Larry Harris

Just got home from having my base 997 lowered with Eibachs and having calipers painted. Car is about 1.5 inches lower and ride is just a little stiffer than stock, and the car hasn't settled yet.
The alignment guy said the factory alignment was way off ....2.5 positive on one side and .5 degree negative on the other.
Several other members have commented in the past about inconsistent alighments from the factory.
Just passing the info along.

Doc

Sean F

Hey Larry

How much did the Eibachs cost you?

Larry Harris

H&Rs and Eibachs are about $349.00, plus install+alignment.

nkhalidi

Did your alignment guy find it off before or after he installed the new springs? Installing springs changes alignment. The difference between the two sides is DRASTIC. I mean, positive camber is unheard of in today's sports cars. I can't believe the factory would make such a crazy error or oversight.

rebe1

Any pix of the calipers painted? Was thinking of doing mine. How much did that cost?

PDQ PDK CAYMAN S

FYI again. Porsche will pay an alignment with in the first 2,000 miles.

MJones

A car with those alignment specs would never go down the road straight.
Proably as received after the spring change..

Ah pray-tell what color did you choose to paint your calipers...red, yellow, or blue and why?

Bill - Chicago

Camber does not effect the cars ability to go straight, toe effects that.

nkhalidi

That's an incomplete statement. Camber affects toe. In other words, after installing new springs and reducing ride height, one achieves more negative camber and more toe-out. These changes, all together, affect the car's ability to go straight.

Or, if a car has camber plates and one shifts the plates to achieve more negative camber, one also receives more toe-out. All this happens without changing ride height, thereby taking ride height out of the picture, and emphasizing the fact that camber changes affect toe.

Cogito

So does this mean the dealer does NOT check the alignment on new P cars when they arrive from the boat? I gues they could be asked to?

1080iAddict

nkhalidi (or anyone), can you explain what camber is and what negative and positive camber is?

MJones

Camber is the tilt of the tire as viewed from the front of the car. If the top of the tires lean toward the center of the car then you have negative camber.
If the top of the tire tilts out away from the center of the car then you have positive camber

nkhalidi

MJones is right. Here's a helpful link with diagrams as well: http://www.familycar.com/alignment.htm

The website doesn't mention specifics - as well it should not - and 911s in particular have different alignment needs compared to other sports cars. I can't comment on specifics for 911s - I'm new to this game, just coming out of my front-engine rear-drive M3 - and I'm trying to glean as much alignment knowledge as possible about the car from the Racing/DE guys.

In general, more negative camber allows for more of the tire to contact the ground during turns, allowing for more grip. Like all things, there's an upper limit to the amount of 'goodness' one can have with camber. If there's too much camber, for example, less of the tire contacts the ground while going straight, which would lead to uneven tire wear, more wheelspin on acceleration, and longer braking distances. The key is finding the right amount of camber for your particular application (street, track, etc.). This is why there is rarely a one-size-fits-all alignment setting for drivers of sporting cars.

Positive camber never, ever happens on any automobile with remotely 'sporting' characteristics. This includes your Dodge Caravan Sport.

Bill - Chicago

nkhalidi yes if you change camber it affects toe in most cases, as well as ride height and corner weights to a lesser degree. On a 996 cup car you can use shim to change the camber and according the manual it will not effect the toe. I have not tried it myself.

The original post was about a car with of spec camber. njones posted that the car would not drive straight down the road. My point was you can have camber off and toe in spec and the car will drive straight (i.e. not pull to one side or the other). That could be a reason for having this type of alignment on a car and noticing it right away.

Larry Harris

Only know what the tech told me. He said it was before the spring install and he was very surprised at how bad it was. Car ran perfectly straight but was a little darty. Red calipers.