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@Floyd540 thank you for reply! At least I'm for confirming that I'm not crazy!
I might've forgot to mention the small washer first, but you can see it in the pics - it's there.
The issue I have that even BEFORE assembly, the strut shaft ( with the spring OFF and no mount no bearing - everything removed ) would resist pretty hard to any spin I tried. Comparing to the OEM that I removed - that was fairly loose and I was able to spin it with my fingers, while the new one from the B12 kit was hard to spin/rotate even with a 8-inch allen key inserted.
When I sent this video to Bilstein support showing how (hard) the mount is rotating with the shaft around the strut body they freaked out & said that the shaft should never turn and that I'm damaging it by doing so 🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️ OR my English is so bad that I dont understand what they're saying
This is what they responded:
It does not appear your strut mount has a spot for the spring to clock in at the top. Therefore, when you turn the strut mount out of the car like that, it is turning the piston internally but when attached to the vehicle, the mount remains stationary and the bearing in the center under the strut nut is what allows the entire assembly to pivot back and forth without the piston turning inside the body of the damper. If the spring did turn on the mount this would degrade the mounting hardware extremely quickly. Turning the piston inside the damper as you are doing in the video can lead to internal damage and potential failure of the nut retaining the piston to the rod. Please see an example of the bearing I am referring to below. At this point we will not be able to be of further assistance over email and strongly recommend taking the vehicle to your nearest Porsche dealer for further analysis of the steering issue you are having. Thank you.
And finally here's my car - love the looks! But the stiff steering freaks me out, like the wheel doesn't return to center when exiting a corner.
Hey guys, I read through this thread and had a few questions given I'm considering moving to B8s in the not too distant future.
I have spent way too much time on past cars obsessing over details of bumpstops. Hacking them down, buying different ones, etc. All to try to find the right mix with lowering springs (in most cases).
My core question is (and then I'll explain why): Are we SURE that we aren't supposed to use the Porsche bumpstop when using Bilstein B4, B6, B8? I hear evidence that B6 and B8 have a "built in bumpstop". My gut on this is that this is to prevent damage to the shock from bottoming -- NOT as an integrated part of the spring-rate & suspension.
The bumpstops these days are engineered as part of the spring rate. Gone are the old days where they were a rubber bumper to stop metal on metal contact. The suspension counts on them coming into play at a certain point in the stroke and ramping the spring rate gradually so the car remains predictable AND avoids "bottoming out".
Is the issue that the bumpstops won't fit? Or that something in the bilstein schematic doesn't call for them? I've found their instructions to be cryptic in the past. My plan was to go B8 as a replacement shock on my SPASM car and reuse the spring & bumpstop that's on the car now...
Given the other threads regarding the issues w/the "rattling cup washer" and the "strut top that won't turn without force", I wonder if we've got this bumpstop thing wrong...?
Hey guys, I read through this thread and had a few questions given I'm considering moving to B8s in the not too distant future.
I have spent way too much time on past cars obsessing over details of bumpstops. Hacking them down, buying different ones, etc. All to try to find the right mix with lowering springs (in most cases).
My core question is (and then I'll explain why): Are we SURE that we aren't supposed to use the Porsche bumpstop when using Bilstein B4, B6, B8? I hear evidence that B6 and B8 have a "built in bumpstop". My gut on this is that this is to prevent damage to the shock from bottoming -- NOT as an integrated part of the spring-rate & suspension.
The bumpstops these days are engineered as part of the spring rate. Gone are the old days where they were a rubber bumper to stop metal on metal contact. The suspension counts on them coming into play at a certain point in the stroke and ramping the spring rate gradually so the car remains predictable AND avoids "bottoming out".
Is the issue that the bumpstops won't fit? Or that something in the bilstein schematic doesn't call for them? I've found their instructions to be cryptic in the past. My plan was to go B8 as a replacement shock on my SPASM car and reuse the spring & bumpstop that's on the car now...
Given the other threads regarding the issues w/the "rattling cup washer" and the "strut top that won't turn without force", I wonder if we've got this bumpstop thing wrong...?
Hi @stiles_s , the answer is in this video: the bumpstop is inside the B6/B8 front strut.
Hi @stiles_s , the answer is in this video: the bumpstop is inside the B6/B8 front strut.
Learned something new today. That's fascinating and also helps me understand another related thread talking about modifying the bumpstop and packing for B6 and B8 Bilsteins. Not sure if you noticed in the video but he had a modified bumpstop-- likely because he was running a shorter spring causing him to be "in the bumpstop" too early. Makes me wonder whether B6 or B8 would be better replacement struts for my SPASM car given it's lower than standard and the B6 is engineered for stock ride height IIRC. Thanks for the pointer!
