Oil Usage Technical Bulletin
02-02-2011, 07:00 PM
#61
Race Director
I guess thats my point. In the US, we don't have a floor like that in the 997.2 (2009). We have no space for a first aid kit (since its not mandated since it incurs liability and lawsuits in our society), and hence no space.
I'm wondering if the frunk floor could be modded to have that space... thats my point I guess... why doesn't Porsche provide a standard slot in there for two one-quart bottles of oil? I could find a place to shoe-horn a quart in.. but if the cars are burning that much, why isn't there a designated space for it?
(one could of course, argue thats why the make the oil reservoir/pan/system big enough to have the ability to fill and run down as far as it can before more is needed... but still, when you get warning you need to then be able to 'add some' and then begin to 'look for more' to replenish your stock. If you don't have a spare bottle, you would be driving with low oil who knows how long .. unless the idea is you should look for some once the indicator blinks.. but you don't see that unless you check it ... which you won't while driving!)
Here is what my 2009 frunk floor looks like: (note: no extra space for squat)
Do we need to replace the frunk floor insert with a european one as well?
I'm wondering if the frunk floor could be modded to have that space... thats my point I guess... why doesn't Porsche provide a standard slot in there for two one-quart bottles of oil? I could find a place to shoe-horn a quart in.. but if the cars are burning that much, why isn't there a designated space for it?
(one could of course, argue thats why the make the oil reservoir/pan/system big enough to have the ability to fill and run down as far as it can before more is needed... but still, when you get warning you need to then be able to 'add some' and then begin to 'look for more' to replenish your stock. If you don't have a spare bottle, you would be driving with low oil who knows how long .. unless the idea is you should look for some once the indicator blinks.. but you don't see that unless you check it ... which you won't while driving!)
Here is what my 2009 frunk floor looks like: (note: no extra space for squat)
Do we need to replace the frunk floor insert with a european one as well?
Is your car a C4? It looks like the frunk configuration is different and you don't have the same space as is available in the C2. I think we're seeing the differences between a C2 and C4, not US and Euro spec.
02-02-2011, 07:27 PM
#63
Race Director
02-03-2011, 05:58 PM
#64
Drifting
Minok, I think we've got our wires crossed here. The pics I posted above are of my US spec 2009 C2S. The tool compartment is part of the back wall of the frunk, not the floor. You release the two black twist locks and it folds down to reveal the tools. The reason that I have a first aid kit is that my car was a factory tourist delivery, and since all drivers in Europe are required to have one it was included with the car.
Is your car a C4? It looks like the frunk configuration is different and you don't have the same space as is available in the C2. I think we're seeing the differences between a C2 and C4, not US and Euro spec.
Is your car a C4? It looks like the frunk configuration is different and you don't have the same space as is available in the C2. I think we're seeing the differences between a C2 and C4, not US and Euro spec.
For the 4 car (mine is actually a Targa 4, but that doesn't change the FRUNK).. there is no back side flap to fold down. I wonder what the euro delivery C4 cars look like, ie, where the emergency first aid kit goes in those cars.
02-03-2011, 06:34 PM
#65
Nordschleife Master
So... Where are the tools stored in a C4?
02-03-2011, 06:55 PM
#66
Race Director
02-04-2011, 09:22 PM
#67
Drifting
The pump is that trapazoidal thing in the middle of the C4 photo floor. The upper right has the wheel lug special insert and a long black plastic case with some tool-related stuff in it (tow hook I think and some other stuff.. I'll check this evening whats all in there and report back). The goop, that is in a special door I think. I'll do a better inventory of whats where and post a new pick.
02-06-2011, 10:13 PM
#68
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I would ask Porsche one question: "Why is this degree of oil consumption NECESSARY in your high performance engine?" If it is necessary, Porsche should tell us the reason. If it's not, then the true reason is likely bad engineering or loose quality control. 1.6 quarts per 622 miles is excessive from anyone's point of view. I have owned a Corvette and a couple of Nissan Z's and other ordinary cars that consume almost no oil. Let's not pretend that this quirk is acceptable in a car selling near and above $100k.
