gota911

So would a big dose of humility.

Soulteacher

"Every complex question has a simple answer. And it is always false." Do we even remember the previous two times? Do we remember what went on? Do the names 'Black/Terra' and 'MMD' ring a bell? I remember how Ben stood up for the rest of this forum against these two complete idiots, both of whom were eventually excluded for life. Remember Ben's second "ban"? The other party was banned for life and Ben's ban was immediately lifted by John D. who saw what had happened. We need to quit drawing conclusions if we don't know/remember what went on... that's exactly what happened in the OT when Rennlisters who arrived late drew their own flawed conclusions. Maybe it's because I'm a trained scientist, but drawing conclusions without having all my facts in a row is annoying.

What would help all of us (including me, including Ben, including y'all) is to accept that participating in Rennlist is just like buying orange juice or getting married; different people do it for different reasons, and for different reasons at different times:

- there is the person who is here to seek information... that person, of course, would be annoyed having to dig through 250 search results threads of which 249 answer the same (situationally irrelevant) question.

- there is the person who uses this as a social exchange channel... of course that person could not care less about encountering the same identical question for the 100th time.

- there is the person who uses this forum to let off some frustration and anger... that person will pick fights and provoke easy targets (OCBen is an easy target, as even this very thread shows).

- there is the person who builds their esteem/status by participating in this forum (either by being supportive ["a respected member"] or by bragging and lying and pretending and smart-assing).

There are probably a few more motivations why people come here, but simply accepting that we do have different needs to satisfy is the first step to keep this a warfree zone. Of course it's tough when you get provoked by members of the third group... and this has happened to me before more than once. That's why I'm almost exclusively staying in this 997 forum because for most of the time, this is an extremely smart and civilized and helpful and friendly crowd. And that includes even those people with whom I disagree on the subject matter. Which also means, let's hope that "OCBan" will soon be "OCBen" again... and let's not post cheap shots in the meantime.

points

Right on soulteacher.

uzj100

Good points you've made, though I would like to offer some comments on the one item quoted above.

Sometimes very useful, helpful and pertinent information may be contained in a thread with a less than obvious title. Example: let's use Ben's excellent and very thorough posting on oil changes and his contributions regarding oil usage and the inherent inaccuracy of our electronic readout for oil level. An "appropriate" question from someone who didn't know anything about the gauge readout variance, might fill with a half quart if the gauge showed 1 bar low and upon checking might see that he/she had actually overfilled--at least per the gauge readout. Searching for "oil gauge readout" might not give the answer.

Another example, I recall John (Leader's) questions about black wheels. Ironically, Lori had just posted up pics of her new "S" with the exact mod that John was looking for. A search on just "black wheels" might not have led him to something so specific. My point is don't assume that just because you know the answer to a question that a new or even "veteran" user does. What's the harm in taking a second or two to post a link that you think answers the question and suggest a search for related links?

Ben's posts are for the most part more than informative and useful. Without benefit of actually talking with him--or anyone else for that matter--in person, inflection or innuendo is difficult to assess via this forum. Easiest solution if someone irritates you is to state your position, agree to disagree, put the other person on "ignore" and move on if it's really bothersome or offensive to you.

Maybe invoke the "golden rule" a bit. Treat others as you would like to be treated. Each one of us was "new" here or on another board at one time.

Rivan

I think If Ben got ban permanently will be a sad thing for the 997 board. After all it is his DIY oil change thread taught a newbie like me how to do my first oil change. He just doesn't seen like a unreasonable individual to me.

uzj100

The fact that we have now 36 posts and 3 pages about the "ban" is pretty conclusive evidence of his value to this board and its members

Soulteacher

Hey, we may even beat the "Where is Coochas" thread! https://rennlist.com/forums/997-forum/269417-coochas-on-sabbatical.html

Coochas

While he is controversial, Ben has done a tremendous amount of good in the 997 forum.
We both joined around the same time and he was always extremely helpful to me in my search for the perfect p-car. He also became a good friend in the process.
I have no doubt that he'll be back.

Coochas

I remember that thread Wolfgang! I had gone on vacation and people thought I died or something. LOL.

9974G

I'm really scared

uzj100

+1, Dave.

DJ23

Hey, it was OCBEN who showed me how to do my avatar. The man has great knowledge and I miss his commentary. It's members like him that keep this board interesting.

Jay

adfsouth

I think Ben is both an asset and liability to this Board. If he does come back, I hope we get the Ben who adds value to others and not the cyber-bully. Everyone is a noob at some point...no need to be condescending or rude to them unless they disrespect the board. In any event, I think it would be a good thing if he came back with a bit more patience and understanding for others.

mglobe

+1

MichaelL

I have been participating in this forum for over 2 years and have read/agreed with/been upset by/ been skewered by OCBen's posts. He has much good to say, but is often lacking in diplomacy and is unduly aggressive to other posters. Although undeniably intelligent and well educated, he appears to have little ability to improve his negative attitudes and argumentative manner. I wish him luck and hope that this unfortunate mindset does not plague him in his other life.