Carreralicious

Thought this was interesting:

https:/synlubepros.com/blog/posts/tips/moly-in-engine-oil

ADias

Some of us have been doing that for many years. Amsoil and others would never vet a competitor additive, but that does not make that additive bad. MoS2 is inert chemically and its purpose is to act as a solid lubricant adhering to moving parts and reducing friction when those parts are cold.

Carreralicious

I know, that article says not to do it though, as they’re stating that version of Moly (the MoS2) while a good friction modifier, is suited better for grease applications rather than engine oil, while the other version that is used in engine oil as one of their additives, Molybdenum Dialkyldithiocarbamate (MoDTC) is better suited for engine oil because it is oil soluble.

Bruce In Philly

2009 C2S 180K miles

Ok, buckle up... here we go! OIL!!!

I use MOS2 and Ceretec... usually alternating. Why? I dunno, but it does entertain me.

Two data points (no, I don't think they are authoritative or...whatever):

1 - My engineer friend at Ford... I called him and asked about MOS2. I totally expected him to say "snake oil" as he usually notes Ford engineers thought it all through and designed... blah blah blah (no, I am not insulting him, it is just he goes on and on). But instead, he noted it appears to extend engine life noting some of Ford's law enforcement customers use it and say it works... loweres cost and extends life. Hmmmm......
2 - I corresponded with LiquiMoly... and noted I use their A40 Leichtlauf 5W 40 and they recommend alternating between their MOS2 and Ceretic additives with their and other maker's oil. Why? I dunno.

Hmmmm.......

My points regarding the article... (hey I am an eggspert.. yea, no kiddin')

1 - Falling out of suspension: So what? The turbulence, swirl and mixing that goes on in that oil including the sump is amazing. That oil is under high flow flow in and out of that sump... anything like super-fine particulates like MOS2 as little chance of turning into a sludge in your oil pan.
2 - Regarding "taking into account the final formulation": Of course this is true. That is why makers like Porsche have a specification for their engines, A40. So, any A40 oil is good and does not require an additive. True? I surely think so. So why do I pour in an additive? I dunno.
3 - ZDDP (Zinc) can lessen the life of catalytic converters. How it works or how good it is, for me, is irrelevant given this problem.
4 - Hey! What's that noise?... crap.... gotta go take something apart again. What? Oh... another voice in my head.

Question: For those who removed the sump pan.... any sludge in there? Anything stuck to the pan?

BTW, I have a little experiment going on in my garage. I have a Gatorade bottle (clear) of spent oil from my last oil change sitting on my garage window sill. I am waiting to see any evidence of settling of particulates. None yet after about two months.

Peace
Bruce in Philly (now Atlanta)

ADias

Nonsense. I do not want an oil soluble moly. I want moly in the solid lubricant phase.

Carreralicious

LOL. Good to hear your thoughts Bruce. I think there’s good points on either side and of course, your car, you do what you like to it. I am not convinced adding the solid MoS2 gives any benefit over choosing a good complete oil, even if that means choosing a good non A40 approved oil like DT40. I’d rather use an oil that contains everything expertly mixed in already vs me having to add in my own mixture of extra stuff, and I’m not keen to the idea of adding in any solid lubricant to an engine. A grease application, maybe. Why I found that article interesting is because he claims the MoS2 can be detrimental to the engine. I have doubt it helps, but didn’t think it hurt.

I have read somewhere here where someone did open their oil pan and see the MoS2 sitting at the bottom of the pan, but that it wasn’t sludge. Would it harm or help the engine over the long haul? Who knows? You remember MarcW from the Boxster forum Bruce?…and how he got over 250k miles on his 986 on just Mobil 1 0W-40 oil changes? Would he have gotten more with a can of MoS2 each change? Maybe. Maybe not. Bottom line, I think any A40 oil and you’re good to go. If the engine is gonna go south, it’ll do so even if a can of MoS2 is dumped in IMO.

Bruce In Philly

Yea, Marc got a ton of miles on his Boxster using standard maintenance. He also recommended not doing preventative maintenance IIRC. I never used an additive in my Boxster (same vintage) and had two engines blow. So gee, what can we conclude? The only thing I am sure of (well sort of anyway), is more frequent oil changes are better than factory spec at 10K. I do 5K. Why? Because I am one of those wacky folks who hear a difference in the sounds from my engine when I did 10K oil changes and none at 5K. Yea, I know I have many voices living in my head but none of these voices sound like an engine.

Peace
Bruce in Philly (now Atlanta)

Carreralicious

When I got my Boxster back in 2002, I followed the manual which recommended an oil change every 15K miles or every 2 yrs until Porsche changed that to 10K miles and then I followed that. LOL. I still had the car for 17 yrs and never had any engine problems and a friend owns it now and it’s still running great. Only used Mobil 1 0W-40 and no additives. I’d think your two blown engines would have blown even if you added Ceratec or MoS2 but that’s just me. I mean, why add anything solid (even if a lubricant) to an engine that is supposed to have liquid in it? Maybe, they might have blown earlier. 😆

ADias

I do not want to prolong this, but... Do you have any clue about the application and benefits of a solid lubricant? If you did you would not disparage against its uses. You may think it's not necessary and that is fine, but there are reasons to have moving parts coated with lubricant when they first move cold especially in cars that are not driven much...

Have you ever lubed the axles of Pinewood Derby cars with graphite? Yours when you were a youngster or your kids'?

997.1C2S

First time user of ceratec in my last oil change. Under load at mid-high rpms the engine sounds and feels noticeably smoother. 17+yrs in the auto industry and like to think I have somewhat of a trained ear, HA!

Like Bruce I plan to alternate ceratec and Mos2 on my C2S 997.1.

Carreralicious

I don’t think there is no benefit to a solid lubricant. As what the article stated, MoS2 used to be used in engine oils before but the oil soluble version is used these days because they don’t fall out of suspension.

As for the pinewood derby car reference, I would equate that example to using the solid lubricant as a grease application. 😁

Either way, we will not agree so no point prolonging like you say. My post you quoted was me having fun joking with Bruce whom I’ve known since we were both on an old Boxster forum so the jab was not directed at you.

Wayne Smith

On about my 23rd oil change (5K mile interval) I added MoS2. I noticed it ran quieter and smoother. That was with a lifetime of Mobil 0-40. A few changes later I changed to LiquiMoly 5-40 figuring we haven't gotten our normal cold (35F) winters the last few years (move the 0 to 5). No noticeable difference in the oil. Still sticking with the additive.

Sporty

All this is nice and anecdotal. Need to see side by side UOA's to really(?) prove anything. I for one have switched from Motul xcess because my metal numbers have been consistently higher than I like, although have not burned any oil in my 3500-4500 mile OCIs and runs perfectly. I added Ceratec at my next to last oil change with the Motul, ( no notable improvement in my numbers per my UOA) and about 2k miles ago I switched to DT40. My engine does/seems to run smoother and quieter and has has also not burned any oil in the 2k miles since last change - Ceratec or combo of that and DT40? On my next oil change in about 1500-2k more miles I will see what my UOA says, i.e. if any improvement in my wear metals.

Petza914

DT40 has more Moly in it's formulation than in adding Ceratec so don't add that into your DT40 oil changes - not needed at all. Post your UOA reports after the next change so we can see the 3 oils compared in the same engine. I bet your upcoming report will be the best of the 3 unless you've suffered engine wear that's now getting worse and the one after that will be even better, especially the iron and copper numbers

BmacIL

Two options to goodness: buy a good, approved-spec oil and add some MoS2, or buy DT40. I've so far been doing the former but will probably try DT40 for the next couple changes.