02-06-2011, 10:29 PM
#69
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From memory my 1985 3.2, 993, 996 and 997 all had the same maximum oil consumption spec.
Only the 993 (worn valve guides and leaks later in life) and now 997.2 (from new) use oil.
Porsche considers this acceptable, saves them alot of after sales service costs also
They don't seem to relate oil consumption to proper "break in"
Only the 993 (worn valve guides and leaks later in life) and now 997.2 (from new) use oil.
Porsche considers this acceptable, saves them alot of after sales service costs also
They don't seem to relate oil consumption to proper "break in"
02-07-2011, 01:20 AM
#70
Drifting
I don't think price is correlated to oil consumption. Look at other high performance vehicles.. they can consume things like fluids and lubricants at very high rates. Heck, the SR71 leaks like a sieve for much of the altitudes through which it flies and its not exactly cheap junk.
02-09-2011, 05:13 PM
#71
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I am at the point (after 7,000 miles) that my 997-2 S is probably going to continue to drink a quart every 600-700 miles, no matter how it is driven. None of my other 911's (six) from 1989 through 2004 ever consumed ANYTHING near that- some at maybe 3-4,000, some virtually none.
Based on this email train, plus anecdotal evidence, it certainly does seem to be an issue with the new engine (which is a complete redesign), as great an engine as it is otherwise is. I speculate it may have something to do with the DFI (also have an Audi with DFI and it also drinks oil), or perhaps the Vario Cam...
I can afford the oil, but it does bug me!
Based on this email train, plus anecdotal evidence, it certainly does seem to be an issue with the new engine (which is a complete redesign), as great an engine as it is otherwise is. I speculate it may have something to do with the DFI (also have an Audi with DFI and it also drinks oil), or perhaps the Vario Cam...
I can afford the oil, but it does bug me!
02-09-2011, 05:46 PM
#72
Poseur
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Thread Starter
I'm convinced that Porsche has no idea why this is happening. If they knew they would be working to solve the problem. If you do a search within Rennlist we took a poll of oil consumption (997.1) and the results were incredible. WAY more oil is being consumed than the norm. If you bought a Honda that required a quart every 600-1000 miles you would simply return it. Porsche's arrogance going to spell their doom.
02-09-2011, 06:11 PM
#73
Nordschleife Master
...
Based on this email train, plus anecdotal evidence, it certainly does seem to be an issue with the new engine (which is a complete redesign), as great an engine as it is otherwise is. I speculate it may have something to do with the DFI (also have an Audi with DFI and it also drinks oil), or perhaps the Vario Cam...
Based on this email train, plus anecdotal evidence, it certainly does seem to be an issue with the new engine (which is a complete redesign), as great an engine as it is otherwise is. I speculate it may have something to do with the DFI (also have an Audi with DFI and it also drinks oil), or perhaps the Vario Cam...
02-09-2011, 06:26 PM
#74
Race Director
Correct this is not a DFI isse cause oil burning. We all see this as a problem but Porsche DOES NOT see this as a problem. My 09 has 18k miles on it now...a lots of hard track days. Oil buring as gotten better but it still burns more than want I'd consider normal. I really stopped keeping exact track but I go through a quart it seems around every 1700 miles with no track use. 1 track day is 150 miles on the track as a norm and I can use at least 1/2 a quart at a track day.
02-09-2011, 06:40 PM
#75
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I bought a new 2009 C2S Cab in November of 2009. Used a quart of oil every 500 miles. Took it to the dealeship where I bought the car and was told that since the owners manual says on page 288 that 1.6 quarts every 622 miles is acceptable usage, nothing could be done. I spoke to Porsche North America saying that no new car in this day and age should consume oil at that pace and they essentially told me to go get screwed. So after 4 months of ownership i dumped the Poreche and purchased another Corvette. a 2010 Grand Sport Convertible (my 10th Vette). So far, almost 11 months and 16,000 miles later, I have never had to add a drop of oil, and i change oil every 5000 miles. (cost $80.00 for a complete service). I must have been on drugs when I bought the Porsche. NEVER AGAIN!