who knows"... and I know from the PCA group that the X-51 cars get really fast after some mileage has accumulated... is 12.3 doable... it was printed in C&D !! maybe that' why they put launch control on the new 09's... so people can actually play around with 1/4 mile type scenarios... (although that defeats the purpose of the car if you ask me...)
I really can't say that the new 09 S will or will not be faster than than an 08-X51 S... that remains to be seen.... when they publish their torque & hp figures you can sit down and study them.