Learned something new today. That's fascinating and also helps me understand another related thread talking about modifying the bumpstop and packing for B6 and B8 Bilsteins. Not sure if you noticed in the video but he had a modified bumpstop-- likely because he was running a shorter spring causing him to be "in the bumpstop" too early. Makes me wonder whether B6 or B8 would be better replacement struts for my SPASM car given it's lower than standard and the B6 is engineered for stock ride height IIRC. Thanks for the pointer!
B6 is for stock ride height, B8 is for use with lowering springs
B6 is for stock ride height, B8 is for use with lowering springs
Right, but which one is SPASM? It's (if I'm remembering correctly) 20 or 30mm lower than OE height. Lowering springs?
I find looking at the Bilstein UK site to be illuminating. They list the B8 for 997s with "sport suspension" (which I think SPASM would qualify as) and also have a B8 for non-PASM sport suspension which is what I think I'm going to try when the time comes (disabling PASM). Passenger car (carparts-cat.com)
Right, but which one is SPASM? It's (if I'm remembering correctly) 20 or 30mm lower than OE height. Lowering springs?
I find looking at the Bilstein UK site to be illuminating. They list the B8 for 997s with "sport suspension" (which I think SPASM would qualify as) and also have a B8 for non-PASM sport suspension which is what I think I'm going to try when the time comes (disabling PASM). Passenger car (carparts-cat.com)
AFAIK B6/B8 are the same stiffness but different height. Although I might be wrong
@EMC2 Would installing the front stock bump stops makes the front ride higher? Installed B6 with Eibach springs (previously was stock absorbers with Eibach) and now the front fender gap is noticeably more, boo. Not sure if the workshop followed Bilstein's instructions
PS: regardless of bump stops' presence or not, should i have opted for B8, for a lower drop?
Take a look at the info in this post - hopefully it can help (the Bilstein guides I have for the B6's (also for B8) only advise using the foam bump stops on the rears) https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...l#post13968636
Ride height is set by the springs. Period. Bump stops and strut rod lengths only affect wheel travel. Too long of a strut may leave a spring dangling when jacking up the car. Too short and the strut will bottom out on compression.
Also the term "for lowering springs" means that the struts are for true lowering springs. Standard , sport and ROW are not considered "lowering:".
@EMC2 Would installing the front stock bump stops makes the front ride higher? Installed B6 with Eibach springs (previously was stock absorbers with Eibach) and now the front fender gap is noticeably more, boo. Not sure if the workshop followed Bilstein's instructions
PS: regardless of bump stops' presence or not, should i have opted for B8, for a lower drop?
While I won't say the B8's would have affected your drop.....*new* struts I have seen affect ride height. Blown struts with nothing left in them often allow suspension to "sag". New struts, fully charged can sometimes resist enough at rest to create a slightly higher ride height.
That said.....there is also a thread in this forum where someone had one part of the strut assembly installed incorrectly causing a "hangup" on the assembly not allowing the suspension to settle completely. (I just did a brief search but couldn't find it, but it's definitely in here somewhere). Anyway.....as soon as they got the part installed correctly the strut assembly was able to settle completely.....(I believe they found out having had one side higher than the other which made it obvious that something was wrong)
Ride height is set by the springs. Period. Bump stops and strut rod lengths only affect wheel travel. Too long of a strut may leave a spring dangling when jacking up the car. Too short and the strut will bottom out on compression.
Also the term "for lowering springs" means that the struts are for true lowering springs. Standard , sport and ROW are not considered "lowering:".
Thanks for the clear explanation. Appreciate it!
What will be the effects of the workshop mistakenly installing the stock bumpstops? Lessened range of travel?
Originally Posted by RandyVW
While I won't say the B8's would have affected your drop.....*new* struts I have seen affect ride height. Blown struts with nothing left in them often allow suspension to "sag". New struts, fully charged can sometimes resist enough at rest to create a slightly higher ride height.
That said.....there is also a thread in this forum where someone had one part of the strut assembly installed incorrectly causing a "hangup" on the assembly not allowing the suspension to settle completely. (I just did a brief search but couldn't find it, but it's definitely in here somewhere). Anyway.....as soon as they got the part installed correctly the strut assembly was able to settle completely.....(I believe they found out having had one side higher than the other which made it obvious that something was wrong)
Any pics of your setup before/after??
And any uneven heights side to side??
And did you do just the fronts in your case??
Changed to B6 all-round, don't think there's uneveness L vs R. Previously the vertical measurement of rim (at 12 o 'clock) to fender for right side were 8.8cm (front) and 9cm (rear). Now, they are 9.2cm and 9.7cm respectively.
Previous dampers were stock units and replaced at 96k miles recently.
I do realize that both pics are of different lighting conditions. Previously there was a nice rake towards the front for the car. Currently, there's an optical illusion of the front gap being greater than the rear, most probably due to the fenders' shadows.
Before After
Are there any members running B6 with Eibach, and don't mind sparing a minute to share their F&R rim-fender measurements? TIA.
04-19-2023, 07:53 PM
